Help!! Need Mastering Engineer!! Budget $500 Max!!

[illacov]

I'm having the shittiest time finding a mastering engineer through web searches and besides the big names on here, I need more results.

The music is hip hop, but with a live music aspect to it, alot of live instrumentation, minus sequenced drums and keys. Lots of guitars and Fender J Bass.

So far I found one person in California, his name is Hans Dekline he has a facility called Sound Bites Dog. His work sounds pretty damn good for the genres he's worked in plus his resume looks pretty good.

It would be nice (sigh) if I could have a better assortment of people to choose from. I know my budget limits people, but Im beyond certain that there's more than one or two good Mastering Engineers out there that charge 500 or less for a full 16 track lp.

On a side note I had a weird experience with a nice guy/studio owner today.

First off, I was a little hesitant to go to his facility because he does mastering but owns absolutely no mastering equipment meaning boutique compressors or mastering quality monitors, no vintage eqs or reel to reel. His facility is pretty nice, floating floors, absolutely dead rooms, total isolation. He does have a Soundworks console, but its JUST for monitoring while people record. (Jaw still on the floor) He does own some nice pres (Api, Neve), however his thing is all about instant recall and plug ins.

I can respect the workflow, however the results are what always convince me not the philosophy that spawned it.

SO I listened and low and behold, he's using the same shit I have at my studio.
(Plus this is really the kicker, I saw H2O pop up about 9 times when "certain" programs were loading.

Waves, Timeworks Mastering Compressor etc...-9 rms levels all over the place, but the kicker is the board is cranked up while he's monitoring. So his mixes (duh) will sound big on a cranked up board with shitloads of headroom, but as Ive discovered car stereos do not enjoy this luxury, so he's giving himself false impressions of how good his Mastering work sounds (as well as the client). Cuz it sounds less than desireable at quieter levels.

Recording wise he's pretty good.

Mastering Im not sure its my cup of tea at his facility, plus he wants 400 bux to master an LP there!! With CRACKS!!!!

We actually had a healthy little gear slutz type debate about ITB versus OTB and he gave me every reason in the book why he wont do it, minus the fact he owns very little outboard dynamics processing.

"Oh what about instant recall??"

To which I replied "If you turn your compressor into a plug in (like Cubase SX3 or 4) then there's no need to patch or re patch anything. Plus you could mix with all your faders at unity gain (passive) and you wouldn't to recall anything except eq if you even use it on your board.

"Well I think that my plug ins are better than anything I have right now out of the box."

To which I replied "So your RNC is not up to snuff with any of your vst plugins?? Your dbx 160x is not up to snuff with any of your plug ins??"

He said "No."

That was the end of the discussion...yes someone will definitely flame me for this, but obviously if you think that your 160x or your RNC is useless compared to plug ins like Waves RenComp then Im sorry, in my book your are just WRONG. You're not opinionated, you are not confused you're just wrong. Sorry.

The reason I point this out is because, he felt the exact same way about compressors like the STC8 and the VariMu. He didnt see the need for them in the mastering realm, therefore I didn't see how he could fit my needs either.

Not even one mid to high end eq was in his possession.

The best part was how he told me that his $3500 board (Soundworks 52 input board, from "Prince's old B room") "ruined" his mixes, which is why he didn't mix on it. It must have ruined Prince's mixes too!! LOL

I finished his conversation by saying, "I can understand how you have your work schedule and you want fast results and flexibility, but every album you're referencing as a symbol of good mixing and mastering, has been mixed on analog consoles, with outboard. End of Story. If you love The Roots, then you'll realize they could give a **** about some ICs on a mixer or transistor circuits on a channel lowering the fidelity of a source. That's not a problem, in the music world thats called "MOJO" aka "VIBE"

He even admitted that stuff he had mixed OTB had better low end but less hi end.

I told him, Hi fidelity is something you can accomplish in the mix with eq and creative processing/mixing technique, but superb bass is lost for most people who knock hardware, unless they are truly accomplished at mixing ITB and crossing the borders between ITB and OTB, using hardware inserts on ITB mixes and such.

Plus he couldnt understand how I got my kicks to hit so hard.

I said "DBX 163X on kick is ****ing awesome" ..... It was like if it had to do with hardware I was speaking Greek to the guy. I think in the end he's going to mess around and trying using hardware inserts and have an epiphany. He said he wants to still chat and talk whatever, which is ok with me, I'm just not going to let him master my album. He'll probably call me one day and be like you know what you were right, but I only use the BEST hardware compressors. This one is from Prince's C room. LOL....(Does anyone else find this hilarious that he uses this board as a selling point for his facility only to find out that its not USED at all? Except for headphone mixes?? What a nice piece of studio furniture he has there. I literally was cleaning the dust off the pots while I was there, wishing he would sell this board to me for something ridiculous like 500 bux.)


Anyways....PHEW

I want a Mastering Engineer that is not taking a stand against better convention to prove a point. I want somebody who knows what the **** they are doing and is not afraid to admit that old people were here first and that they did quite a few things right with the way music is made BEFORE we were born.

I would like a Mastering Engineer who USES their gear to help their client, not just own it to draw people in. I want someone who knows the difference (aurally) between Waves RenComp and an Alan Smart C2.

Please somebody anybody, I got 500 bucks to spend on mastering my album, can I get some qualified people to help me? I took an extra year mixing our album OTB, I like hardware. Where are the people with brains when I need them??

