Starting and building a recording studio

[Rider365]

wow from what ive seen so far this is a great turn out ! No reason to argue with each other as opinions will differ but if you look at the overall picture you guys are saying nearly the same thing with a minor difference in opinions. I have done my Market Analysis or MR as your putting it. I am mostly tracking vocals right now because it appears i wont be able to afford an acoustic room even if purchasing a building on our budget so we will intend on promoting mastering and mixing track-outs from bands that track there own stuff. So we can cover half of that market until we can afford to bring them in. Zoning is a definite issue and i have an inspector on hand when the time comes.

There is a great amount of information here that id like to read over and i will respond accordingly. But please stop arguing.

Thanks

[Rider365]

Originally Posted by therealbigd

dependent on the type of music, that can just be a mix suite with a microphone! yes we've been through this already i know but just saying.

PS zones and permits and stuff - what do they actually cost? or is it just one of these made up rumours that your house is a complete death trap that nobody else can walk into until you've spent 2 billion dollars making it safe?

Zoning for noise ordinances and Client safety.

[johndykstra]

Zoning means it's in a commercial district. This means it may or may not be a more expensive property... depends.

permits mean a professional has to pull papers to have the work looked at. The permit itself is generally affordable. However, you aren't going to find someone who will pull a permit, then allow you to do the work. It's expensive because now you have to pay a work force.

You won't be able to properly insure your investment without permits. You can probably pay for the policy, but when something happens, don't expect to be paid off if they can say "well, how do we know this was built properly?"

[johndykstra]

I hope I am not coming off as arguing. I got nothin but love here.

[johndykstra]

Another thread of similar ilk currently running:

Is it worth gearing up to start a part time commercial studio?

and another:

Planning on starting a studio... Advice?

[StewartFang]

I agree with dykstra...my estimate is light...I'm working on a room where there is a $100,000 construction budget...and the work that is being done would have cost $250,000 if one the partners wasn't a contractor


so yeah...but I think with $15,000 you can get something happening...like I said...a start

The RBD is just swimming in a different pool...the OP has already stated that he wants our input not just a wing nut yelling about how $10,000 of gear is a perfect amount of studio start up

[Freq AudioWorks]

There's so many ways people are starting up studios that it's pretty much useless to argue about what is the "right" way of doing it.

Some people start with 25k and succeed
Some people start with 50k and fail
Some people start with 80k and succeed
Some people start with 150k and fail

And the list goes on, you get my point.

I myself am in the process of starting a place, and my total budget including some new gear purchases, marketing etc. and of course the building of the place is roughly around 90k$, converted from local currency. I can't still say if I will succeed or not, but at least I tried in case it doesn't work out.

I'm not planning on focusing solely on music recording though. I will have a strong focus in radio commercials, composition for film / TV / games as well as recording artists and in the downtime working with singers trying to write the most catchy, radio-like pop tunes in hopes of one of them making it :P Hell, I've even done a soundscape for an art exhibition once! And that in my opinion is the thing that studios nowadays need in order to succeed, not being stuck on recording rock bands who want to become the next big thing.

[therealbigd]

Originally Posted by Rider365

Zoning for noise ordinances and Client safety.

So providing your property is safe (which it should be ANYWAY) and soundproof to the extent that your work requires, this doesn't have to cost anything?

[Rider365]

Originally Posted by therealbigd

So providing your property is safe (which it should be ANYWAY) and soundproof to the extent that your work requires, this doesn't have to cost anything?

There is no fee for zoning an already established building. Only when constructing a new building do you have to pay to zone the building i believe. I may be wrong. Im not very knowledgable about that aspect.

[izunnamusic]

Originally Posted by Rider365

Was searching around google and found this pretty dope site. (Gear Slutz naturally lol). A site im sure i would like to stay a part of for a long while. With that said, my inquires stand as such.

We have already obtained our state license and currently applying for our federal license.

