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Ableton Live 10, when? Virtual Instrument Plugins
Old 12th February 2018
  #541
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by toowrongfoo View Post
I was thinking the same exact thing. Maybe everyone is just making music with it?
Moving back to 9 Suite. Hopefully they will iron out the performance issues in future updates. Ableton used to be efficient as it was designed for live use. I'm having trouble playing the one new Wavetable instrument + echo delay without artifacts and crackling.

I love their software and workflow so I don't mind supporting them while they hopefully optimize performance.
Old 12th February 2018
  #542
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locojohn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by filterfreak View Post
6 years in the making and all we get is a synth and a delay?
And a pedal emulation, you forgot! And built in Max for Live. And advanced support for Push 2 owners :-) And a few fixes in the arrangement.

That said, I am not upgrading right now. The upgrade price is too high, while I don't need all of the implemented features, plus some of them (the new automation mode) were implemented in a weird way. Perhaps, later.

Andrejs
Old 12th February 2018
  #543
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locojohn's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave.R View Post
my opinion is if you own Live 9 you're getting very little for your money by upgrading to 10
Agreed. Even with discount for early beta testers.

Andrejs
Old 12th February 2018
  #544
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tsrono's Avatar
 

Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by Entrainer View Post
Moving back to 9 Suite. Hopefully they will iron out the performance issues in future updates. Ableton used to be efficient as it was designed for live use. I'm having trouble playing the one new Wavetable instrument + echo delay without artifacts and crackling.

I love their software and workflow so I don't mind supporting them while they hopefully optimize performance.
I was watching a video on Wavetable earlier and was shocked to notice it spiking the CPU usage meter to around 25% just playing a chord. May've been an earlier build (video was just released however) and it of course could've been on an underpowered laptop or something...but nonetheless I was not expecting any native Live device to eat up that much processing power in seemingly normal usage.
Old 12th February 2018
  #545
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Is this your first time with live? That is normal. Live is like sonar was in that it spreads that out as you add stuff. Freaked me out at first. But you can duplicate that same track 20 times and get similar CPU results. At least that is how 8 and 9 worked for me.
Old 12th February 2018
  #546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Entrainer View Post
Moving back to 9 Suite. Hopefully they will iron out the performance issues in future updates. Ableton used to be efficient as it was designed for live use. I'm having trouble playing the one new Wavetable instrument + echo delay without artifacts and crackling.

I love their software and workflow so I don't mind supporting them while they hopefully optimize performance.
Performance issues? So the response that I just made IS an actual issue with 10 vs 9.7?

I wonder why? All they did was a few changes.
Old 12th February 2018
  #547
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by toowrongfoo View Post
Is this your first time with live? That is normal. Live is like sonar was in that it spreads that out as you add stuff. Freaked me out at first. But you can duplicate that same track 20 times and get similar CPU results. At least that is how 8 and 9 worked for me.
lol definitely not my first time, I've been using it since Live 8. And that's exactly why one native synth pulling 25% CPU shocked me...I don't remember ever seeing that happen in the past.
Old 12th February 2018
  #548
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Hmmmmmmmm. Well anyways, I'm all for CPU optimization. Even reason did it (now I can go to max bars before it starts to sputter, only half before)

Studio one did it. Reaper is still the benchmark for greatness in that area (but I don't like using reaper)
Old 13th February 2018
  #549
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsrono View Post
And that's exactly why one native synth pulling 25% CPU shocked me...I don't remember ever seeing that happen in the past.
It's always been this way. For example, here's a 2005 thread about Operator's high CPU usage.

Ableton Forum • View topic - very high CPU Usage with Operator. Is it just me?

Regardless of the instrument, the CPU requirements really come down to the patch.
Old 13th February 2018
  #550
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by toowrongfoo View Post
Performance issues? So the response that I just made IS an actual issue with 10 vs 9.7?

I wonder why? All they did was a few changes.
Yes, I'm doing A/B tests right now between 9.7.5 and 10.0.1. Same imported MIDI file, same Serum synth preset. Ableton 10 glitches out every few seconds whereas Ableton 9 does not.

I'm sure they'll nail the issue soon, it's a week 1 release.
Old 13th February 2018
  #551
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I've only had a couple of hours between sessions to wade thru since downloading but so far it's stable and no performance glitches. Wavetable does seem to use a bit more resources than Serum but it's not a huge hog. Wavetable, to me, does a bigger nod to the Access Virus than to Serum. And for those complaining about the upgrade price, I think Echo alone is worth the $....I've certainly spent that much on an FX plug-in and Echo has a huge spectrum of sound design possibilities. I've loaded up the same projects in both 9.7.5 and 10 and don't see any performance differences to speak of...no problem with tons of plug ins running at 256. Oh, I love being able to update and/or download packs directly from the browser...not having to leave the program is a bonus.

