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Logic Pro X Flex Pitch Issues Pitch & Harmony Plugins
Old 8th January 2017
  #1
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Logic Pro X Flex Pitch Issues

Hi All,

When correcting vocals in Logic, I use the logic plug-in 'flex pitch.' In terms of its correcting abilities it works fine, but, after corrections are made, it creates horrible crackling/popping sounds, which do not appear on the original track.

They appear with no consistency or pattern, and cannot be removed (it seems).

This renders flex pitch almost useless - particularly when these pops occur up to half a dozen times in one take.

My question is, has anyone found a solution to this problem (or has had the same experience?). Failing that, can anyone recommend a third party auto-tune plug-in/software? Prepared to spend good money, but don't really know where to start.

TIA
Old 9th January 2017
  #2
Popular 3rd party processors include Melodyne, autotune, waves tune...izotope has one too.

All do the job, they all have their own strengths and weaknesses. All have demo versions, and all will be more suited to vocals than your current method! I'm not averse to using inbuilt pitch functions for a simple quick fix, but for transparent natural tuning tweaks, you can't beat the right tools.
Old 9th January 2017
  #3
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Hi psycho_monkey,

I have looked at Melodyn, it's just a question of which package I should get. The basic one with simple pitch function is all I need.
Old 9th January 2017
  #4
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voodoo4u's Avatar
Just something to consider. What is your buffer set to? Flex pitch is a CPU intensive task. I find I'll usually set the buffer low when tracking for lower latency and higher for plugin intensive mixing. I sometimes forget to reset it and occasionally get the crackling you're referring to.

I've also had some flex pitch issues in an older version of Logic. If you're not on the latest version of Logic (10.2.4 I think), I'd recommend it.

If all else fails, refer to Psycho_Monkey.
Old 9th January 2017
  #5
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hey voodoo4u,

I'm using the most up to date version of LPX.
You are correct about the buffer - sometimes I do forget to change it, but that shouldn't have an impact on the actual rendered track at the end, even if it causes audio glitches during playback.

What I can't get over is that Apple seems to have just ignored this issue, as it has been going around for a couple of years at least. I seem to be leaning toward Melodyn.
Old 9th January 2017
  #6
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voodoo4u's Avatar
Yes, perhaps Melodyn is a good choice for you. I wouldn't mind trying it myself, but it still doesn't get to the bottom of your initial problem and the question is, is it a problem with Logic's Flex pitch or is it a problem exclusive to your system setup? I think it would really help to hear from more Logic users to see if this is a problem they've encountered often. All I can tell you from my perspective is that after my latest upgrades, Flex pitch has been very solid for me. Hopefully more users will log in.
Old 9th January 2017
  #7
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MusiKLover's Avatar
I agree about the buffer. I have some VIs that need a large range in addition to buffer size, and conversely many that play better with a Small Process Buffer Range. That part gets trying but I don't believe specific to just Apple, but rather older architectures or newer & poorly designed 3rd party drummers, etc that prove to be troublesome with with larger sample sets, for example. Determining the right mix between the Buffer and the Range is central to the issue, and I don't have the secret formula.

I could see a case where this lever might affect FLEX. Perhaps you could check out different Ranges in addition to the traditional I/O Buffer Size.

Furthermore, check if you are using Playback or Playback & Live Tracks Mode. The latter is more efficient when tracking but is much more CPU intensive I believe.
Old 9th January 2017
  #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoo4u View Post
Yes, perhaps Melodyn is a good choice for you. I wouldn't mind trying it myself, but it still doesn't get to the bottom of your initial problem and the question is, is it a problem with Logic's Flex pitch or is it a problem exclusive to your system setup? I think it would really help to hear from more Logic users to see if this is a problem they've encountered often. All I can tell you from my perspective is that after my latest upgrades, Flex pitch has been very solid for me. Hopefully more users will log in.

In terms of the set up, I'm fairly confident it's an issue with flex pitch. I have projects where F.P. is not an issue, and others where it causes problems to the point of being unusable. It's that random.