What state are you in? I didn't know state and federal license is required to own a studio or am I reading this wrong?

[Rider365]

Originally Posted by izunnamusic

What state are you in? I didn't know state and federal license is required to own a studio or am I reading this wrong?

You dont have to have a state license to run an at home studio for personal reasons.

[Rider365]

Soooooo..... hate to be a party crasher but we got an SBA loan (Its not impossible, but you did have me doubting our venture). And with their assistance we have successfully applied for half a dozen grants. Just waiting for responses. And we are listed in their contacts for government contracts (mostly applicable to veterans for musical en devours, as we offer music lessons). We are PURCHASING our building so thank you to who ever suggested that, great way to go. I will keep everyone updated on the our adventure ! Eventually i plan on posting the before and after pics along with a few progress pics!

[johndykstra]

congrats!!

[Piedpiper]

good to see you going for it!

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by Rider365

We are PURCHASING our building so thank you to who ever suggested that, great way to go. I will keep everyone updated on the our adventure ! Eventually i plan on posting the before and after pics along with a few progress pics!

Owning the building is an important part of the studio business. Any facility like that (video, recording, etc.) is also partly in the real-estate business - so well-done, that man!

Also remember that very few of your customers will know the difference between a plate of meat and a Neumann M149, but they will know about a nice room and musical instruments, backline and pianos. When it comes to gear, remember the old army expression bullsh1t-beats-brains! Indirect lighting, nice furnishings and a great live room sells better than some DAW or plugins that are out of date almost as soon as you have bought them.

Oh, and good luck BTW!

[therealbigd]

Originally Posted by The Byre

Also remember that very few of your customers will know the difference between a plate of meat and a Neumann M149, but they will know about a nice room and musical instruments, backline and pianos. When it comes to gear, remember the old army expression bullsh1t-beats-brains! Indirect lighting, nice furnishings and a great live room sells better than some DAW or plugins that are out of date almost as soon as you have bought them.

Agreed.

We have an 80 channel Amek. It could sell for a few £k and it also uses a lot of power. And it takes up half the room. And it makes the room rather warm. So, not cool you say. Furthermore, not cool, is we only use it really for 8 extra pre-amps, and a monitor controller. Which could be done with 2x 2U rackmount things. Which would cost less, use less power, take up less space, and not make so much heat.

So why keep the desk? Bullsh!t beats brains it is! When a band walks into the studio, straight away we are credited a 'real' studio because there's this great big mixing desk in the middle of it. Take it away, and where do we, as far as their untrained eye can see, differ from their home studio where they do their demos? We have Pro Tools they have Pro Tools we have speakers they have speakers We have great big mixing desk they.... errrr. It's also why we like outboard with VUs. Everyone loves VUs flying around, even if they don't do anything. I made a 6U rack with 24 VU meters in it and some cool flickery bulbs behind them, which literally comes off the inserts and just shows a VU of whatever that channel is doing. It's of very little value to me since it's on the meters on the bridge anyway, but the band love it.

PS:

remember the old army expression bullsh1t-beats-brains!

That's not an army thing. Just a para thing to try and make you feel better.

[The Byre]

Originally Posted by therealbigd

Just a para thing to try and make you feel better.

That'll be the sound of my chain, getting jerked again!

[Greg Curtis]

Originally Posted by Rider365

There is no fee for zoning an already established building. Only when constructing a new building do you have to pay to zone the building i believe. I may be wrong. Im not very knowledgable about that aspect.

You will need what is called, here in CA, a "Zoning Use Certificate" to run a business. This requires that you pass several thresholds concerning parking, noise, safety, environmental impact, neighborhood petitions, etc. It doesn't matter if it is "an established building." Any new business must get one!

You will, at the end, end up with a certificate of occupancy. You get this after all of the construction has been passed off on by city inspectors. Inspections include things like framing, drywall, fire taping, any steel work, HVAC, plumbing, electrical, handicap, and the BIG one: Fire and safety.

