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Logic Pro X compressors?
Old 1st December 2015
  #1
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hemmick reef's Avatar
 

Logic Pro X compressors?

Hi,

In terms of compressors with character...

Just wondering if there are better compressors than Logic's?

Would I actually hear a noticeable difference in quality?

Thanks
Old 1st December 2015
  #2
Gear Addict
I haven't used the Logic (9 or X) compressors for quite some time. I favour the Waves CLA compressors, RVox, Klanghelm MJUC etc.

The Waves 1176 & LA2A have more character than the Logic compressors and the Klanghelm MJUC is amazing - a really great sounding plugin compressor.

I can definitely hear a difference between the Logic compressor and the 3rd party plugins.
Old 1st December 2015
  #3
Lives for gear
 
hemmick reef's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ollieneedham View Post
I haven't used the Logic (9 or X) compressors for quite some time. I favour the Waves CLA compressors, RVox, Klanghelm MJUC etc.

The Waves 1176 & LA2A have more character than the Logic compressors and the Klanghelm MJUC is amazing - a really great sounding plugin compressor.

I can definitely hear a difference between the Logic compressor and the 3rd party plugins.
Ok thanks.

What difference would I hear... more glueing of sound, three dimensional, etc?
Old 1st December 2015
  #4
Gear Addict
Quote:
Originally Posted by hemmick reef View Post
Ok thanks.

What difference would I hear... more glueing of sound, three dimensional, etc?
You'd have to download the demos and try for yourself, but I think the 3rd party stuff has more character. They do different things depending on the compressor. The 1176 is more '1176' like than the Logic compressor(s), the LA2A does that 'thick LA2A' thing that the Logic compressor doesn't, the MJUC goes to another level in terms of thickness/transformer sound/character that other plugin compressors don't hit IMO.

These are obviously based on hardware compressors so will aim to retain part of their character. Another 'one stop shop' compressor like the Logic one may have little to no difference i.e. the ProTools one - but the ones that 'emulate' hardware have different flavours and are not only useful in a mix but also have noticeable differences.
Old 1st December 2015
  #5
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MusiKLover's Avatar
Check these out & there are differing opinions regarding the Logic Compressor. The oft dismissed plugin can be overlooked for reasons based on conjecture and supposition. The following links help to set this straight:

ADSR: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6noBiCLImA
dancetech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZEeikUb34M -- British, thinks the compressor is worth the whole price of Logic
Logic 10.1 New Compressor Review/Demo
Logic Tutorial: The Compressor - MusicTech.net | MusicTech.net
Logic Tutorial: The Compressor - Step-by-Step - MusicTech.net | MusicTech.net
11 New Features You Need to Know About from the Logic Pro 10.1 Update | sflogicninja
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9utq5t-LSpo
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...ro-compressor/
Logic Pro X 10.1 Compressor explained
https://ask.audio/articles/logic-pro...and-a-makeover
Logic Pro 1176 and LA2A Compressor Emulations - [ BEACH HOUSE STUDIOS ]
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...plugins-tests/
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...ca-comparison/

MusicTech: "One of the most useful improvements included with the release of Logic Pro X 10.1 has been the redesigned Compressor plug-in, arguably one of the most important plug-ins in Logic’s arsenal of software outboard effects.

While the functionality of the latest compressor incarnation hasn’t changed too greatly from the original version, its redesigned GUI offers some key functional improvements in terms of the plug-in’s day-to-day operation. It also highlights some key sonic differences between it and the seven other compressor models on offer in Logic. With this in mind, we thought a revised and in-depth look at Logic Pro X’s Compressor plug-in was perhaps well overdue…"

"Many claim VCA compressors are the most universal compressors, fit for any and all purposes an engineer might need in hers or his quest for the perfect sound. I must admit I can’t seem to agree with those claims – I’m not a fan of their sound. It might be that I am doing something wrong, but to me they don’t produce pleasing results.

