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Is Pro tools 2019 better to handle virtual inst. than Pro tools 10?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #1
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Firechild's Avatar
Is Pro tools 2019 better to handle virtual inst. than Pro tools 10?

I am still om Pro Tool HD 10 but the performance with virtual instruments is a disaster compared to Logic Pro on the same computer.
For example EastWest PLAY engine and Arturia plugins.
Is there any difference with Pro Tools 2019?
I may get rid of my HD rig and go native with UA apollos but still Pro Tools as I love the audio engine.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #2
Pro Tools 10 was the last version as a 32 bit application. As a result, it can only access 4gig of ram at the most. Most heavy VI users used something like VSL VEPro to get around the limitations.

Moving to 2019 will make a world of difference in that regard. It is a 64 bit application, and will allow you to use a significantly larger amount of ram.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #3
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Firechild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Pro Tools 10 was the last version as a 32 bit application. As a result, it can only access 4gig of ram at the most. Most heavy VI users used something like VSL VEPro to get around the limitations.

Moving to 2019 will make a world of difference in that regard. It is a 64 bit application, and will allow you to use a significantly larger amount of ram.
It is not only about 32bit vs 64bit. I am running Logic Pro 9 as 32bit with very improved performance compared to Pro Tools 10 regarding virtual instruments.
Kontakt 4/5 , and PLAY engine are hosting the RAM outside (Memory server) Pro Tools so with them you can use as much RAM as your computer can hold even with 32bit Pro Tools. It is something with the playback-engine in Pro Tools that is really bad regarding Virtual Instruments but I hope they have improved that in later version.

Last edited by Firechild; 3 weeks ago at 07:56 AM..
Old 3 weeks ago
  #4
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
It is not only about 32bit vs 64bit. I am running Logic Pro 9 as 32bit with very improved performance compared to Pro Tools 10 regarding virtual instruments.
Kontakt 4/5 , and PLAY engine are hosting the RAM outside (Memory server) Pro Tools so with them you can use as much RAM as your computer can hold even with 32bit Pro Tools. It is something with the playback-engine in Pro Tools that is really bad regarding Virtual Instruments but I hope they have improved that in later version.
It is a gripe a lot of PT10 users had. Switching the available cores to half what your machine has can sometimes help. Logic Pro 9 is a 64 bit app with a 32 bit mode. Pro Tools 10 never had that luxury. It was built on the decade old Digidesign Audio Engine, and was more or less out of date before it was even released.

Pro Tools 2019 is a completely different experience. The audio engine for Pro Tools was rebuilt for PT11, then again for 2019 so it really bares no similarity to PT10 at all. Or even any 32 bit DAW application in general. It is far, far more capable. I'm pretty sure there is a demo version of 2019.5 that you can give a spin.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #5
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octatonic's Avatar
Yes but midi editing is pretty clunky compared to other DAW's.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
I am still om Pro Tool HD 10 but the performance with virtual instruments is a disaster compared to Logic Pro on the same computer.
For example EastWest PLAY engine and Arturia plugins.
Is there any difference with Pro Tools 2019?
I may get rid of my HD rig and go native with UA apollos but still Pro Tools as I love the audio engine.
Yes things improved when protools went 64 bit. I don't know how it compares to logic but the move to 64 helped.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #7
A million times better. You also gave freeze and offline bounce that speeds things up immensely.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #8
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Firechild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
A million times better. You also gave freeze and offline bounce that speeds things up immensely.
Very well. However I am a bit concerned regarding the price...can someone enlighten me...
I have two licenses of Pro Tools 10 HD and back in the days each full number HD software update was like $299 now it is more like $2999...whats happening?
Feel free to explain how it works? I mean a Full Logic Pro X version is $199 and free updates for life?
Old 3 weeks ago
  #9
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
Very well. However I am a bit concerned regarding the price...can someone enlighten me...
I have two licenses of Pro Tools 10 HD and back in the days each full number HD software update was like $299 now it is more like $2999...whats happening?
Feel free to explain how it works? I mean a Full Logic Pro X version is $199 and free updates for life?
No it’s not that much! You can check out the pricing on PTexpert.com (they do a good explanation). There’s different options - subscription, or having the update plan - can’t remember what I pay, it’s something like aus$600/yr. I have no issue with this, it’s my livelihood....but you may.