But, before any of this happens, you need trot your plans down to city hall, and bend over to go through plan check, which first requires plans that are stamped by certified architects and/or engineers. I waited 3 months for my plans to be "checked." Then revisions...

Then there's city desks like Historic Districts and Urban Planning. God may mercy, and you won't have to go through what I did in the Glendale Urban Planning division! Don't forget other municipal hurdles like Water and Power, they LOVE to have fun with new businesses!

But first, have you started your corporation/LLC? Got a lawyer on retainer? Written a bulletproof contract? Got insurance? Business insurance? Employees?

Have fun running the new Google of the studio business!

greg

.

[oldeanalogueguy]

Originally Posted by Rider365

Was searching around google and found this pretty dope site. (Gear Slutz naturally lol). A site im sure i would like to stay a part of for a long while. With that said, my inquires stand as such.

My partner and i are starting a recording studio/ label. We have already obtained our state license and currently applying for our federal license. We have an advising board along with several participants (ie in-house engineers and producers). The question is... what other things are necessary to be a legit music business / recording studio ? Any type of licenses through BMI ? Trademarks ? Will we need to zone the building for loud noises or should the proofing within the building control alot of the noise radiating from the studio into the street ? Best way to construct the studio ? Known places to find good business grants (have looked through federal grant pages and cant find anything pertaining to our venue mostly eco friendly business's) ?

I know these questions may seem petty to a few of you but i have ran my head crazy trying to figure out the details without having to pay an expert. This business is all starting with out of pocket money and we are already pushing our budget to the limit.


for extra information this is a small list of our starting equipment.

Focusrite Saffire Pro24 Interface
Dynaudio BM5a Studio Monitors
Art PROVLA 2 channel compressor
Focusrite ISAONE Mic Pre
Neuman TLM103 Microphone
PT9 Xgrade Software
Custom Multi-OS Desktop (Mac snow leapord and win 7)
Pro Tools
Cubase
Lexicon Native Bundle
Waves complete and mercury
Reason

Thanks ahead to anyone that has the time and interest in sharing their opinions and experience.

PS.
Open to any equipment suggestions or replacements too !

what country are you in that you need a federal license?
not in the usa. unless you are selling firearms or running a radiotv station there is no federal license .

if you got the state corp registration you need to look local for licenses permits and other local krapp like zoning.

if you are already pushign your budget to teh limit i guarantee you will fail within one year.

you absolutely need to make a business plan. check teh web. there is cheap software to help too.

if you really have an advising board then have then advise you!!!!

go to the library and read free books on setting up a biz.

do you have any idea what a good studio costs?

your budget is unrealistically low for what you want to do.

grants? ROTFLMAOPIMP.
only our govt is dumb enough to throw money at this idea.
but even they want the biz plan.
and in theory want our tax money back.

[oldeanalogueguy]

Originally Posted by Rider365

You dont have to have a state license to run an at home studio for personal reasons.

they are running a biz

so they do need a state corp registration/license
no matter where they are

[AudioMaven]

Originally Posted by therealbigd

I said you wouldn't like it, didn't I?

where's the crappy come from?

sorry but I have a $2000 MacBook Pro, a $500 (used) MOTU 828ii, $400 Logic Pro, Various plugins amounting to about $4000, used PMC DB1S+ with used MC2 amp for $1000, basic room treatment making $500, HD650s at $400, and about $1000 of marketing budget... makes $9800. I get clients, and I get repeat clients, and I make profit.

The fact I get repeat clients kinda disproves your theory. Bottom line - I'm a good engineer who knows how to get the bands ideas into sound through his setup, and gets clients based on his work... rather than trying to sell a studio by its gear list. Good gear DOES NOT make good sound, and personally once I found myself able to get a great sound with all my fancy plugins, I actually found I could make great sounds without them.

PS: Why have you added Mastering into the mix? Adding extra cost to make your argument more credible? I don't get it.