I've found a number of others online in forums who have the same problem, so I'm more concerned with why it hasn't been addressed. If it hasn't affected you, I'm envious!
Old 10th January 2017
  #9
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If it's random within your own system, that sounds like a memory problem to me. How's your RAM? I recently upgraded from 8 to 16 gig and I find it's helped overall.
Old 10th January 2017
  #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by voodoo4u View Post
If it's random within your own system, that sounds like a memory problem to me. How's your RAM? I recently upgraded from 8 to 16 gig and I find it's helped overall.
RAM is good - 16gb. I'll go back and try with varying buffer sizes, but I'm as positive as I can be it isnt that.

*Edit*

Have just run the project with 4 different buffer sizes, two smallest and two largest. No difference. The noises are audio artefacts created by flex pitch.
Old 10th January 2017
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert27191 View Post
RAM is good - 16gb. I'll go back and try with varying buffer sizes, but I'm as positive as I can be it isnt that.

*Edit*

Have just run the project with 4 different buffer sizes, two smallest and two largest. No difference. The noises are audio artefacts created by flex pitch.
Old 10th January 2017
  #12
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Haha, sorry.

I was saying that the audio problems I'm getting could be attributed to the buffer size (although I doubt it) and so I tried playing the project, with and without flex pitch being active, at four different buffer sizes - the two smallest and the two largest - for the biggest possible variety in buffer performance.

It.made no difference - with FP turned off, there were no crackles and pops...with its turned on, there they were - on each play.

This has happened to me on several occasions, so I know it isn't just a set up or user issue. It's happened to a friend as well, and can be found reported on various forums.
Old 10th January 2017
  #13
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I understood what you were saying. The emoticon was just my way of saying I'm baffled. I wish I could be of more help. I have a setup very similar to yours and I'm having no problems with Flex Pitch, so I'm leaning towards the problem being internal to your setup.

I did have a session once that for some reason (maybe not enough RAM at the time) went corrupt and I had to create a copy of the session and do some work to get back to where I was.

The only other things that come to mind are:

1. A corrupt session.
2. Corrupt software. Maybe a fresh install of Logic.
3. Sample rate is too high for your computer to handle.

I think Flex Pitch is too important a feature for Apple to just ignore a critical problem of software development, so I'm fairly certain it's not in the code.

Maybe go to the Logic forum and see if anyone else is having similar issues.

https://discussions.apple.com/commun...ions/logic_pro
Old 10th January 2017
  #14
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MusiKLover's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert27191 View Post
Haha, sorry.

I was saying that the audio problems I'm getting could be attributed to the buffer size (although I doubt it) and so I tried playing the project, with and without flex pitch being active, at four different buffer sizes - the two smallest and the two largest - for the biggest possible variety in buffer performance.

It.made no difference - with FP turned off, there were no crackles and pops...with its turned on, there they were - on each play.