Logic is sold at a loss to sell macs. It’s not really a fair price comparison!
Old 3 weeks ago
  #10
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Firechild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
No it’s not that much! You can check out the pricing on PTexpert.com (they do a good explanation). There’s different options - subscription, or having the update plan - can’t remember what I pay, it’s something like aus$600/yr. I have no issue with this, it’s my livelihood....but you may.

Logic is sold at a loss to sell macs. It’s not really a fair price comparison!
Ok, fair enough, it seems to be around 999usd to be back in the game and then 600usd/year.

So, regarding MIDI. Can Pro Tools now handle multiple MIDI channels within the same MIDi track? Pro Tools 10 can not, meaning difficult to use MPE instruments...
This was a basic MIDI standard feature back in the 80s when merging tracks in to the same track but keeping the different MIDI channels (Roland MC50).
Old 3 weeks ago
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
Ok, fair enough, it seems to be around 999usd to be back in the game and then 600usd/year.

So, regarding MIDI. Can Pro Tools now handle multiple MIDI channels within the same MIDi track? Pro Tools 10 can not, meaning difficult to use MPE instruments...
This was a basic MIDI standard feature back in the 80s when merging tracks in to the same track but keeping the different MIDI channels (Roland MC50).
You can assign the same MIDI track to multiple MIDI channels (in 10 too), but AFAIK MIDI channel assignment data is not tied to note data beyond the track interface.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #12
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
Ok, fair enough, it seems to be around 999usd to be back in the game and then 600usd/year.

So, regarding MIDI. Can Pro Tools now handle multiple MIDI channels within the same MIDi track? Pro Tools 10 can not, meaning difficult to use MPE instruments...
This was a basic MIDI standard feature back in the 80s when merging tracks in to the same track but keeping the different MIDI channels (Roland MC50).
Erm..MPE instruments - not aware of that acronym!

I don't know why you'd want to merge midi parts to one track but keep separate midi channels.

You can have multiple midi tracks routing to one instrument - for example if you've got a Kontakt instrument, it can host 16 instruments, each on their own midi channel (or sharing midi channels for layers) and have their own outputs too.

You can route one midi track to multiple destinations.

The thing you can't do that annoys me is have a multiple midi takes with the own controller data - only the note data is unique. That limits me a bit with eg piano takes.
Old 3 weeks ago
  #13
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MPE. Roli uses that. It's a method of working around MIDI 1.0 limits.

https://mattartz.me/mpe-midi-controllers/
Old 3 weeks ago
  #14
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Firechild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Erm..MPE instruments - not aware of that acronym!

I don't know why you'd want to merge midi parts to one track but keep separate midi channels.

You can have multiple midi tracks routing to one instrument - for example if you've got a Kontakt instrument, it can host 16 instruments, each on their own midi channel (or sharing midi channels for layers) and have their own outputs too.

You can route one midi track to multiple destinations.

The thing you can't do that annoys me is have a multiple midi takes with the own controller data - only the note data is unique. That limits me a bit with eg piano takes.
MPE is a modern take on polyphonic aftertouch. WHen you play for example a Roli keyboard you can articulate each note with separate aftertouch ( you can also pitchbend each voice separately) and MPE is using separate MIDI channels for each voice meaning you have to be able to record different MIDI channels within the same MIDI track
(The merge example was just an example and nothing I would like to do )

As of december 2018 Pro Tools does not seem to have it. I would say it would be like running a restaurant-business without offering something to drink.
http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=402400
Old 3 weeks ago
  #15
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
MPE is a modern take on polyphonic aftertouch. WHen you play for example a Roli keyboard you can articulate each note with separate aftertouch ( you can also pitchbend each voice separately) and MPE is using separate MIDI channels for each voice meaning you have to be able to record different MIDI channels within the same MIDI track
(The merge example was just an example and nothing I would like to do )

As of december 2018 Pro Tools does not seem to have it. I would say it would be like running a restaurant-business without offering something to drink.
http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=402400
Mmm, I would say it's like running a restaurant without offering duck ala orange en flame.