Man I am new here and started reading this thread to get some idea of what studio guys are thinking like now. I am kind of sad by it all if it were not for this post ( where I will stop at ) then I would think nothing in the music biz has changed at all. My thoughts for the opp READ the quotes above carefully.

1. Find out who you are going to market your service to and build your business for them. I dont know that at first you will have a lot of high end clients ( not knocking just saying ) so build your biz ( not just buy gear ) wisely.
a) Think about added value: What other services and skills do you guys have that might bring something more to the studio? Web,Graphics atleast some video of sessions etc..
b) Set a budget for marketing and look at your location carefully
c) Man all the gear sounds great and this place is Gear slutz and I am sure lots of guys made waaaay more money than me here cutting guys but like above I have made a profit recording guys and had the audacity to call my joint a studio

I know a guy who cut a gold Record on an 8 track and an ASR10 ( U heard the song on a microsoft commercial a while back ) but I respect the guys who come from a different line of thought. Me, I think U need to get to cutting and building your rep + networking and build and improve your business as you go. The studio and music business as a whole seems to be morphing IMO so just like in the film ( video ) industry things are changing. Get some ears and tight producers to work with your lable and I can not put a price on that because it is priceless.

[johndykstra]

AudioMaven,

I get what you are talking about. It really shouldn't be necessary to spend 6 figures to get a good studio up and rolling. But a distinction need be made.

Is this a home studio?

Is this a mix suite?

Is this commercial brick and mortar business with clientele foot traffic? (thebigd has stated that his is not... it is a mix suite)

The sad truth is, if you are aiming for option #3, it's awfully hard to get everything in order legally without at least skimming that 6 figure mark.

If you're going to have paying customers in your building, you need insurance. Insurance can't be provided unless the building has been inspected. You will not get inspections without having building permits. You are (probably) not a non-licensed tradeworker who can pull your own permits. Thus, you have to hire contractors and a workforce.

Anyone who tells you they built the whole thing for 10k did not go through these channels. And that's fine. But you have to appreciate the situation here. It's irresponsible to give advice for a commercial facility using home studio guidelines. Not only would it end up costing more in the long run to retroactively obtain permits and get occupancy, but were someone to attempt running a business without going through the proper channels, were something tragic to happen, it could be life shattering.


I would love to here some stories from people that have an insured studio business, however small, and what it cost them to get it off the ground. Too often we look at Manifold, Circle and Bridge... heck, even Dark Pine is above the scope of 99% of the budgets here...

I have a small home studio. It is primarily for my own band. Our only clients are friends we have known for years. That doesn't mean it's without risk. Should something tragic happen, it wouldn't be hard for the individual, or in a really tragic case, the family; to come after us in a financial way that would ruin us for our lifetime. We don't advertise. We don't even allow a studio name in album liner notes. We don't have contracts. It's all handshakes, beer, and trust. This is not the way one makes a living. But this is the way one can run a "studio" for 10k.

[AudioMaven]

It's irresponsible to give advice for a commercial facility using home studio guidelines. Not only would it end up costing more in the long run to retroactively obtain permits and get occupancy, but were someone to attempt running a business without going through the proper channels, were something tragic to happen, it could be life shattering.

John I commented to be responsible. Did you not read the OP? All I saw was a guy asking some legit questions and atleast asking and then a bunch of guys bashing him saying he does not have a studio and his software might be pirated. IMO it was not helpful nor did it speak to the questions the guy asked. I only saw one guy give up any game at all even after the OP expressed his disappointment with the responses. Yeah I know a lot of guys are busy and no one wants to spoon feed a guy but since I am being called irresponsible I will assume then let me try again to be more HELPFUL

First lets go back to what the op actually asked:

My partner and i are starting a recording studio/ label. We have already obtained our state license and currently applying for our federal license. We have an advising board along with several participants (ie in-house engineers and producers). The question is... what other things are necessary to be a legit music business / recording studio ? Any type of licenses through BMI ? Trademarks ? Will we need to zone the building for loud noises or should the proofing within the building control alot of the noise radiating from the studio into the street ? Best way to construct the studio ? Known places to find good business grants (have looked through federal grant pages and cant find anything pertaining to our venue mostly eco friendly business's) ?