That being said, I still decided to go through with this test and note my observations in the same way I did with the optical and FET compressor plugins before that. The plugins being compared are:

Apple Logic Pro Compressor in Studio VCA, Vintage VCA and Classic VCA modes
Native Instruments VC 160
Waves SSL G-Master Bus Compressor

My observations:

Logic Vintage VCA and Waves SSL produced similar results. However, with the SSL the drum kit sounds ‘bigger’ (and, consequentially, further away), while the Logic’s Vintage VCA is more present or ‘in your face’.
Logic Classic VCA and NI VC 160 also mimic the same hardware unit and sound similar: both are crushing the kit quite heavily, letting the initial transients through. However, I prefer Logic’s compressor.
They all color the sound quite a bit, but Logic Studio VCA seems to do that to a lesser extent.
As in previous tests, I’ve found that Waves saturate the body of the cymbals whereas Logic’s saturation is higher up the frequency spectrum."



Universal Audio offers the Rev A “Bluestripe” and Rev E “Blackface” (including a rare 1176AE 40th Anniversary Edition).
Logic Compressor’s Vintage FET mode has a silver design and the Studio FET is black.
Waves’ CLA-76 features a ‘Bluey’ and a ‘Blacky’ mode.

From the waveforms we see that the Vintage FET/Bluey modes in Logic/Waves do bring out the ambience due to the higher levels of distortion. Studio FET/Bluey smooths out the transients without bringing out the ambience.


In the Opto: To match it with the others, on the Logic Compressor I selected the "Vintage Opto" mode & adjusted the rest of the settings as follows (thanks to SoS):

Ratio: 4:1
Knee: 0.9
Attack: 10ms
Release: 40ms
Threshold: -35.5dB

IKM, NI and Waves were set to "Compress". On the Waves the "Analog" was switched off.

I tweaked the Gain and Peak Reduction knobs on each to match them by ear (leave a comment if you'd like to know the exact values).

Disclaimer: The test track was recorded in my home studio - sorry for the bits of room tone.
Old 1st December 2015
  #6
Lives for gear
 
hemmick reef's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by MusiKLover View Post
Check these out & there are differing opinions regarding the Logic Compressor. The oft dismissed plugin can be overlooked for reasons based on conjecture and supposition. The following links help to set this straight:

ADSR: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6noBiCLImA
dancetech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZEeikUb34M -- British, thinks the compressor is worth the whole price of Logic
Logic 10.1 New Compressor Review/Demo
Logic Tutorial: The Compressor - MusicTech.net | MusicTech.net
Logic Tutorial: The Compressor - Step-by-Step - MusicTech.net | MusicTech.net
11 New Features You Need to Know About from the Logic Pro 10.1 Update | sflogicninja
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9utq5t-LSpo
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...ro-compressor/
Logic Pro X 10.1 Compressor explained
https://ask.audio/articles/logic-pro...and-a-makeover
Logic Pro 1176 and LA2A Compressor Emulations - [ BEACH HOUSE STUDIOS ]
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...plugins-tests/
https://automationlane.wordpress.com...ca-comparison/

MusicTech: "One of the most useful improvements included with the release of Logic Pro X 10.1 has been the redesigned Compressor plug-in, arguably one of the most important plug-ins in Logic’s arsenal of software outboard effects.

While the functionality of the latest compressor incarnation hasn’t changed too greatly from the original version, its redesigned GUI offers some key functional improvements in terms of the plug-in’s day-to-day operation. It also highlights some key sonic differences between it and the seven other compressor models on offer in Logic. With this in mind, we thought a revised and in-depth look at Logic Pro X’s Compressor plug-in was perhaps well overdue…"

"Many claim VCA compressors are the most universal compressors, fit for any and all purposes an engineer might need in hers or his quest for the perfect sound. I must admit I can’t seem to agree with those claims – I’m not a fan of their sound. It might be that I am doing something wrong, but to me they don’t produce pleasing results.