Last edited by Philter; 3 weeks ago at 01:57 PM.. Reason: added "en flame" for clarity
Old 2 weeks ago
  #16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philter View Post
Mmm, I would say it's like running a restaurant without offering duck ala orange en flame.
Lacking MPE is increasing becoming more like running a restaurant that doesn't have any spoons. MPE has been around for quite a few years now, and the Midi Association has officially adopted it as part of their Midi 2.0 specs. An ever increasing number of DAWs, plugins and hardware are supporting it, including Cubase, Logic, Reaper, Cakewalk & Bitwig.

Pro Tools doesn't support it yet, but it really should just be a matter of time before it does. Even the recently including UVI stuff in the support plan is MPE capable. MPE is absolutely worth the squeeze.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
MPE is a modern take on polyphonic aftertouch. WHen you play for example a Roli keyboard you can articulate each note with separate aftertouch ( you can also pitchbend each voice separately) and MPE is using separate MIDI channels for each voice meaning you have to be able to record different MIDI channels within the same MIDI track
(The merge example was just an example and nothing I would like to do )

As of december 2018 Pro Tools does not seem to have it. I would say it would be like running a restaurant-business without offering something to drink.
http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=402400

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Lacking MPE is increasing becoming more like running a restaurant that doesn't have any spoons. MPE has been around for quite a few years now, and the Midi Association has officially adopted it as part of their Midi 2.0 specs. An ever increasing number of DAWs, plugins and hardware are supporting it, including Cubase, Logic, Reaper, Cakewalk & Bitwig.

Pro Tools doesn't support it yet, but it really should just be a matter of time before it does. Even the recently including UVI stuff in the support plan is MPE capable. MPE is absolutely worth the squeeze.
Right. Well, if it's that important it'll probably come in time.

I have to say I've never even seen the ROLI keyboard in the flesh...if it's a deal breaker for you, then I guess PT might not be for you - but it's not something I've ever seen requested or needed or used.

I think @ Philter 's simile was possibly more accurate.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Lacking MPE is increasing becoming more like running a restaurant that doesn't have any spoons. MPE has been around for quite a few years now, and the Midi Association has officially adopted it as part of their Midi 2.0 specs. An ever increasing number of DAWs, plugins and hardware are supporting it, including Cubase, Logic, Reaper, Cakewalk & Bitwig.

Pro Tools doesn't support it yet, but it really should just be a matter of time before it does. Even the recently including UVI stuff in the support plan is MPE capable. MPE is absolutely worth the squeeze.
Honestly the fact that such an obscure thing is a point of contention shows how silly the whole anti-protools thing has gotten. It's not even germane to the thread yet here we are wasting everyone's time again.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #19
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Right. Well, if it's that important it'll probably come in time.

I have to say I've never even seen the ROLI keyboard in the flesh...if it's a deal breaker for you, then I guess PT might not be for you - but it's not something I've ever seen requested or needed or used.

I think @ Philter 's simile was possibly more accurate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Philter View Post
Honestly the fact that such an obscure thing is a point of contention shows how silly the whole anti-protools thing has gotten. It's not even germane to the thread yet here we are wasting everyone's time again.

Do you think it might be a better use of everyone's time if you actually went out and tried an MPE controller before writing it off entirely sight unseen? I say that with absolute smugness on two counts. The first of which is, I am a HDX user and active member of the DUC. Come say hi - http://duc.avid.com/member.php?u=145991 There have been a lot of requests for it over there, particularly after the inclusion of Falcon in the support plan.

And secondly, you won't criticise it as being 'obscure' or irrelevant once you do use it. Not by a long shot. It makes normal midi controllers feel like 1-dimension paper weights by comparison. It is the catalyst for Midi 2.0. The Midi Manufacturers Association have spent most of the year nailing down the specifics, but it will be a single bidirectional connection, it will be backwards compatible, and MPE capability is required for certification. Midi is changing forever, and for the better. Does that sound 'obscure' to you? It is probably no coincidence that Avid is one of just two DAW developers that is completely absent from the Midi Manufacturers Association.

