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Logic Pro X 10.5 is OUT!
Old 26th May 2020
  #451
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zedsdeadbaby View Post
In addition to Logic I've used Live forever. I find QS to be even faster than Lives workflow, (which was pretty damn fast until now). If they improved flex and made slicing and editing in the main window as effortless as live I could see myself putting Live behind me.... Anyway QS and Sampler are really well thought out, have fun!
Same here -but I think that the 'Follow tempo' only works with Apple Loops, very Apple-like again. (As opposed to Live Simpler that does stretching built-in).
Old 26th May 2020
  #452
Gear Head
 

I could be wrong here - but I had some really positive outcomes with Flex in Live Loops yesterday.

After a while, I had forgotten it was even an issue - I imported a tempo synced delay line into loops - and then kept changing the track tempo. It was pretty seamless.

Previously in Logic this could have caused me some issues and I would have been checking the Flex settings now and again - last night I just dropped it in and forgot about it.

D
Old 27th May 2020
  #453
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlavB View Post
Same here -but I think that the 'Follow tempo' only works with Apple Loops, very Apple-like again. (As opposed to Live Simpler that does stretching built-in).
Follow tempo works for me with wav files just fine. Longer files require me to analyze them with smart tempo. Once analyzed though I've been able to use follow tempo in the sampler with files as long as 112 measures. (Longest stem I've tried so far.) Not only that the sampler has a beat grid you can switch on that subdivides as you zoom, and you can swap QS to sampler by choosing sampler from the plugin menu, everything carries over like in Live... Seems like they ticked all the boxes to me...

There's also this feature that absolutely kills Live called Extract Loops. It auto-crops files into loops either 2, 4 or 8 measures, and spits the loops out into cells to the right. This is huge for me as it would let me repurpose my own stems for other projects, and convert them straight into loops with no fiddling required. (There's actually a bunch of features for this kind of thing. It's a lot to keep track of!)

I could actually see myself making my own Apple Loops again if they just overhauled that stupid AL categorization menu when creating your own loops. (Put in a request for this... Won't hold my breath, but also wouldn't be surprised if this is part of the larger vision here...) If they'd finally just add user categories that'd make the AL browser worth adding tons of user content to ...

Anyway... Seems like there's some kind of bug with extract loops though, (not surprised given that it's 5.0), because I had it working a couple days ago but wasn't working last night. Pretty damn sure I did everything the same as before when it did work.... I'm going to keep fiddling with it and see if there's a step I'm missing because this would be another nail in the Live coffin for me
Old 27th May 2020
  #454
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by DamianL View Post
I could be wrong here - but I had some really positive outcomes with Flex in Live Loops yesterday.

After a while, I had forgotten it was even an issue - I imported a tempo synced delay line into loops - and then kept changing the track tempo. It was pretty seamless.

Previously in Logic this could have caused me some issues and I would have been checking the Flex settings now and again - last night I just dropped it in and forgot about it.

D
They definitely did something to optimize it, it sounds a lot better than previous versions. Follow tempo in the sampler can sound a little smeared though, (although not any worse than complex in live, or tm pro in Kontakt). Would be nice if we eventually see a flex mode menu in the future.
Old 27th May 2020
  #455
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by zedsdeadbaby View Post
Follow tempo works for me with wav files just fine. Longer files require me to analyze them with smart tempo. Once analyzed though I've been able to use follow tempo in the sampler with files as long as 112 measures. (Longest stem I've tried so far.) Not only that the sampler has a beat grid you can switch on that subdivides as you zoom, and you can swap QS to sampler by choosing sampler from the plugin menu, everything carries over like in Live... Seems like they ticked all the boxes to me...

There's also this feature that absolutely kills Live called Extract Loops. It auto-crops files into loops either 2, 4 or 8 measures, and spits the loops out into cells to the right. This is huge for me as it would let me repurpose my own stems for other projects, and convert them straight into loops with no fiddling required. (There's actually a bunch of features for this kind of thing. It's a lot to keep track of!)