I am a little foggy on what tragedy can befall someone while recording that could outweigh me signing simple songwriter split sheets,publishing and or production deals and getting credits on a record. I have seen guys cut commercially viable stuff in a project studio and sell more than 10K units and get some residuals for their works. I have seen guys produce a gold record and get nothing ( I have a friend of 20 years who did ) just to clear that up and give more responsible advice. OP never asked about building a structure he asked about a production studio and label. Why advise him to build a Boutique B&M studio and you don't even know where he is located or if that is even his intention.

I was simply trying to point out that without getting to deep into symantecs it is certainly possible to run a profitable business from your home, Garage where ever your space is and produce commercially viable music. Sounds to me that the op is more interested in a project studio rather than a B&M boutique and if the OP is not located in one of the 3 major USA markets ( NY,Ca or TN ) then I would not even consider running a traditional B&M boutique.

Also not trying to be funny man but OP probably does not mean construct a studio in the literal since of the words.

Take 2 @OP
1. Go and research ASCAP and BMI and sign up as a writer and or publisher. No building permits are needed for this. You can hold a publishing company with ASCAP,BMI and Sesac but only be a writer with one PRO ( Performing Rights Organization ). Since you plan to start a label get this stuff sorted out.

2. Get you some good DIY contracts to start with and read up on this business as best you can and know what you want to do.
A) Songwriter split sheet
B) production contracts
C) Record Label contracts ( traditional or 50/50 ) as most deals currently outside of the majors or more like a JV ( Joint Venture I hate acronyms and throwing words around to make myself look smart ) I am no smarter than anyone else on this board maybe I am dumber because I have actually lost over 100K before listening to ppl who mean well I am sure but have not engaged actively in what I am asking about.

3. TradeMark: Do your research: Over the years I have been involved in the domaining industry so I have had to check out stuff like this before. Go to my site here
Domain Names Marketplace
( No shameless plug just want to make sure op gets good link ) look on the right sidebar for the trademark research resource I use. Your name can not be regged as a trademark if someone has a claim on that trademark conducting the same biz. So yeah register your TM if you are serious and dive in further than doing a DBA on the state level. You might also want to look into incorporating if there are a lot of interests in your biz but I am not a lawyer and no very little about what your specifics talk to the guys working with you and do more research as to what will best fit you all.

4. Fed licensing: Someone spoke on this. Grants are going to be more about what kind of job volume or enhancements your biz can make to the area it is located in. In only my personal opinion I would not dedicate to much of my time or funds into pursuing that ( not trying to be negative or pick on you man I just been there and done that even outside of music it is a tough nut to crack ).

5. Buildings and permits: OK if you have not acquired a building already then it is back to research time in order to find a building previously occupied for this purpose. Likely it will be zoned easier + have some of the infrastructure in place and maybe if you are really lucky be in an area where there are similar commercial boutique studios if that is infact what you are building your business model on.

The industry is changing from a POS ( Point of Sale ) and from a R&D and distribution basis for the good or bad only time will tell ( so far looks bad because 2000- 2010 record sales are down from 14.6 Billion to 6.2 Billion + licensing songs up front has taken an even bigger hit than that for most guys in that field ). Music is being developed and distributed at the speed of sound now and outside of the 3 major US + the proper channels for a sales funnel I would not even think of a pure B&M boutique studio with out knowing how I will be giving added value to clients and what USP ( Unique Sales Proposition ) I can offer to clients ( A USP is not GEAR and nor is a studio GEAR alone). When you can not convince someone to buy your SERVICES because they have the same equipment work on your craft + marketing yourself better.