It is amazing, really. Firechild asked a simple question about MPE compatibility. It really only required a simple answer such as 'no'. Instead, people who are ignorant to the technology in question, offer up their own ignorance of the technology as a justification for why the question doesn't matter. It is tragic really. You are making asses of yourselves to anyone who has actually touched an MPE device. Go out and use one...
Old 2 weeks ago
  #20
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Do you think it might be a better use of everyone's time if you actually went out and tried an MPE controller before writing it off entirely sight unseen?
YES VI improvement has gained greatly between ProTools 10 and 2018. By the way I'm on the DUC since 2001. That would be a more effective place for a feature request. I've never found aftertouch to be useful so forgive me if I don't find MPE at all compelling. I hope you get your feature request, as long as they don't divert effort from things I will actually use, like ARA implementation.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #21
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Firechild View Post
Ok, fair enough, it seems to be around 999usd to be back in the game and then 600usd/year.
$999/usd to re-instate/upgrade to the latest version, which should include 1 year of support and upgrades. Then it should only be $399/yr usd to keep current. Also, if you buy the renewal from a dealer (i.e. Vintage King or Sweetwater) during a sale, you can sometimes get 20% off the $399 renewal. You can activate the renewal anytime and it just adds a year onto the current end date, so no worries buying it early when there's a sale.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #22
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Do you think it might be a better use of everyone's time if you actually went out and tried an MPE controller before writing it off entirely sight unseen? I say that with absolute smugness on two counts. The first of which is, I am a HDX user and active member of the DUC. Come say hi - http://duc.avid.com/member.php?u=145991 There have been a lot of requests for it over there, particularly after the inclusion of Falcon in the support plan.

And secondly, you won't criticise it as being 'obscure' or irrelevant once you do use it. Not by a long shot. It makes normal midi controllers feel like 1-dimension paper weights by comparison. It is the catalyst for Midi 2.0. The Midi Manufacturers Association have spent most of the year nailing down the specifics, but it will be a single bidirectional connection, it will be backwards compatible, and MPE capability is required for certification. Midi is changing forever, and for the better. Does that sound 'obscure' to you? It is probably no coincidence that Avid is one of just two DAW developers that is completely absent from the Midi Manufacturers Association.

It is amazing, really. Firechild asked a simple question about MPE compatibility. It really only required a simple answer such as 'no'. Instead, people who are ignorant to the technology in question, offer up their own ignorance of the technology as a justification for why the question doesn't matter. It is tragic really. You are making asses of yourselves to anyone who has actually touched an MPE device. Go out and use one...
Ok, settle down a bit. I made no such assertion - like it or not, it IS a bit obscure to the vast majority of users - I initially simply asked what it was! I’m hardly a stranger to music tech acronyms, but I’ve never heard of it. That’s not a crime.

You may be right - it may be a complete revolution. I’d wager most people using MIDI have never found the need for aftertouch in general though - I certainly haven’t, and whilst Indont do hardcore programming, I’ve never heard any of my programmer friends mention it or be seen to be using it either. Not to say we’re not automating or manipulating things - I barely use midi CC either, I just do it afterwards using the DAW automation.

I can see why it might be useful, don’t get me wrong, and I’m sure the ROLI systems are great - but it’s likely to be niche, even if it does revolutionise the spec.

So - now I know what it is! But you can chill out on the aggression please, it’s simply not warranted.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #23
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
Ok, settle down a bit. I made no such assertion - like it or not, it IS a bit obscure to the vast majority of users - I initially simply asked what it was! I’m hardly a stranger to music tech acronyms, but I’ve never heard of it. That’s not a crime.

You may be right - it may be a complete revolution. I’d wager most people using MIDI have never found the need for aftertouch in general though - I certainly haven’t, and whilst Indont do hardcore programming, I’ve never heard any of my programmer friends mention it or be seen to be using it either. Not to say we’re not automating or manipulating things - I barely use midi CC either, I just do it afterwards using the DAW automation.

I can see why it might be useful, don’t get me wrong, and I’m sure the ROLI systems are great - but it’s likely to be niche, even if it does revolutionise the spec.

So - now I know what it is! But you can chill out on the aggression please, it’s simply not warranted.
There is no aggression in my posts, Monkey. It is purely assertiveness. Perhaps one day you will walk into an Apple store, open up a copy of GarageBand and ask to try out a Roli and learn for yourself how many assertions you are actually making about MPE. There is no similarity between the aftertouch in Midi 1.0 that you two are referring to and MPE. It's like trying to deride MADI because of something related to TOSLINK. There is every chance that you have been mixing audio files created with MPE for years without ever questioning it.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #24
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
There is no aggression in my posts, Monkey. It is purely assertiveness.
"Instead, people who are ignorant to the technology in question, offer up their own ignorance of the technology as a justification for why the question doesn't matter. It is tragic really. You are making asses of yourselves to anyone who has actually touched an MPE device."