That being said, I still decided to go through with this test and note my observations in the same way I did with the optical and FET compressor plugins before that. The plugins being compared are:

Apple Logic Pro Compressor in Studio VCA, Vintage VCA and Classic VCA modes
Native Instruments VC 160
Waves SSL G-Master Bus Compressor

My observations:

Logic Vintage VCA and Waves SSL produced similar results. However, with the SSL the drum kit sounds ‘bigger’ (and, consequentially, further away), while the Logic’s Vintage VCA is more present or ‘in your face’.
Logic Classic VCA and NI VC 160 also mimic the same hardware unit and sound similar: both are crushing the kit quite heavily, letting the initial transients through. However, I prefer Logic’s compressor.
They all color the sound quite a bit, but Logic Studio VCA seems to do that to a lesser extent.
As in previous tests, I’ve found that Waves saturate the body of the cymbals whereas Logic’s saturation is higher up the frequency spectrum."



Universal Audio offers the Rev A “Bluestripe” and Rev E “Blackface” (including a rare 1176AE 40th Anniversary Edition).
Logic Compressor’s Vintage FET mode has a silver design and the Studio FET is black.
Waves’ CLA-76 features a ‘Bluey’ and a ‘Blacky’ mode.

From the waveforms we see that the Vintage FET/Bluey modes in Logic/Waves do bring out the ambience due to the higher levels of distortion. Studio FET/Bluey smooths out the transients without bringing out the ambience.


In the Opto: To match it with the others, on the Logic Compressor I selected the "Vintage Opto" mode & adjusted the rest of the settings as follows (thanks to SoS):

Ratio: 4:1
Knee: 0.9
Attack: 10ms
Release: 40ms
Threshold: -35.5dB

IKM, NI and Waves were set to "Compress". On the Waves the "Analog" was switched off.

I tweaked the Gain and Peak Reduction knobs on each to match them by ear (leave a comment if you'd like to know the exact values).

Disclaimer: The test track was recorded in my home studio - sorry for the bits of room tone.
Thank you for the excellent post. I'll check out some of those links...
Old 1st December 2015
  #7
Gear Maniac
 

The Logic compressor is surprisingly good I think. I have done some testing of my own comparing the Logic compressor modes to the Native Instruments Vintage Compressors (Softube made). The Logic compressor holds up really well and the different modes can sound much like the NI VC ones.

I think the VC 76 and VC 2A do really heavy compression (like 20dB or more compression) somewhat better than the Logic Studio Fet and Vintage Opto modes. But it also depends on the settings and I think the Logic compressor is actually more friendly to tweak. The knobs on the NI Vintage Compressors annoy me sometimes 20dB or more compression is a lot though! So I would rather use two compressors doing 10dB each in that case anyway.

However, the newest Classic VCA mode in the Logic compressor seem to do really heavy compression just as good as the VC 160, in my opinion.
Old 2nd December 2015
  #8
Gear Addict
 

I love the Logic X compressors. They can be transparent and/or add color depending on how you want to use them. I do use some 3rd party compressors but I always have a Logic X compressor on my mix buss. YMMV, of course
Old 9th December 2015
  #9
TNM
Lives for gear
The logic compressor is the single best compressor plugin ever included with a DAW. You can buy some character comps with full modelling for mojo but the compression behaviour is quite accurate with logic, as well as it being retina, totally resizable, and have every option for advanced control.
The multipressor is also very useful, as the crossovers are perfect phase (the cubase and mcdsp ones for example are useless on full mixes).
With the exception of some of the VERY old stuff like platinum verb and autofilter, logic has a very high quality set of plugins. I think in that sense it's definitely the most complete and impressive DAW for sure. You can actually just buy logic for 199 and realistically, without buying a single plugin, make any genre of music just with included sounds and fx. In great quality .
So a big +1 here for logic's compressor plugin.
Old 9th December 2015
  #10
Lives for gear
 
hemmick reef's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by TNM View Post
The logic compressor is the single best compressor plugin ever included with a DAW. You can buy some character comps with full modelling for mojo but the compression behaviour is quite accurate with logic, as well as it being retina, totally resizable, and have every option for advanced control.
The multipressor is also very useful, as the crossovers are perfect phase (the cubase and mcdsp ones for example are useless on full mixes).
With the exception of some of the VERY old stuff like platinum verb and autofilter, logic has a very high quality set of plugins. I think in that sense it's definitely the most complete and impressive DAW for sure. You can actually just buy logic for 199 and realistically, without buying a single plugin, make any genre of music just with included sounds and fx. In great quality .
So a big +1 here for logic's compressor plugin.
I agree. It is a complete solution to making music. The compressors seem to work well and I can't hear any real difference between them and 3rd party plugins. I have a few other soft synths by Arturia, Korg & Gforce, but Logic's synths can supply most sounds. Other fx are very good. The only recent plugin that has the edge for me is S-Gear amp modelling - for a guitarist the Logic Amp Designer doesn't sound quite there, but that may get updated at some point - Logic just gets better & better!
Old 9th December 2015
  #11
Lives for gear
 