I could actually see myself making my own Apple Loops again if they just overhauled that stupid AL categorization menu when creating your own loops. (Put in a request for this... Won't hold my breath, but also wouldn't be surprised if this is part of the larger vision here...) This finally makes the AL browser worth adding tons of user content to if they'd just add user categories...

Anyway... Seems like there's some kind of bug with extract loops though, (not surprised given that it's 5.0), because I had it working a couple days ago but wasn't working last night. Pretty damn sure I did everything the same as before when it did work.... I'm going to keep fiddling with it and see if there's a step I'm missing because this would be another nail in the Live coffin for me


Ugh I had no idea there was FLex in the QS. This changes things entirely for me.
Thanks!
Old 27th May 2020
  #456
Gear Maniac
 

I like it overall, but it will take a while to get used to the parameters and overall functionality.

Right now the the samplers and workflow within them will be fairly integral to what i do(lelectronic music, mainly electro).

Drum synth is kinda meh, but i have that covered(kick good, snare & claps no so great, hh ok, toms ok).

step sequencer is not something i have to have but its really nice too have since so many of my plug ins are drum machines/drum based and/or for small seq hits/stabs.
Old 27th May 2020
  #457
Lives for gear
 
timtoonz's Avatar
Ran into another surprising bug in 10.4.8 yesterday. I was trying to do a fancy string run, so i played it at half speed then used Logic's Midi / "Double Speed" transformer... It was a two bar phrase but Logic only sped up the 2nd bar, and deleted the first ??? I had to hit undo and try again - same result

Tried extending the region, tried shift selecting all the notes manually, tried the 'option-drag' method on the region itself : always the same result. Only the 2nd bar was processed and the first bar vanished. Bizarre. Finally my 'fix' was to split the region into two separate bars and process each individually then glue them back together. Somehow I doubt 10.5 made any changes or fixes to these ancient Midi Transform routines. But I was a bit surprised to see how badly it was broken -- unless there's some basic trick I'm forgetting... it's been ages since I've used these particular tools. I tried a bunch of tests and the result was always the same - and always wrong. Sigh. I'm looking forward to playing with 10.5 when I'm finished my current 10.4.8 projects.
Old 27th May 2020
  #458
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by timtoonz View Post
Ran into another surprising bug in 10.4.8 yesterday. I was trying to do a fancy string run, so i played it at half speed then used Logic's Midi / "Double Speed" transformer... It was a two bar phrase but Logic only sped up the 2nd bar, and deleted the first ??? I had to hit undo and try again - same result

Tried extending the region, tried shift selecting all the notes manually, tried the 'option-drag' method on the region itself : always the same result. Only the 2nd bar was processed and the first bar vanished. Bizarre. Finally my 'fix' was to split the region into two separate bars and process each individually then glue them back together. Somehow I doubt 10.5 made any changes or fixes to these ancient Midi Transform routines. But I was a bit surprised to see how badly it was broken -- unless there's some basic trick I'm forgetting... it's been ages since I've used these particular tools. I tried a bunch of tests and the result was always the same - and always wrong. Sigh. I'm looking forward to playing with 10.5 when I'm finished my current 10.4.8 projects.
Hadn't noticed that before. I do see that here. That said I found an easier workaround until it gets fixed. Select all and drag everything over to bar 2 then run double speed. Even though the last bar looks like it disappears it actually gets processed too. Then just drag back a bar.

I'll report it as a bug, I'd do the same. The more people that report the same bug the quicker they deal with it.
Old 28th May 2020
  #459
Lives for gear
 

Shouldn’t this thread be pinned and the 10.4 one “unpinned”? Where do you ask for this here? Thanks.

KA
Old 29th May 2020
  #460
Gear Head
 

Since I updated I cannot time-stretch audio regions anymore (by alt-dragging the end of the regions in the tracks area).

Anyone has the same issue?
Old 29th May 2020
  #461
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by constellation11 View Post
Since I updated I cannot time-stretch audio regions anymore (by alt-dragging the end of the regions in the tracks area).

