17th September 2012
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#1 | | Gear addict
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 481
Thread Starter | CR in width
Why is it that many control rooms of bigger studios are built in width. what i mean is that the distance front to back is less than that of side to side!!
From my understanding it is usually better to have the speakers firing lengthwise. one reason being the reflections from the backwall being further away. another reason would be, that one can be further away from the front wall. there are many more reasons for firing lengthwise.
I have recently been to 2 acclaimed studios in my region (maybe not so successful in this decade) and both were configured that the speakers fire into the width. it just seems weird to me.
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17th September 2012
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#2 | | Lives for gear
Joined: May 2004 Location: Hamilton, On Canada
Posts: 4,444
 | Quote:
Originally Posted by nixoblivion  Why is it that many control rooms of bigger studios are built in width. what i mean is that the distance front to back is less than that of side to side!!
From my understanding it is usually better to have the speakers firing lengthwise. one reason being the reflections from the backwall being further away. another reason would be, that one can be further away from the front wall. there are many more reasons for firing lengthwise.
I have recently been to 2 acclaimed studios in my region (maybe not so successful in this decade) and both were configured that the speakers fire into the width. it just seems weird to me. | The lengthwise suggestion is valid for smaller control rooms. In larger control rooms the width dimension is large enough to provide sufficient time for back wall reflections to sufficiently delayed. In smaller rooms this is not true.
Andre
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Good studio building is 90% design and 10% construction. | |
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18th September 2012
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#3 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Sep 2007 Location: Old Tappan, NJ USA
Posts: 1,315
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it also depends on the console and speakers. if you have an 11' wide console and large dual 15" mains, you need the width and so rooms where there is not a corresponding depth means compromises - usually a very deep set of traps on the back wall to deal with the reflections and intense LF levels in a shallow space.
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18th September 2012
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#4 | | Gear Guru
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 14,250
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Agreed with the above. I actually did this test not so long ago. Here is the video with the results. Video: Positioning Listening Spot | |
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18th September 2012
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#5 | | Gear addict
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 481
Thread Starter |
Great answers!
Thanks for clearing that up.
Now how wide does a room have to be sothat facing the long side is not a problem anymore?
Because the professional CRs ive seen dont seem so wide... i would say maybe 5m wide. but i cant tell exactly!
Still i wonder, even if with bigger rooms there is less problems facing the longer side, would it not still be better to face the short side of the room??
Facing the short side makes it a lot more likley to be sitting in the middle of the width then, since the console, speakers, etc. will take some space and the sitting position will be further back.
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18th September 2012
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#6 | | Gear Guru
Joined: Jul 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 14,250
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Everything you pointed out is correct. 5m, IMO would be doable but would still recommend the other way if you can.
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18th September 2012
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#7 | | Lives for gear
Joined: Jan 2007 Location: Lisbon, Portugal
Posts: 1,222
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This simply has to do with lateral reflections that are not absorb and trying to increase the delay time between them and the initial sound.
It also has to do with the geometry of the room in RFZ rooms
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18th September 2012
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#8 | | Lives for gear
Joined: May 2004 Location: Hamilton, On Canada
Posts: 4,444
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All the responses are saying the same thing in different words. Adding to the different words, as a room becomes wider, in the layout sense, there is less need for treatment of the early reflection points on the sides to maintain early sound criteria.
An example of the criteria quantified is the EBU 3276 early refelctions within 15 ms of the initial sound sound shall be 10 dB down relative to the initial sound. There are numerous varitions on that criteria, but one starts to have significant reduction just from the distance reduction. That is assuming the listening postion is not in the far field.
Andre
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18th September 2012
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#9 | | Gear addict
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 481
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by avare Adding to the different words, as a room becomes wider, in the layout sense, there is less need for treatment of the early reflection points on the sides to maintain early sound criteria.
Andre | Very true, but that also means, more treatment is needed in the back/front!!! its a give and take, making one side further makes the other side closer... so it really doesnt change much!
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18th September 2012
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#10 | | Lives for gear
Joined: May 2004 Location: Hamilton, On Canada
Posts: 4,444
| Quote:
Originally Posted by nixoblivion Very true, but that also means, more treatment is needed in the back/front!!! its a give and take, making one side further makes the other side closer... so it really doesnt change much! | Where are you getting "that also means, more treatment is needed in the back/front!!!" from? Standard treatment for back walls is full range absorption with diffusers in front. Front wall is usually reflective, particularly with flush mounted monitors. This does not change with the room layout.
What "changes" with larger control rooms is a that a configuration with the longest dimension being the width becomes a viable option.
Andre
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18th September 2012
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#11 | | Gear addict
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 481
Thread Starter | Quote:
Originally Posted by avare Where are you getting "that also means, more treatment is needed in the back/front!!!" from? Standard treatment for back walls is full range absorption with diffusers in front. Front wall is usually reflective, particularly with flush mounted monitors. This does not change with the room layout.
Andre | Well i was using the same logic as you explained that one needs less absorption on the sides with a wider room, since the sound takes longer to travel. so if the room is longer one needs less absorption (diffusion maybe) since the sound takes longer to travel to the back and then front again...
oh are we not building rooms where the front is being absorbed and the back diffused anymore?? interesting. i thought, that was the standard! :P
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