The other person I have spoken to is named Pat and he runs a facility outside Albany New York called Sandcreek Studios. Pat's a pretty good guy to talk to, he's an older fellow (Im 30) he's pretty outspoken and very funny. First off, my curiousity was peaked when he told me he didn't need my business. I found this response from him to be absolutely hilarious. Of course he wants my business but Im sure he was serious, cuz this guys got clients with Grammy Plaques.

His rate was very good and he does everything analog. One of the things that caught my eye was a claim he made on his studio's site about Manley Slams.

According to Pat his studio is the ONLY studio in NORTH AMERICA to own 4 Manley Slams. I have no idea what this implies, only that he has 4 of those things in their purple glory racked up in his studio.

Remember the ONLY studio in NORTH AMERICA to have 4 Manley Slams.

His work sounded damn good as well. Better than some that charged more, plus he's within driving distance from me.

He nearly laughed me off the phone when I asked him if he uses plug ins for mastering.

So obviously you guys see my situation, the internet has not helped me find what Im looking for except for 2 (pretty good) guys.

Anyone else care to add on to this thread or suggest a few people to go to?

Bass heavy hip hop music, done in a Roots/A Tribe Called Quest vein.

Help me out here.

Peace
Illumination

[Bump Music]

I can only speak for myself when I say, $500 for 16 songs is EXTREMELY cheap. Not that you won't find someone.... but I highly doubt you'll find someone good.

Just my experience and two cents. Good luck in your search.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by illacov

Anyone else care to add on to this thread or suggest a few people to go to?

If you want someone that is good you are going to have to pay period.

16 songs for $500 roughly works out to $31.25 per song.

Does that sound fair to you?

You want someone who has all the esoteric gear, plus the rooms, plus the ears & experience to agree to do your project for a rate that home studios are charging?

I think minimum you should expect to pay at least $100 per song for someone who is really good and has some kind of rep. If the mixes are good than they can knock out even faster.

[Abear75]

I think minimum you should expect to pay at least $100 per song for someone who is really good and has some kind of rep. If the mixes are good than they can knock out even faster.


+1

[Thomas W. Bethe]

Unfortunately we seem to get a lot of people who are at the end of their budget and are out of time and the phone call to us usually goes like this. "Hi this is (insert name) I have just finished mixing and my CD release party is two weeks away and I need you to do some mastering" "I heard some stuff you did for (insert name) and it was very well done" "We spent a bundle on recording so I don't have a lot of money for the mastering" "We did 24 songs and I need them mastered and I only have $200 left in the budget" "Whata think?"

I then politely tell them that for 24 songs and for the money they have about all I can do is top and tail them and sequence them in order. The reply is always the same "no I mean I need these mastered and I need it done today or tomorrow because we are facing a deadline at the CD replicator." At that point I never know what to say..... Then the person drops the clinker "the 24 songs add up to about 90 minutes of music and I was wondering if you could find a way to make them fit on a standard CD"

So I have come up with a couple of suggestions

1. Find a good mastering house BEFORE you finish your recording/mixing. Ask them what their rates are and BUDGET it as part of the album cost. Don't wait until you have finished the album and then start your search and don't spend all your money if you still have the mastering to do.

2. Talk to the mastering engineer and tell him the time table you are working under and when you will be bringing in the material. He has other clients to service and may not be able to fit you in when you need the mastering if you don't keep him in the loop. Communication with the mastering engineer is the single most important thing if you want a successful mastering experience.

3. If possible play some of the songs for the mastering engineer to see if there are any glaring errors that should be fixed in the mix BEFORE you are finished mixing. (We provide time at no cost to the artist to listen to and advise them as they are finishing the mix-downs and I know other places that will do the same thing.)

4. Don't plan the date of your CD release party BEFORE you are finished recording and mastering.

5. Don't try and shoe horn 90 minutes of material on to an 80 minute CD.

6. Try and get a good night's sleep before the mastering session. Don't come from an all night mix-down session to the mastering session and expect things to go well.

7. Have all your materials with you when you come to the mastering session so you don't have to call your cousin or the mix engineer to bring over the materials that you forgot.

8. Bring some CDs that you are familiar with to the mastering session so that you can hear what the room and speakers sound like. This will help you make sonic decisions and will help acclimate your ears to the listening environment.

9. Don't be in a hurry to get the session done to save a couple of dollars. A couple of extra minutes spent in the session itself can save you from having to come back and re do parts of the session because you forgot to take out the 30 second false start on one of the tunes.

10. Be prepared to pay for the session when it is done. This can be via cash or check or credit card but ask about payment methods before the session with the mastering engineer to see which payment method they prefer and IF they accept credit cards and which ones they accept.

Best of luck with your recording/mixing and mastering. I hope you find someone good for the price you can afford.

[blip01]

Our rate would be [moderator edit: please conduct actual business and talk money via IM. Thanks.]

The only plugs I use are the Sadie Pow-r and limiter. Everything else is outboard.

Check out our site, I work in the Blue room.

Good luck!

[Masterer]

Looks to me like this one belongs on the "where to" sub-forum.

[jayfrigo]

Originally Posted by Masterer

Looks to me like this one belongs on the "where to" sub-forum.

Indeed it does. I'll move it there now...

And price quotes and such should be done via IM.

General comments, recommendations of people you've used, and subtle "pick me" posts are OK, but conducting actual business shouldn't be on the public board.

[blip01]

Sorry, didn't catch that in the sticky!

[Nancy M]

To the original poster:

Please check your PM's

kind regards,
Nancy Matter
Moonlight Mastering

[L_Nix_Mastering]

At L. NIX&CO. CD MASTERING&MANUFACTURING and go to the "What Is Mastering" section.