Crosses the line for me. I can put it in an offical warning if you'd prefer, but maybe we can just leave it as "chill out a little please"? It's not a big ask...I don't feel like I'm making an "ass" of myself at all - simply speaking from experience.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Perhaps one day you will walk into an Apple store, open up a copy of GarageBand and ask to try out a Roli and learn for yourself how many assertions you are actually making about MPE. There is no similarity between the aftertouch in Midi 1.0 that you two are referring to and MPE. It's like trying to deride MADI because of something related to TOSLINK. There is every chance that you have been mixing audio files created with MPE for years without ever questioning it.
I'm not "deriding" anything! I fully admit I've never come across it, nor do I feel it's something my peers are using. I think I know one person (who's a pro keyboardist and programmer, busy with Hillsong and the like) who might have or have used a ROLI keyboard. Beyond that I'm completely naive to it, and I've never said anything else.

Maybe all the programmer guys who work on tracks I mix have been using it for years, but for the sort of music I mix (rock, acoustic/americana, some pop, hip hop, some EDM and the like) I'd be surprised. Genuinely.

Anyway - getting a quick straw poll from a private FB group where most working Aussie producers/engineers hang out, will report back...might do so on a v high profile international one too to see if anyone's come across it. Curious now!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #25
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Firechild's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by originalscottyg View Post
$999/usd to re-instate/upgrade to the latest version, which should include 1 year of support and upgrades. Then it should only be $399/yr usd to keep current. Also, if you buy the renewal from a dealer (i.e. Vintage King or Sweetwater) during a sale, you can sometimes get 20% off the $399 renewal. You can activate the renewal anytime and it just adds a year onto the current end date, so no worries buying it early when there's a sale.
Ahh, seems fair enough, thanks.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #26
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
"Instead, people who are ignorant to the technology in question, offer up their own ignorance of the technology as a justification for why the question doesn't matter. It is tragic really. You are making asses of yourselves to anyone who has actually touched an MPE device."

Crosses the line for me. I can put it in an offical warning if you'd prefer, but maybe we can just leave it as "chill out a little please"? It's not a big ask...I don't feel like I'm making an "ass" of myself at all - simply speaking from experience.



I'm not "deriding" anything! I fully admit I've never come across it, nor do I feel it's something my peers are using. I think I know one person (who's a pro keyboardist and programmer, busy with Hillsong and the like) who might have or have used a ROLI keyboard. Beyond that I'm completely naive to it, and I've never said anything else.

Maybe all the programmer guys who work on tracks I mix have been using it for years, but for the sort of music I mix (rock, acoustic/americana, some pop, hip hop, some EDM and the like) I'd be surprised. Genuinely.

Anyway - getting a quick straw poll from a private FB group where most working Aussie producers/engineers hang out, will report back...might do so on a v high profile international one too to see if anyone's come across it. Curious now!
Do whatever you gotta do. Like I said, there is no aggression here. There is simply no replacement for first hand experience using the dang thing.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #27
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
Do whatever you gotta do. Like I said, there is no aggression here. There is simply no replacement for first hand experience using the dang thing.
It came across as aggressive. Reread and try to see why I’m saying that. Point made for now as far as I’m concerned.

At any rate, you’re arguing with a point I didn’t make - I didn’t say it wasn’t the most amazing thing ever, I said it wasn’t widely in use, at least outside of synth head circles - I said I didn’t believe it was significant - yet - for most users.

I did a quick straw poll as I suggested I might. Most people (pros working both here in Aus and in LA/travelling) hasn’t ever heard of it (“it” being MPE). One guy owned a ROLI, but said he never used it - said the functions were quite cool but only worked with synths designed to use them - he only had the one it shipped with - and so not much use to him.

Nothing to revise my original opinion I’m afraid - that whilst it may be useful in the future, it’s not a mainstream request right now. Again, I’m not making any judgement on how great it might be, because as you say I’ve not used it! But you’re completely off in thinking I’ve been “mixing tracks made with it for years”!
Old 2 weeks ago
  #28
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_monkey View Post
It came across as aggressive. Reread and try to see why I’m saying that. Point made for now as far as I’m concerned.