nuthinupmysleeve's Avatar
 

I have waves platinum and I've stopped using the waves comps. The Logic comps are great.
Old 10th December 2015
  #12
TNM
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuthinupmysleeve View Post
I have waves platinum and I've stopped using the waves comps. The Logic comps are great.

it's definitely better than mot of the waves comps..

The only two waves comps worth a damn at all to me are the PIE and the 2500 which are genuinely unique plugin compressors and are a good complement to logic's.


of course this is all IMO.
Old 10th December 2015
  #13
Gear Nut
 
Modern Monster's Avatar
I have Softube Tube_Tech CL1B, TLA-100, VC Compressors, FET; Fabfilter C2; Waves API 2500; Elyssia mpressor; and i still find a place for Logic Comp. This is a great plugin - opto sounds like opto, fet sounds like fet, great gui. There is no other (ok maybe Glue in Live ) in-built comp that can do what this thing can. Take it all and leave me with Logic comp and illl be fine.
Old 10th December 2015
  #14
The logic comps are very nice. There are many other good comp plugs out there. U-HE Presswerk is a monster. UAD also have tons of great comps... 1176, LA-2A, Fairchild... etc. All a bit different, all offer great results.
Old 11th December 2015
  #15
Gear Addict
 
synthpunk's Avatar
Not sure if this article was mentioned already, but it is a very good overview of the Logic X Compressors.

Logic Pro X Plugins: Compressor Circuit Types
Old 11th December 2015
  #16
Gear Head
 

Logic has nice stock compressors, my favorite being the studio vca, and vintage opto.
Old 14th December 2015
  #17
Lives for gear
 
Mania's Avatar
 

It's crazy how different each compressor model is to eachother. Gives the plugin so much flexibility as there is a mode for everything. The sidechain filtering is A+, and the saturation is absolutely bonkers by itself. If the saturation was sold as a standalone plugin, it'd sell like hot cakes.
Old 16th December 2015
  #18
Gear Nut
 

I'm a big fan of the Logic x compressor but i did get the Waves CLA classics pack for the special character that the logic compressor is missing. You can get away only with logic compressor and if you know what you're doing the results will be great. The CLA pack just gives you instant results and you don't have to spend a day getting that lead vocal to sit just right in the mix.
Old 17th December 2015
  #19
rez
Lives for gear
 
rez's Avatar
hello everybody,

yesterday i wanted to have a closer look at the differences of the several models of the logic compressor and did a bit of an unusual test.
normally you would choose different bits of music or single instruments to test and compare the different comp models, but i decided to do a test with testtones only.
so i set up the logic test tone generator followed by a logic overdrive plugin to make the sound fuller into the logic compressor. to monitor the output i used blue cat audio freq analyst and my ears, of course.

then i did several passes with sine wave, white noise and pink noise set at -12db, thru the overdrive with 12db drive and -12db output compensation into the compressor with 8:1ratio, attack around 20ms and release around 100ms aiming for a gain reduction of around 5db with a final makeup gain to match the input into the compressor.
then i switched between the comp models and it is very revealing how different they all act and sound. to hear this even more prominent i moved the overdrive frequency on the overdrive plugin in a sweep from 20khz down to 0 and this reveals even more of how the comp alters the signal.
then i made all this tests with 20db of gain reduction while leaving all the other settings the same and with some additional makeup gain to match the input.
this more extreme settings shows even more of the differences in reaction time and sound, you literally could hear and see how different the several comp modells are "shaking the needle" even if they all are set to do "the same".

so this test might be not much relevant to real world scenario, but it shows some of the differences in the compressor circuits behaviour quite nicely.

the red comp and the opto do considerably less compression than all the others at the same settings, so sometimes it is a bit hard to compare them honestly on the same source, by just clicking thru the comp models. to get a true comparison it is better to insert six comps and set them individually so the gain reduction and output level are the same and then compare their impact on the source.

peace, rez
Old 17th December 2015
  #20
Lives for gear
 
El-Burrito's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by ollieneedham View Post
I haven't used the Logic (9 or X) compressors for quite some time. I favour the Waves CLA compressors, RVox, Klanghelm MJUC etc.