I've merely scratched the surface but overall, I'm very happy with it. Wish I could get the color graphics to match the 9.5 set up I'm used to but it's just a shade off and that bugs me. So I'll create a brand new skin...first world problems.
Old 13th February 2018
  #552
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Entrainer's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3rdpath View Post
Oh, I love being able to update and/or download packs directly from the browser...not having to leave the program is a bonus.
This is a good feature.

Curious to know, what are your computer specs?

I'm on a Mid-2014 MBP, 2.5 GHZ i7, 16GB Ram. I was "hoping" to get another year of life out of it...
Old 13th February 2018
  #553
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3rdpath's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Entrainer View Post
This is a good feature.

Curious to know, what are your computer specs?

I'm on a Mid-2014 MBP, 2.5 GHZ i7, 16GB Ram. I was "hoping" to get another year of life out of it...
I was using pretty much the same MBP as you until mine imploded last year. Went back to 2010 cMP tower 12 core 3.33, 64gb ram and OS 10.12.6. Missing some bells and whistles but it's strong like bull!
Old 13th February 2018
  #554
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Entrainer View Post
Yes, I'm doing A/B tests right now between 9.7.5 and 10.0.1. Same imported MIDI file, same Serum synth preset. Ableton 10 glitches out every few seconds whereas Ableton 9 does not.

I'm sure they'll nail the issue soon, it's a week 1 release.
(serious poker face on)

What a f....ing drag. I mean honestly, while other companies are trying to optimize, they are dragging their collective a....s?

I'm bummed. In the daw world we shouldn't see this. BTW I went through this with reason and they fixed it to some degree. All hope is not lost! (but it's still weird)
Old 13th February 2018
  #555
i think it was a tom cosm video i saw where he loaded up like 50 wavetables and everything just kept humming along. this was back when the public beta was first released so things may have changed. but anecdotally, for me, live 10 performs at least the same as 9.
Old 13th February 2018
  #556
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Thread Starter
Quote:
Originally Posted by smutek View Post
It's always been this way. For example, here's a 2005 thread about Operator's high CPU usage.

Ableton Forum • View topic - very high CPU Usage with Operator. Is it just me?

Regardless of the instrument, the CPU requirements really come down to the patch.
Yeah, similar situation as that was likely when Operator was brand new. People on weaker machines complaining of high CPU usage, at least one person on a relatively powerful computer was seeing lower numbers. Makes perfect sense.

CPU requirements definitely come down to the patch and computer its running on. Like I said in the first place, I've just never personally seen a native Live device suck 25%ish percent on the CPU meter of any machine. My experience is obviously not inclusive of all times and situations.

My implication simply was that Wavetable is obviously pretty intensive in relation to many other native instruments in Live, perhaps more so than many current users have ever seen...which could of course be a serious issue for certain users. I've not touched 10, beta or actual, so I'm just observing, no first hand experience here.
Old 14th February 2018
  #557
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Just experimenting in v10 this morning and loaded up a track with:
3-Serum
2-Wavetable
1-Synapse Legend
1-Tal Juno
2-drum racks
2-Kick vs2
4-ableton instruments

Running a buffer of 128, I'm pushing around 28% Usage without a glitch.
Old 14th February 2018
  #558
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worm's Avatar
 

3rd path, what computer?
Old 14th February 2018
  #559
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Quote:
Originally Posted by worm View Post
3rd path, what computer?
2010 cMP 12 core 3.33, 64GB RAM, OS 10.12.6.

My special-order maxed-out 2013 MBP ( that died last year ) would have never be able to crunch these numbers. After its untimely demise, I bought a revamped cMP for $1600 ( about half of what my MBP cost ) and could not be happier. And so far, v10 live is smooth as silk. Been wading thru plugs ( Slate, Sound Toys, Serum, Synapse, Izotope, NI, Audio Damage, GForce, ETC...no problems.
Old 20th February 2018
  #560
I did notice that wavetable used more juice, but no other performances problems so far. I’m on a mid-2014 mbp too (maxed out 15”). Hoping to get at least another good 5 years out of it
Old 20th February 2018
  #561
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Old 21st February 2018
  #562
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Sebastian N's Avatar
 

i've been putting off working in 10 too much (except small sketches in bed) because of some client work where i didn't want to risk the integrity of the project so i kept it in 9. today was the first day that i tried to do some serious editing in 10, opening up some older tracks for someone that needed some alternative arrangements. jesus christ i hated every minute of this new bs layout/view. even copying things doesn't work the way it used to unless in automation mode. can't see what the hell i'm selecting because the grid is gone so i always have to zoom in and out. terrible

i've been using live for the last 12 years on a daily basis. i recorded and mixed full band albums with it plus my personal electronic stuff. i normally fly through it using shortcuts and reflexes etc, just like anybody who is proficient with any piece of software. but this is just messed up. on the surface i never thought it would be this bad. i tried it when it was in beta, but i just played with the new devices and stuff. like i said, didn't do any serious work with it because of previous commitments. i'm sure i will get used to it but i don't see any benefit to this new view of the arrangement. all i can find is stuff that annoys the hell out of me.