I am sure I will get flamed for this but this is from a guy who has ran several online business over the years and traded professionally for 4 years. I don't mean any disrespect to guys running the traditional B&M by saying this just trying to address what the op brought up ( Studio and Label + production ) and if he focuses his efforts on a model trending down it will not help his biz IMO. Traditional B&M studio + Label I 1000% agree 200K+ is just a nice start but not entirely needed to be profitable or enter into legal contractual agreements with artists,publishers and producers.

Cutting friends for free with no contract and so forth your porogative but a recipe for disaster.

Example:
Rebecca Black YT sensation cut with a Ark Music Factory and has allegedly garnered 1 Million total from that project but they are in disputes now ( her and ARK ) over ownership of the assets but with no contracts there would be NO dispute period. Some of how music is where it is now is because musician and DAMN good ones sadly, the best in my experience just need to use the creative gifts God gave them and apply them to business. Say U can until you do but say you cant without trying is sad. Good luck to the op and no offense meant to anyone, man we are all brothers making sounds that can move people so I try to support RESPONABLY!

[Matt R]

Originally Posted by oldeanalogueguy

they are running a biz

so they do need a state corp registration/license
no matter where they are

Have you ever heard of the term "Sole Proprietorship"?

Just sayin'

[4 the Max]

Gearslutzers and us engineers love gear.

1. Do you have a market for a recording studio?

2. Do you have a business plan? a qualified tax accountant? legal counsel? commercial insurance?

3. Aside from signal chain, has your tracking room being acoustically tuned/treated correctly unless your only record "into the box?"

4. Do you have adequate parking, noise issues from/to the neighbors, municipal zoning, etc.

You get what you pay for. I would recommend reading several books on studio biz, construction, legal issues for studio owners, etc. Do your own HW and you'll be better off for it.

Also head down to your local music store and pick their brains. I'm sure that be happy to sell you stuff, too.

5. Own a bank!! If you're not the first studio to qualify for the free gov't money given out to the banks, maybe you'll qualify for one of the small business loans:
President Obama Signs Small Business Jobs Act - Learn What's In It | The White House

6. Get a lava lamp! Some gearslutzers say that only real engineers have one in their CR. Have a lot of gear with blinking lights, big a-- mics in shockmounts, carpet on the walls (not good acoustically but they think this what real studios have) for newbie bands.

7. Get a coffee maker for the long sessions and mixing nights.

Best wishes for success.

[therealbigd]

Originally Posted by 4 the Max

Gearslutzers and us engineers love gear.

1. Do you have a market for a recording studio?

2. Do you have a business plan? a qualified tax accountant? legal counsel? commercial insurance?

3. Aside from signal chain, has your tracking room being acoustically tuned/treated correctly unless your only record "into the box?"

4. Do you have adequate parking, noise issues from/to the neighbors, municipal zoning, etc.

You get what you pay for. I would recommend reading several books on studio biz, construction, legal issues for studio owners, etc. Do your own HW and you'll be better off for it.

Also head down to your local music store and pick their brains. I'm sure that be happy to sell you stuff, too.

5. Own a bank!! If you're not the first studio to qualify for the free gov't money given out to the banks, maybe you'll qualify for one of the small business loans:
President Obama Signs Small Business Jobs Act - Learn What's In It | The White House

6. Get a lava lamp! Some gearslutzers say that only real engineers have one in their CR. Have a lot of gear with blinking lights, big a-- mics in shockmounts, carpet on the walls (not good acoustically but they think this what real studios have) for newbie bands.

7. Get a coffee maker for the long sessions and mixing nights.

Best wishes for success.

This is basically what I always say.

9000 series SSL = very nice, sod all use if nobody knows your studio exists.

Marketing is infinitely more important than gear. I know studios with 8I/O Pro Tools LE rigs that don't get a day OFF business for months at a time, and studios with 48I/O Pro Tools HD rigs that don't get a day OF business for months at a time, because the little place knows how to market and get customers.