The Waves 1176 & LA2A have more character than the Logic compressors and the Klanghelm MJUC is amazing - a really great sounding plugin compressor.

I can definitely hear a difference between the Logic compressor and the 3rd party plugins.
How much Waves 1176 differs from Logic 1176?
Old 17th December 2015
  #21
TNM
Lives for gear
Quote:
Originally Posted by El-Burrito View Post
How much Waves 1176 differs from Logic 1176?
believe it or not i prefer the logic one! Then again, i do think 99% of waves compressors are crap. They only have 2 compressor plugins i like, the 2500 and the PIE (that one is underrated especially on subgroups).

To me their fairchild, la2a and 1176's are not even 50% authentic.

Logic is not a strict emulation but it's attack works more like the real one.
Old 17th December 2015
  #22
rez
Lives for gear
 
rez's Avatar
in my opinion there is a big difference between the licenced faithful recreations of old hardware compressors and the approach for things like the logic compressor types or many of the unlicenced recreations of classic designs.

an "as true as can get" recreation of the hardware should come close to the hardware in sound and gui so it really can work as a substitute and there is no difference no matter if i use the hardware or the plugin (side effects like the ad/da path not considered).

a compressor that only emulates the general type of classic compressors, be it vca, fet, opto or varimu designs, could have more freedom, both in terms of sound and the variations around that classic standards and its gui, to allow the user to get close to the original, but also extend the capabilites of the plugin above and below that original specs.
the gui color and layout is also more of a helpful tool to quickly "see" what basic circuit behaviour and sound to expect from that plugin.

so a plugin that only emulates can produce the absolute same sound at the same settings as the original (and should do this as good as it can, because that would be the expected behaviour), but can also divert from that range and so do work of its own right. all plugins of that sort should therefore also be judged for their capabilites that exceed those of the originals, because these are also functions to make music.

so with faithful recreations of classics it is fair to compare them with the hardware and with other faithful plugins 1:1, because they pretend to be the same. with plugins like the logic compressor this cannot be compared 1:1 because, the logic compressor doesn´t want to be a 1:1 copy, but it has some clearly distinguisable classic compressor types and a great range of tonal control is possible with those.
if any of this comes close or is identical to the original is not really important, because only this questions always only could be answered in the musical context and the results are also always highly subjective.

so don´t ask which one is better - try them and use your ears.
this question is only helpful if you are a user of the harware original and want to use a plugin instead - then a faithful 1:1 plugin can let you go on working with no learning curve whatsoever, but then you will also get decent results around the standard values with the logic compressor from day 1.

peace, rez
Old 3rd March 2016
  #23
Gear Maniac
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilliemarck View Post
But it also depends on the settings and I think the Logic compressor is actually more friendly to tweak.
Agreed, in comparison to the Waves more "pure" emulations also.
Logic's compressors offer important additional features not found on the emulated hardware (1176 and LA-2A): parallel compression (wet/dry mix), adjustable (and listenable!) sidechain, adjustable distortion, and even the sometimes useful timeline visual graph.

Another nice feature of Logic's compressor is the ability to switch among the various models while retaining the settings, to try out different "flavors".
Old 22nd May 2017
  #24
Deleted 99dc753
Guest
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lilliemarck View Post
The Logic compressor is surprisingly good I think. I have done some testing of my own comparing the Logic compressor modes to the Native Instruments Vintage Compressors (Softube made). The Logic compressor holds up really well and the different modes can sound much like the NI VC ones.