Anyone has the same issue?
Working over here... Maybe try the Logic Help form and see if they have any ideas...
Old 29th May 2020
  #462
Gear Addict
 
Dan Eriksson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by constellation11 View Post
Since I updated I cannot time-stretch audio regions anymore (by alt-dragging the end of the regions in the tracks area).

Anyone has the same issue?
Just unclick "Follow Tempo & Pitch" and it vill work.

It also depends on what Project Tempo Mode you have choosed.
Attached Thumbnails
Logic Pro X 10.5 is OUT!-follow-tempo.png   Logic Pro X 10.5 is OUT!-smart-tempo.png  
Old 29th May 2020
  #463
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Eriksson View Post
Just unclick "Follow Tempo & Pitch" and it vill work.

It also depends on what Project Tempo Mode you have choosed.

Hello,
The "Follow Tempo & Pitch" is called "Flex & Follow" on my Logic, and doesn't have a checkbox..

Anyway, this is set to "no" and I am in Keep Tempo mode.

When I try to stretch an audio region, I get a window saying "analyzing transients" and it get stuck on it..

I didn't have this issue before.
Attached Thumbnails
Logic Pro X 10.5 is OUT!-capture-d-ecran-2020-05-29-10.52.57.png   Logic Pro X 10.5 is OUT!-capture-d-ecran-2020-05-29-10.49.24.jpg  
Old 29th May 2020
  #464
Gear Addict
 
Dan Eriksson's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by constellation11 View Post
Hello,
The "Follow Tempo & Pitch" is called "Flex & Follow" on my Logic, and doesn't have a checkbox..

Anyway, this is set to "no" and I am in Keep Tempo mode.

When I try to stretch an audio region, I get a window saying "analyzing transients" and it get stuck on it..

I didn't have this issue before.
Just for fun, have you tried another audiofile?
Old 29th May 2020
  #465
Gear Head
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan Eriksson View Post
Just for fun, have you tried another audiofile?
Yes, and had no luck
Old 4 weeks ago
  #466
Lives for gear
 

Is there a page where I can see remaining third party incompatible plugins for the new update.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #467
Gear Maniac
 

after more time with drum synth, its pretty bad? of course i could use it a little, but its pretty disappointing over all? there are too many cheap options that work/sound so much better and offer so much more flexiblity.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #468
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by user i477533222 View Post
after more time with drum synth, its pretty bad? of course i could use it a little, but its pretty disappointing over all? there are too many cheap options that work/sound so much better and offer so much more flexiblity.
I found the kicks to be useful. Snares and claps are handy for thickening or adding transient or sizzle but not great by themselves. Happy it's included but agree it's not mind-blowing. Which alternatives did you have in mind?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #469
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swartzfeger's Avatar
I guess my question regarding Logic 10.5 drum synth (and everything else new) is how does it compare to Live? I more or less ditched Logic for Ableton Live 10 about a day before 10.5's surprise update, lol.

Things that I'm discovering in Ableton drum rack that I don't think are possible in Logic... can you put a synth inside of Logic drum synth (you can inside Live's drum rack). Copy value to siblings, etc. Ableton is so freaking deep. Add in the crazy/complex routing you can do with Live's effects racks in general... Logic's update seems to have some meat on the top but not a lot of substance in the fundamentals of design/routing etc.

I suppose I shouldn't guess and should fire up 10.5 and give it a spin.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #470
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
I guess my question regarding Logic 10.5 drum synth (and everything else new) is how does it compare to Live? I more or less ditched Logic for Ableton Live 10 about a day before 10.5's surprise update, lol.

Things that I'm discovering in Ableton drum rack that I don't think are possible in Logic... can you put a synth inside of Logic drum synth (you can inside Live's drum rack). Copy value to siblings, etc. Ableton is so freaking deep. Add in the crazy/complex routing you can do with Live's effects racks in general... Logic's update seems to have some meat on the top but not a lot of substance in the fundamentals of design/routing etc.