This has happened to me on several occasions, so I know it isn't just a set up or user issue. It's happened to a friend as well, and can be found reported on various forums.
Did you try the three Process Buffer Ranges along with each of the Buffer I/O sizes you mentioned? They're two or so lines below in Audio Preferences, and you can choose Small, Medium, or Large. For many VIs I have, as I mentioned, the Range actually come into play and perhaps the same would go for FLEX if its fundamental issue is in fact CPU. Even if it's not CPU I could see different Ranges affecting FLEX, and Pitch in particular.
Old 11th January 2017
  #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MusiKLover View Post
Did you try the three Process Buffer Ranges along with each of the Buffer I/O sizes you mentioned? They're two or so lines below in Audio Preferences, and you can choose Small, Medium, or Large. For many VIs I have, as I mentioned, the Range actually come into play and perhaps the same would go for FLEX if its fundamental issue is in fact CPU. Even if it's not CPU I could see different Ranges affecting FLEX, and Pitch in particular.
No, I didn't try that - I'll have to give it a go. However, *if* that's the case, surely when I render the track, those sounds should disappear - but they don't, they're present in the final bounces mix.
Old 11th January 2017
  #16
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MusiKLover's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert27191 View Post
No, I didn't try that - I'll have to give it a go. However, *if* that's the case, surely when I render the track, those sounds should disappear - but they don't, they're present in the final bounces mix.
That's an assumption you realize.
Old 11th January 2017
  #17
Sorry about a bit of topic question but are you guys using flex pitch a lot ? Cause for me since around 10.1 this feature is useless as it produces loada of artifacts whenever I am trying to tune vocals, instruements... maybe i am doing something wrong so someone can chime in. Thanks.
Old 11th January 2017
  #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by janiq View Post
Sorry about a bit of topic question but are you guys using flex pitch a lot ? Cause for me since around 10.1 this feature is useless as it produces loada of artifacts whenever I am trying to tune vocals, instruements... maybe i am doing something wrong so someone can chime in. Thanks.
Totally on topic and my point.
Old 11th January 2017
  #19
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Flex Pitch always had and still have artifacts. Worse, even when turning it off, the artifacts won't go away - my workaround since the beginning has been cloning the track and working with the cloned track. For backing vocal correction, or pontual correction, it's great - quick, easy and fast. For reliably tuning a main vocal part, or a lead instrument with tuning issues (i.e.: a guitar solo where the guitar was improperly tuned) I much prefer Melodyne.
Old 16th February 2017
  #20
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voodoo4u's Avatar
OK, so I had a vocal session the other day and the vocal required some tuning. I used flex pitch and yes, there were artifacts I couldn't get rid of no matter what I did. I'll concede, it seems to be an inherent problem in Logic. I'm about to try the 30 day free trial for melodyne. It looks like it's time for a change.
Old 16th February 2017
  #21
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Yeah - it's still around, I'm having issues a new project too.

Please do let us know how you get on with Melodyn - I haven't taken the plunge yet (not enough time to spend with it to make the trial worthwhile yet) but I would love to hear your thoughts.
Old 17th February 2017
  #22
Hi tried 10.3 as it suppose to reduce artifacys bit it still does not work as advertised. Guys I can highly recommend melodyne although i am using basoc version only as vibrato stuff and slight pitch drifts are ok with flex pitch so i just combine those two together. If you have waves check waves tune which is also really good in my humble opinion.
Old 23rd February 2017
  #23
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I found the improvement in 10.3 to be significant. Before it was completely unusable, even for demos. Now it's at least listenable. Actually I haven't really noticed any artifacts yet. I've only been using it for demos so far. I'm still going into melodyne for the final product.
Old 24th February 2017
  #24
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north3d's Avatar
Went there ... Came Back

I used Flex-pitch on about 10 songs ( back when Melodyne was having some issues with logic ).
I really liked the "metaphor" the Logic developers came up with. However, the gurgling and other noises was a real let-down.

Melodyne has since updated and is running much better in Logic. It still has a few issues but they're not enough to keep me from using it.

I've ended up going back to the original vocals and reloading them back into Melodyne and re-tweaking them.
Plus ... I haven't seen anything "out there" that's as great for timing-up the vocal-dubbles or creating harmonies.

Just sayin'
Old 25th February 2017
  #25
As mentioned, Flex Pitch is quite CPU intensive. You may want to try bouncing in place for tracks on which you've used Flex Pitch. Also, what hardware are you running (model, year)?
Old 13th March 2017
  #26
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Hey Robert, just a thought, I have noticed that some of these artefacts can be triggered by comp edit transitions, practically inaudible in the comp but enough to make the flex pitch cough even without any correction applied.
Old 13th March 2017
  #27
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Interesting, never thought of that. Just went and checked the project, they are occurring even on single takes!
Old 13th March 2017
  #28
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Jay Asher's Avatar
 

Yes, I too get some artifacts with it.
Old 20th March 2017
  #29
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I just tried Flex pitch on vocals, it's unusable, popping at the beginning of each words ! nothing to do with melodyne, too bad Apple can't correct theses bugs. Are waves and izotope tuning plugins better than melodyne ? or as good ? thx
Old 20th March 2017
  #30
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...I use melodyne and flex all the time, as well as waves and reavoice...as mentioned about they each have a +/- effectiveness depending on the source material. I've never experienced the "popping" you are describing...otoh, I have not heard your material or the "processing" you are applying...it IS absolutely possible to create crap results as well.../s~
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