Mixing before mastering advice!

[Showcase]

To really optimize the mix before mastering it would be awesome to have a mastering engineer listen to the track(s) one is mixing to spot out problems!

Im one of those who wants to mix down to a stereo track using no stems (perhaps just a song stem)

So far, when I´ve sent tracks to mastering facilities no one cares to give any input on the mix even if I´ve asked them to give their opinion before mastering, they just seem to do their best and go on to next session!

So I thought I´d go through gearslutz this time and see if anyone is interested in this and ofcourse get the mastering job!
Its in the rock genre, mixed pretty much like CLA

/All the best, Mattias

[Red Mastering]

I provide free mix review for my clients (those who choose to pay for masters)
but from my knowledge I am not the only one,
many ppl here do it,
anyway this is very important part of mastering process,
Actually many projects I mastered, focus was on re-mixing songs, and after my precise notes for client - mixes needed very little processing during master to sound great

[drumdrum]

Don't worry what the ME thinks... Seriously, get the track to sound how YOU want it to sound before approaching MEs.

Of course if its a technical note you want then fine, but if its a case of asking the ME "does this sound good to you?" Then you may as well ask the guy on the street.

I was told: get the mix to sound how you want. Dont rely on MEs to "fix"anything. Their job should ideally be nothing more than making it competitively as loud as the current genre dictates and making the album sound consistent volume wise.
Basically, if it needs to be fixed in the master, then there is a problem in the mix.

words I try to live by.

Sounds to me that the OP needs some confidence in their mixes rather than an ME. If your stuff sounds like CLAs then I'm sure it sounds great already.

[Showcase]

Sounds great, Its the way it should be, but I doesnt feel its the case here in Sweden, no comunication at all at the larger facilities, I´ve said several times "call me up before mastering so we could talk before mastering" but nothing... it just comes back mastered without any information.

[Showcase]

Originally Posted by drumdrum

Don't worry what the ME thinks... Seriously, get the track to sound how YOU want it to sound before approaching MEs.

Of course if its a technical note you want then fine, but if its a case of asking the ME "does this sound good to you?" Then you may as well ask the guy on the street.

I was told: get the mix to sound how you want. Dont rely on MEs to "fix"anything. Their job should ideally be nothing more than making it competitively as loud as the current genre dictates and making the album sound consistent volume wise.
Basically, if it needs to be fixed in the master, then there is a problem in the mix.

words I try to live by.

Sounds to me that the OP needs some confidence in their mixes rather than an ME. If your stuff sounds like CLAs then I'm sure it sounds great already.

Yes, Im pretty confident on the mixes, its just that I´d like to hear at least some opinion on the mixes, to much low freq material etc... and only because I´d like to finetune my work to the best, but I get nothing, even when I´ve asked for it...

[mastringshuset]

Pm sent :-)

[Storyville]

It's good to have some kind of working relationship with the mastering engineer. Feedback is useful, but honestly when I have provided feedback for records I've been asked to master the clients usually gets confused and give up. Of course I'm usually giving feedback along the lines of how not to clip your master output and those guys are usually not experienced engineers. Point being however, it's not monetarily in a mastering engineer's interest to give feedback. BUT if you have a professional rapport with the mastering engineer that's a different story. There's more trust.

It takes a while to find someone you work well with. But when you do you find it's definitely worth the effort.

[ScottHull]

Most of the engineers at Masterdisk including myself take this sort of request very seriously. Especially in light of the trend to buss eq and compress before mastering. It's often easier to help solve some of the big issues within the balance of the mix prior, than it is to try to correct for them with eq after.
Many times I feel like I'm trying to solve my clients listening room problems. In general, if they could hear what I am hearing - they would change their mix... So attending a consulting session can be very informative. If not attended, there is a bigger challenge to communicate the real problems.

Finally, from the mastering seat, I never know if the problems are related to poor recordings, mix technique, or speakers and room acoustics. But with experience, you can make some pretty good guesses, and help dial the mix in and build trust. I never tell someone how to mix. I simply try to communicate what's getting in the way of it being great.

[Virtalahde]

I'm often asked for this, and I also like to offer a helping hand (ear!) if I suspect there might be issues with the mixes. Often the schedules are pretty tight and I get mixes that were done yesterday - that gives no time for tweaking, and I don't comment on the mixes unless there are some very serious problems with them. Sometimes I might have noticed an issue, but I still do my job and give the option for fixing the mixes for the revision, because it might be easier to prove my point like that.

Usually, I try to not make comments on instrument balance, unless something is seriously out of whack. My comments tend to be from the ME's perspective, and I listen the thing as a whole. Is some part of the spectrum too full, is something missing.. That sort of stuff.

I like to think my perspective gives a whole different view into the music. I might say that the things are working fine, but the chorus feels a little darker and more closed-in, and perhaps a tad more of that brighter percussive stuff would make the chorus move along better.

Last year I had a case on which the album mixes were absolutely terrible. I mean a really seriously bad and confusing sounding that just made you angry. I had never heard things sound that bad before. Bedroom mixing type of a guy.

I did a sample for him, explained very briefly why things are not working (the directions were very general, like "watch what happens in the low end of those reverbs"), that sort of stuff. The client thanked, came back like two weeks after that and the mixes were so much better it was incredible.

I cut an OK sounding album from them and I have seen few favorable reviews from that album.

Without the mix feedback, it could have never happened. A mastering engineer is the fresh view, and sometimes it's just very useful to bring the ME into picture a little earlier on.

[Technologyworks]

I'd echo everything Jaakko said.

From my perspective, the better the mixes, the easier it is for me to deliver a great master. I have regular clients who send me mixes for an overview before mastering and it's really useful. Vocal too sibilant in the chorus? kik drum too boomy? those sort of issues are much better dealt with in the mix than at the mastering stage.

[Mastering7]

Originally Posted by Showcase

So far, when I´ve sent tracks to mastering facilities no one cares to give any input on the mix even if I´ve asked them to give their opinion before mastering, they just seem to do their best and go on to next session.

/All the best, Mattias

I offer free consultation to eliminate mixing problems before mastering. I'm with you in the project and do my best to make it sound as good as possible. It's not only business also a passion to lift up music a higher level.

[SASMastering]

It's standard, the biggest houses will largely expect very good mixes, no mastering engineer who cares about music or their client will master something without communicating at various degrees with their clients. If there is a problem it is best for everyone for it to be resolved. I offer a more extensive mix appraisal when I have been paid for the job up front or with clients whom I have a relationship. For free previews for potential new clients it tends to be if there is something very out of balance and then it is a gratis pointer but not in depth analysis. (unless it is a client who I have worked with before).

Working with a mastering engineer is a relationship that develops as well as a client/service provider scenario.

[PBM]

Originally Posted by Technologyworks

I'd echo everything Jaakko said.

From my perspective, the better the mixes, the easier it is for me to deliver a great master. I have regular clients who send me mixes for an overview before mastering and it's really useful. Vocal too sibilant in the chorus? kik drum too boomy? those sort of issues are much better dealt with in the mix than at the mastering stage.

Same here; most of our client contact is actually through the mix engineers, so this has become expected from those with whom we work regularly.

Cheers,

Eric