I suppose I shouldn't guess and should fire up 10.5 and give it a spin.
You can put any plugin on a Pad. But DMD is very basic compared to Ableton Drum Racks.
I would have preferred something like a Steinberg Groove Agent or Studio One Impact XT, Battery etc style Drum Machine with it's own browser. An updated Ultrabeat basically.
DMD is good if you use Factory Kit Pieces but custom sample loading/Pad replacing is not intuitive. A utility to batch convert samples to Kit pieces would be great at least. Otherwise it is too much work to bother.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #471
Gear Head
 

I thought about this for a while and I have decent way of working with Drum Designer now -

I use a large library of samples with DMD - including lots of Battery Kits - and it works pretty well.

I find this the easiest way -

Make sure that you link your sample
Folders to ‘Untagged Loops’ folder so that they can be easily found in the file browser up in the right hand corner of your main page.

Then - if you have opened DMD you can simply open your ‘untagged loops’ page in the browser and drag and drop onto the DMD Pad of choice.

For example - I recently downloaded the ‘sample magic vinyl hits’ pack - I can open the ‘kick drum’ folder in I untagged loops and Drag and drop from the list of 100+ kick drums to audition them - very simple. DMD automatically creates a simple sampler on that pad to play them, no problems.

It couldn’t be much simpler - if only the DMD didn’t keep disappearing when you click the loops browser life would be perfect!

Also - I find it useful to make large sampler OR DMD instruments of just kicks or just snares etc.

This is easy to do with grab and drop bulk importing into the new sampler - literally just grab 80 kicks and drag them onto a track and it’s done.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #472
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by DamianL View Post
I thought about this for a while and I have decent way of working with Drum Designer now -

I use a large library of samples with DMD - including lots of Battery Kits - and it works pretty well.

I find this the easiest way -

Make sure that you link your sample
Folders to ‘Untagged Loops’ folder so that they can be easily found in the file browser up in the right hand corner of your main page.

Then - if you have opened DMD you can simply open your ‘untagged loops’ page in the browser and drag and drop onto the DMD Pad of choice.

For example - I recently downloaded the ‘sample magic vinyl hits’ pack - I can open the ‘kick drum’ folder in I untagged loops and Drag and drop from the list of 100+ kick drums to audition them - very simple. DMD automatically creates a simple sampler on that pad to play them, no problems.

It couldn’t be much simpler - if only the DMD didn’t keep disappearing when you click the loops browser life would be perfect!

Also - I find it useful to make large sampler OR DMD instruments of just kicks or just snares etc.

This is easy to do with grab and drop bulk importing into the new sampler - literally just grab 80 kicks and drag them onto a track and it’s done.
it may not be worth comparing with Atlas plugin but after working with Atlas the concept of organizing your own kits with search&drag&drop from large librarys and so on looks like a very big problem and waste of time..the same thing i can say about logic browser vs adsr sample manager.
I'd like to believe that in future updates, the advantages of existing plugins will be applied in logic tools.

is it possible to remove the cell-structure in the pattern editor so that beats can be placed at any point?
Old 4 weeks ago
  #473
Gear Nut
 
Anthony Quinn's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by killme View Post
is it possible to remove the cell-structure in the pattern editor so that beats can be placed at any point?

After getting what is wanted from the Step Sequencer, we can convert the Pattern Region into a Midi Region, and then edit that on the Piano Roll or open the old Step Editor to go further, since the old Step Editor was directly compatible with the Piano Roll. Those seem to be our options ATM.

I'm betting this will evolve somewhat in future updates.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #474
Just updated my macOS to current 10.15.5 (just out, from 10.15.14), and of course Logic 10.5. Finally! This is the first time since Mojave that Logic has booted up properly without pressing control-shift! New step-sequencer is the shizz and EXS24 finally looks like it came from this century! Thanks, Apple!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #475
Quote:
Originally Posted by jiffybox View Post
Falcon, Zebra, V6 all working fine. What problems are arising for you?
I posted that before I had a chance to install 10.5. Only Chris Hein Solo Cello is mute (as usual). But everything else is SOLID!