At any rate, you’re arguing with a point I didn’t make - I didn’t say it wasn’t the most amazing thing ever, I said it wasn’t widely in use, at least outside of synth head circles - I said I didn’t believe it was significant - yet - for most users.

I did a quick straw poll as I suggested I might. Most people (pros working both here in Aus and in LA/travelling) hasn’t ever heard of it (“it” being MPE). One guy owned a ROLI, but said he never used it - said the functions were quite cool but only worked with synths designed to use them - he only had the one it shipped with - and so not much use to him.

Nothing to revise my original opinion I’m afraid - that whilst it may be useful in the future, it’s not a mainstream request right now. Again, I’m not making any judgement on how great it might be, because as you say I’ve not used it! But you’re completely off in thinking I’ve been “mixing tracks made with it for years”!
I'm arguing with the very point you are trying to make, which essentially seems underpinned by establishing yourself as some kind of gatekeeper in the industry. Surely you see the irony in consulting a private facebook group regarding the 'niche-ness' of audio hardware that is sold two shelves down from Beats headphones in JB Hifi? It's the era of the youtube generation, cheap DAWs, cheap plugins, VR & 360 video, the proliferation of eurorack, and cameras in every device.

I think sound creation as a whole is far more democratised than you are perhaps giving it credit for. We are standing with our toes on the precipice of the fourth industrial revolution. MPE will be widespread precisely because it is entirely engrossed in the unfolding narrative of technology. That is why DAW developers and manufacturers are implementing it. It is driven by the same undercurrent that is committing large format consoles, HDX rigs and even the notion of rendered deliverables to the deep.
Old 2 weeks ago
  #29
Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
I'm arguing with the very point you are trying to make, which essentially seems underpinned by establishing yourself as some kind of gatekeeper in the industry. Surely you see the irony in consulting a private facebook group regarding the 'niche-ness' of audio hardware that is sold two shelves down from Beats headphones in JB Hifi? It's the era of the youtube generation, cheap DAWs, cheap plugins, VR & 360 video, the proliferation of eurorack, and cameras in every device.
Sure, I get that. As I said, it's a growth market I'm sure. But you were telling me that I've been mixing tracks created like this for years. Most of the pros I asked have never heard of it. And as far as I can see from the link above, there's only a handful (maybe 4?) manufacturers that make keyboards. And a few more synths that support it - http://www.rogerlinndesign.com/ls-re...ed-sounds.html, some of which I have and use anyway.

I'm not implying I'm a gatekeeper at all. I'm just someone who works across a lot of different styles, continents and projects. My one comment is really that if it were that common..I'd have heard of it before now. It simply isn't!

Quote:
Originally Posted by LDStudios View Post
I think sound creation as a whole is far more democratised than you are perhaps giving it credit for. We are standing with our toes on the precipice of the fourth industrial revolution. MPE will be widespread precisely because it is entirely engrossed in the unfolding narrative of technology. That is why DAW developers and manufacturers are implementing it. It is driven by the same undercurrent that is committing large format consoles, HDX rigs and even the notion of rendered deliverables to the deep.
You may well be right, and I'm not debating that. And whilst I agree with you that LFACs are certainly a smaller niche now than ever before, HDX rigs are populous, and I'm not really sure what you're talking about re "rendered deliverables"...if you mean there's no physical product anymore, I'd definitely agree, but I certainly still have to submit files to my mastering engineer, and he has to submit that back to the label (or me if I were uploading direct)!

I still think you're attempting to argue a point I haven't made. Unless there's a whole host of ROLI-wielding bedroom synth wizards making mass popular music I've somehow missed (not entirely impossible). Would be interested to see their sales figures as a proportion of the market - I could ask some friends at JB what they're selling for example?
Old 1 week ago
  #30
Lives for gear
 

Oooffda. MPE is absolutely a small niche of a niche. I could survey my peers and also get blank stares. Why is that worth arguing about? Also, Pro Tools doesn’t support CV, there’s arguably a larger niche that Avid completely ignores.

I’ve tried Roli stuff at one store (no one in my area carries it...), not my thing, and limited usefulness with anything i currently own is a big barrier as well. Chicken and egg scenario I’m afraid.
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