I think the VC 76 and VC 2A do really heavy compression (like 20dB or more compression) somewhat better than the Logic Studio Fet and Vintage Opto modes. But it also depends on the settings and I think the Logic compressor is actually more friendly to tweak. The knobs on the NI Vintage Compressors annoy me sometimes 20dB or more compression is a lot though! So I would rather use two compressors doing 10dB each in that case anyway.

However, the newest Classic VCA mode in the Logic compressor seem to do really heavy compression just as good as the VC 160, in my opinion.
Thats funny I just was mixing into the night and I want to know if someone else feels like me. I did try on snare drum diffrent HW compressors, some plug ins and stoped at logics ssl g stile compressor because the attack release movement was very smooth soundig.... my ear just snaped in, than I turnrd the soft ouput-saturation knob on and the snare got a bit more 3 D.

I work with logic since 16 years there is no way the old logic 9 compressors did sound anything like this.... apple must have changed something under the hood....
Old 25th May 2017
  #25
Lives for gear
 

If Apple sold the compressor as a separate plugin, I'd buy it.
Old 26th May 2017
  #26
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Fernand's Avatar
It's probably fair to say that it's all in the operator.

People like variety. Some like the one knob approach. The cult of comp/limiters was born of necessity, given the limited dynamic range of tape. I have a vintage outboard Orban 424A with a specific sound I love. I never did figure out the exact relationship of the controls, but it always does something cool.

But with 24 bit/96k we can make all decisions after tracking. And if you can't make good sounding tracks with just what Logic X gives you, especially after 10.2.1 (for Alchemy), you should (maybe) take up another activity.

Last edited by Fernand; 27th May 2017 at 01:23 AM..
Old 3rd July 2017
  #27
Here for the gear
 

I have the softube drawmer 1973, summit audio eq and comp, and fet compressor and trident eq for different sonic flavors. The logic pro x compressor and linear phase eq (I dont use the channel eq for some reason) in V10.3 are really well featured, sound great and are often used in my productions.

Last edited by billnineo; 3rd July 2017 at 05:59 PM.. Reason: added pro x
Old 5th July 2017
  #28
Gear Maniac
 
palebluedot's Avatar
 

Without wishing to be condescending to the thread. I really would encourage you to not trust much that you read on the internet and do a load of A/B blind testing. You can demo pretty much all 3rd party options and you might be surprised by the results

My particular advice would look beyond the GUI and the marketing.
Old 5th July 2017
  #29
Lives for gear
 
poshook's Avatar
Love the Logic Compressor. Great sound, excellent side chain features, optional saturation. BUT I really miss optional oversampling.
Old 22nd May 2019
  #30
Here for the gear
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by rez View Post
hello everybody,

yesterday i wanted to have a closer look at the differences of the several models of the logic compressor and did a bit of an unusual test.
normally you would choose different bits of music or single instruments to test and compare the different comp models, but i decided to do a test with testtones only.
so i set up the logic test tone generator followed by a logic overdrive plugin to make the sound fuller into the logic compressor. to monitor the output i used blue cat audio freq analyst and my ears, of course.

then i did several passes with sine wave, white noise and pink noise set at -12db, thru the overdrive with 12db drive and -12db output compensation into the compressor with 8:1ratio, attack around 20ms and release around 100ms aiming for a gain reduction of around 5db with a final makeup gain to match the input into the compressor.
then i switched between the comp models and it is very revealing how different they all act and sound. to hear this even more prominent i moved the overdrive frequency on the overdrive plugin in a sweep from 20khz down to 0 and this reveals even more of how the comp alters the signal.
then i made all this tests with 20db of gain reduction while leaving all the other settings the same and with some additional makeup gain to match the input.
this more extreme settings shows even more of the differences in reaction time and sound, you literally could hear and see how different the several comp modells are "shaking the needle" even if they all are set to do "the same".

so this test might be not much relevant to real world scenario, but it shows some of the differences in the compressor circuits behaviour quite nicely.

the red comp and the opto do considerably less compression than all the others at the same settings, so sometimes it is a bit hard to compare them honestly on the same source, by just clicking thru the comp models. to get a true comparison it is better to insert six comps and set them individually so the gain reduction and output level are the same and then compare their impact on the source.

peace, rez
Wow - I never have tried using test tones to demo compressor plugins.... interesting.
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