• u-he Zebra 2
• u-he Zebra HZ
• UVI Falcon
• UVI Synth Anthology 2
• Tina Guo Acoustic Cello Legato volumes 1 and 2.
• Native Instruments' Straylight

All working in macOS 10.15.5/Logic 10.5 and sounding great!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #476
Gear Maniac
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by thermal View Post
I found the kicks to be useful. Snares and claps are handy for thickening or adding transient or sizzle but not great by themselves. Happy it's included but agree it's not mind-blowing. Which alternatives did you have in mind?
well, theres just so many 3rd party drum machines ft synthesis plus sample packs, i was hoping for a bit more quality from the plug. who knows maybe over the course of time ill find uses for it. maybe just short percussive sounds.

i tend to want to really like logics plugs since they run with such low cpu overhead(minus a few things like alchemy or the camel efx or reverbs)
Old 4 weeks ago
  #477
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by swartzfeger View Post
I guess my question regarding Logic 10.5 drum synth (and everything else new) is how does it compare to Live? I more or less ditched Logic for Ableton Live 10 about a day before 10.5's surprise update, lol.

Things that I'm discovering in Ableton drum rack that I don't think are possible in Logic... can you put a synth inside of Logic drum synth (you can inside Live's drum rack). Copy value to siblings, etc. Ableton is so freaking deep. Add in the crazy/complex routing you can do with Live's effects racks in general... Logic's update seems to have some meat on the top but not a lot of substance in the fundamentals of design/routing etc.

I suppose I shouldn't guess and should fire up 10.5 and give it a spin.
Actually you can host individual plugins in Drum Machine Designer. Each DMD cell is a discrete instrument track that allows you to use any instrument you have. Can it do 127 cells? No... But Live isn't graceful at handling that kind of instrument load anyway.

I actually think the drum synth's pretty usable. Live doesn't have dedicated percussion synths built in, and the Ableton M4L ones are meh on a good day, (Logic's being far better). Sure you could synthesize something similar-ish in Operator or Wavetable, but it'll take you a lot more time, and you could do the same with Alchemy... I just think the Drum Synth looks kind of ridiculous. Like it's designed for a toddler :p

The new samplers actually crush Live's. I've used Live as long as Logic, always loved Simpler/Sampler.. 10.5's are just as fast, have a massively more powerful matrix, and some insane auto-detection features like automatic pitch detection with auto-key mapping, detecting silence, etc. Not to mention legit round robin. (There are a few bugs though. Imagine these will be ironed out in the next update.)

Overall Logic more or less does the same kind of stuff Live does now, but in more detail. Live's also gotten clunkier and more awkward when it omes to things like hopping between both views, recording Session View/clip-based automation. Basically Ableton implemented sloppy if not redundant buttons for features that should have been carefully thought through instead of shoved out the door..

The few areas where Live still wins for me are audio editing, racks, and macros... Editing is just grab and drag at your leisure, no marquis, knife tools or shortcuts necessary.. Racks are something I've FR in Logic a few times, and macros are crazy fast compared to setting up complex smart controls... (That said Live's are limited, Bitwig did it right..)

Oh and the Browser, (at the same time though Live's browser and me have a love/hate relationship). Outside of that I don't see myself using Live much simply because it's always been a CPU pig, I get fan spin when it indexes, and you can only instantiate so many instruments before Live either falls apart or starts lighting my computer on fire.


EDIT: Just noticed others answered this already. Carry on!
Old 4 weeks ago
  #478
Lives for gear
 
matskull's Avatar
 

I wanted to see how far I could push Logic Pro 10.5 CPU wise so I did a little test.

I ended up with 450 audio tracks, each running an instance of Channel EQ and an instance of Logic's stock compressor. I'm mainly into music mixing so I didn't test with virtual instruments.

All tracks have 4 bus sends, the aux assigned to those bus also have an instance of channel eq and compressor.
All audio on all tracks, except for one that I forgot, are quantized, all tracks have multiple automation parameter automated like volume, pan, send's mute, send's volume and eq master volume.

