How Much to Charge For...

[Aaron Miller]

Here's the deal:

A client of mine wants me to drive to another city (5 hrs away), stay over night, and record him the next day at a live show. I imagine about 5-6 hours total setup/wait/performance/takedown time at the concert. Mixing shouldn't take too long, maybe 2 hours.

He is going to pay for my gas, meals, and hotel so lets not worry about those costs. However, I'm wondering: Should I charge extra beyond the 7-8 hours I spend at the concert and mixing? Is it unreasonable to bill for some of the time I spend simply driving there, waiting at the hotel, etc.?

He's a good client but I also don't want to short change myself. What do you think?

[BasementRecords]

Originally Posted by Aaron Miller

Here's the deal:

A client of mine wants me to drive to another city (5 hrs away), stay over night, and record him the next day at a live show. I imagine about 5-6 hours total setup/wait/performance/takedown time at the concert. Mixing shouldn't take too long, maybe 2 hours.

He is going to pay for my gas, meals, and hotel so lets not worry about those costs. However, I'm wondering: Should I charge extra beyond the 7-8 hours I spend at the concert and mixing? Is it unreasonable to bill for some of the time I spend simply driving there, waiting at the hotel, etc.?

He's a good client but I also don't want to short change myself. What do you think?

I would let him know that you are charging extra for the time you are waiting and driving. And then I would charge whatever you normally charge plus the hours of waiting. as well. if you feel that charging for the full hours is too much to ask. Than maybe split those hours in half and charge that. To me that seems reasonable.

Let me know what you think

And check out my site, i could be of some good help.

Chris

[ark]

I think that charging half-time for time you're waiting or traveling and neither eating nor sleeping is probably fair. I mean, you ought to be compensated somehow for time during which you've given up the possibility of doing something else.

[ten21studio]

Originally Posted by ark

I think that charging half-time for time you're waiting or traveling and neither eating nor sleeping is probably fair. I mean, you ought to be compensated somehow for time during which you've given up the possibility of doing something else.

Second that

How can sharing the loss be unreasonable?

[Adlen]

Tricky one, I think if I were you I'd bill him for all the time I was not in my comfort zones (studio/home/pub), or in other words, I am somewhere he wants me to be. I wouldn't charge my normal rate for this though, that is a little unreasonable. For example...

I leave at 8pm...
2 hour drive - £5 per hour
One hour in hotel - £5
I go to sleep at 11, dreamland is one of my comfort zones, no billing
Wake up at 10am
Two hours for breakfast and driving to venue - £5 per hour
Arrive at venue at 12 noon
Set up my recording rig with the in-house console + soundcheck - £8 per hour
That will take no more than two hours to complete
Sitting around until doors open and then waiting for band to come on - £5 per hour
Gig starts around 4pm - now we're looking at £15 per hour
Gig finishes around 11pm

7 hours of £5 = £35
2 hours of £8 = £16
7 hours of £15 = £105

That's going to cost him £156 for a full day and night of my time and I haven't billed him for my journey home. Not too bad for him and I haven't been duped. Am I unreasonable?

[AAsa]

Do you have a day rate?
Sounds like two days of work, 10 hours of driving plus the show.

Are you hauling gear? tearing down at your place and setting up again when you get back? That could be another half day right there.

I totally understand the idea of cutting a bit of slack for a good client but your time is worth $$. Get paid.

Sorry but, who mixes anything in two hours???

have fun!

[jonathan jetter]

sounds like 2 full days of work to me too.

i would bill accordingly. maybe a slight break on the travel hours (15% or 20% off).

but i wouldn't start comping time or doing it for half-rate or anything like that.

[MyOnlineDrummer]

For out of town gigs like that, I usually charge a per day rate.
Even though you may only be doing 3 hours of recording in a day, you are still spending all that time, setting up, waiting around, tearing down, travel, etc.

So instead of charging $40/hr for this, $25 for that, $18 for something else, just include all that in the day rate.

For example, I charge $40/hr for recording.
If the gig is 3 hours long that would be $120.
The day rate is $300. That takes care of all the half-time, part-time, setup, takedown, etc.
Client gets what they want, you get compensated properly.

[rcb4t2]

Ditto to above - two days @ full day rate plus he covers expenses. Time is money. The day rate also avoids trying to calculate the discount required for meal breaks and all that crap. Keep it simple.

[drBill]

To me, this is not a difficult decision. You're being pulled away from your normal business, family, commitments for an out of town gig. Charge your day rate + 50% for every day you're away.

[NEWTON IN ORBIT]

Drbill's idea is great.

On the mixdown though:
If you think it's gonna take 2 hours to mix, expect it to really take 4, or more maybe.
This is IMHE anyway. You should let the client know ahead of time it will actually probably take longer than if recorded at your place, just in case. You are mixing stuff recorded in an unfamiliar room etc., and it is live material. This can bring myriad unexpected issues. It may take you a little longer to get a bead on it.

If you tell him to expect to pay for 2 hrs mixdown, and it takes 6, you are either going back to him asking for 3x the money, or eating 4 hours of your time and hard work. All this after a outta town trip that can be exhausting. It would suck to lose money on it.

Watch out not to burn yourself w/ estimates like that. Been there, hated every minute of it.

I try to just let people know:
"You know, until we really see what we are dealing with, I can only give you a ballpark estimate." Then I shoot a worst case scenario, and best case.

When the bill comes in for less than the worst case, they are happy.

Good luck,
John

[Yetti]

Originally Posted by Aaron Miller

Here's the deal:

A client of mine wants me to drive to another city (5 hrs away), stay over night, and record him the next day at a live show. I imagine about 5-6 hours total setup/wait/performance/takedown time at the concert. Mixing shouldn't take too long, maybe 2 hours.

He is going to pay for my gas, meals, and hotel so lets not worry about those costs. However, I'm wondering: Should I charge extra beyond the 7-8 hours I spend at the concert and mixing? Is it unreasonable to bill for some of the time I spend simply driving there, waiting at the hotel, etc.?

He's a good client but I also don't want to short change myself. What do you think?

I suppose it comes down to what is the budget, and can you accept that?
If you really look at all the hours you will have in this, I would guess your normal hourly or day rate will be much higher than the budget.
Isn't that just how it is? lol
You have a day in prep and travel, a day in pre and post concert day prep, and another day for travel back and getting back to whare you started.
I would figure the mix to be way more than 2 hours, more a day at best and probobally 2 or 3...shoot, it will take longer than 2 hours just to listen the playback 1 time.
I'll bet their budget is somewhere between $300 and $500, right?
lol
Can you do it for that if you like the band and get referals?
Is so, cool...road trip!

Good luck to you Brotha!

[MLM]

You can't charge for eating breakfast, can you?

[pan]

You charge for not having breakfast with your beloved.

[therealbigd]

Well... the time spent driving is time not spent at work.

So it's reasonable, in that sense.

Usually it's normal to have a 'travelling day' rate, maybe half your day rate, for days spent travelling.

[MLM]

Originally Posted by pan

You charge for not having breakfast with your beloved.

Fair enough.