i know some other guys were complaining about these things on the internal beta feedback pages. what's your experience been like?


ps: besides wavetable just killing my late 2013 mbp. works decently on the late 2014 mac mini but pushes the cpu quite hard with one instance open at 25%. but this i can live with as i mostly record outboard stuff anyways
Old 22nd February 2018
  #563
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MusiKLover's Avatar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian N View Post
i've been putting off working in 10 too much (except small sketches in bed) because of some client work where i didn't want to risk the integrity of the project so i kept it in 9. today was the first day that i tried to do some serious editing in 10, opening up some older tracks for someone that needed some alternative arrangements. jesus christ i hated every minute of this new bs layout/view. even copying things doesn't work the way it used to unless in automation mode. can't see what the hell i'm selecting because the grid is gone so i always have to zoom in and out. terrible

i've been using live for the last 12 years on a daily basis. i recorded and mixed full band albums with it plus my personal electronic stuff. i normally fly through it using shortcuts and reflexes etc, just like anybody who is proficient with any piece of software. but this is just messed up. on the surface i never thought it would be this bad. i tried it when it was in beta, but i just played with the new devices and stuff. like i said, didn't do any serious work with it because of previous commitments. i'm sure i will get used to it but i don't see any benefit to this new view of the arrangement. all i can find is stuff that annoys the hell out of me.

i know some other guys were complaining about these things on the internal beta feedback pages. what's your experience been like?


ps: besides wavetable just killing my late 2013 mbp. works decently on the late 2014 mac mini but pushes the cpu quite hard with one instance open at 25%. but this i can live with as i mostly record outboard stuff anyways
I suppose folks previously had used Logic 9 for many years; recent improvements have gotten even the old guard such as Armin Van Buuren to use Logic Pro X currently. I can foresee doing the same with Live 9. Perhaps I'll upgrade in 2020.
Old 22nd February 2018
  #564
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sebastian N View Post
i know some other guys were complaining about these things on the internal beta feedback pages. what's your experience been like?
Ableton 10 shares navigation now with Logic X. Confusing for your muscle memory if you used strictly Live 9. Great times if you switch between both DAWs and if you use small computer screens. Which Logic´s navigation is tailored for.
Old 8th March 2018
  #565
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gilson's Avatar
 

Anyone using this update on a 2015 Macbook 13" running 10.4.6?
If so, what is your experience so far? Need to choose between Logic Pro X 10.4 or Ableton 10. My internal disk has only 86GB storage left. So I can only use one on this machine. Unless I use an external HD for the sound libraries. Anyone with experience in the same sort setup?

All help appreciated
Old 9th March 2018
  #566
Quote:
Originally Posted by gilson View Post
Anyone using this update on a 2015 Macbook 13" running 10.4.6?
If you've no plans to upgrade your OS then I think you'll have an easy choice, Live 10 requires 10.11.6 or higher.

Live 10 Minimum System Requirements – Ableton

For what it's worth, I'm running Live 10 on a 13" mid-2014 MacBook Pro, 2.6 i5, with High Sierra, 10.13.3
Old 11th March 2018
  #567
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gilson's Avatar
 

Quote:
Originally Posted by smutek View Post
If you've no plans to upgrade your OS then I think you'll have an easy choice, Live 10 requires 10.11.6 or higher.

Live 10 Minimum System Requirements – Ableton

For what it's worth, I'm running Live 10 on a 13" mid-2014 MacBook Pro, 2.6 i5, with High Sierra, 10.13.3
Hi! Thanks
Yeah I am on 10.12.6, MP 2015 with 8GB of RAM.
Old 29th March 2018
  #568
Gear Addict
 
filterfreak's Avatar
 

I couldn´t resist updating to live 10 and I am really surprised how good the new stuff sounds. Wavetable is great, so are the new effects and packs.
Soundwise Live made a huge step forewards!

Glad I updated!
Old 9th May 2018
  #569
Gear Nut
 

Posted in Elektronauts as well. I'm mostly a hardware person but I'm getting my feet wet with Ableton 10. Here's a little jam I put together with my mouse and keyboard

Old 9th May 2018
  #570
I'm sure glad it has finally arrived!
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