The session is 96Khz 24 bit. It also has tempo and signature changes.
The computer I'm using is a Mac Mini 2018 3.2 GHz 6-Core Intel Core i7 with 32 gig of ram.
I could easily navigate through the session, open and close windows with no problem, no glitches or anything like that, all that while also recording a screen capture.

I tried going up to 500 but my SSD wasn't fast enough unfortunately. Honestly 450 tracks is more than I ever need but if I ever need to mix such a large project I'll know that I can do it with stock plugins.

Coming from a 32 i/o Protools HDX setup (that cost me a fortune by the way), I'm super impressed!

Old 4 weeks ago
  #479
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozinga View Post
DMD is good if you use Factory Kit Pieces but custom sample loading/Pad replacing is not intuitive. A utility to batch convert samples to Kit pieces would be great at least. Otherwise it is too much work to bother.
This would be a worthy feature request... You should send it in as one, I will be. I'm going to request DMD sample browser with bookmarks or access to untagged folders.
Old 4 weeks ago
  #480
Lives for gear
 
swartzfeger's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ozinga View Post
You can put any plugin on a Pad. But DMD is very basic compared to Ableton Drum Racks.
I would have preferred something like a Steinberg Groove Agent or Studio One Impact XT, Battery etc style Drum Machine with it's own browser. An updated Ultrabeat basically.
DMD is good if you use Factory Kit Pieces but custom sample loading/Pad replacing is not intuitive. A utility to batch convert samples to Kit pieces would be great at least. Otherwise it is too much work to bother.

Quote:
Originally Posted by zedsdeadbaby View Post
Actually you can host individual plugins in Drum Machine Designer. Each DMD cell is a discrete instrument track that allows you to use any instrument you have. Can it do 127 cells? No... But Live isn't graceful at handling that kind of instrument load anyway.

I actually think the drum synth's pretty usable. Live doesn't have dedicated percussion synths built in, and the Ableton M4L ones are meh on a good day, (Logic's being far better). Sure you could synthesize something similar-ish in Operator or Wavetable, but it'll take you a lot more time, and you could do the same with Alchemy... I just think the Drum Synth looks kind of ridiculous. Like it's designed for a toddler :p

The new samplers actually crush Live's. I've used Live as long as Logic, always loved Simpler/Sampler.. 10.5's are just as fast, have a massively more powerful matrix, and some insane auto-detection features like automatic pitch detection with auto-key mapping, detecting silence, etc. Not to mention legit round robin. (There are a few bugs though. Imagine these will be ironed out in the next update.)

Overall Logic more or less does the same kind of stuff Live does now, but in more detail. Live's also gotten clunkier and more awkward when it omes to things like hopping between both views, recording Session View/clip-based automation. Basically Ableton implemented sloppy if not redundant buttons for features that should have been carefully thought through instead of shoved out the door..

The few areas where Live still wins for me are audio editing, racks, and macros... Editing is just grab and drag at your leisure, no marquis, knife tools or shortcuts necessary.. Racks are something I've FR in Logic a few times, and macros are crazy fast compared to setting up complex smart controls... (That said Live's are limited, Bitwig did it right..)

Oh and the Browser, (at the same time though Live's browser and me have a love/hate relationship). Outside of that I don't see myself using Live much simply because it's always been a CPU pig, I get fan spin when it indexes, and you can only instantiate so many instruments before Live either falls apart or starts lighting my computer on fire.


EDIT: Just noticed others answered this already. Carry on!
Thanks guys, will definitely check out.

Other than PDC (that I won't re-litigate), the one big area that's still going to keep me in Live for the foreseeable future is modulation/automation. Max LFO, auto pan and automation in general makes it so easy to quickly and creatively sculpt a track. Logic just isn't there yet.

When Logic adopts Reaper-style automation items and PDC is fixed? Back in the fold. Logic overall is so smooth overall. For now, having a blast with Ableton.
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