HOLY CRAP...did adding bass traps really open my stereo field that much?

[Johnkenn]

I bought IK ARC the other day, ran it twice and noticed the large low end mountain that is otherwise known as my room. I guess I've just gotten used to mixing in here, because everything seems to translate really well. Also, with ARC flattening out the bottom, my mixes then seemed to have way too much bass and I found the mids to get squirrelly with ARC in the chain until mix down. So - I guess the moral of the story was - I didn't think ARC helped.

BUT!

It made me think, "I shoulda just put that $$ towards bass traps..." So, I did. I went and bought 4 inch thick mineral wool and added to that 1 1/2 inches of Owens 703. Applied plywood, fabric and made four 5 1/2 inch thick bass traps. I haven't mixed with them in the room yet, but I SWEAR my stereo field is twice what it was. It's like the sound has depth and surrounds you. I really don't think this is wishful hearing, because this is a byproduct that I totally didn't expect. So - I guess that brings me to my question: can adding bass traps really effect the stereo field this way? I'm as giddy as a schoolgirl.

[dysenterygary]

I had a similar revelation! After reading 15000 posts about how important bass trapping is I tried it and it was just crazy! You instantly realize why the room is easily the most important aspect of the chain!

[Johnkenn]

Seriously. It sounded like - well - a professional studio. I've spent years plastering Auralex to my walls, hanging blankets, etc...but I've never gotten the effect of what I just heard until I tried real basstrapping. (I'm sure some will poo poo my hybrid mineral wool/703 combo - I had no choice, that's as thick as they had the 703) I'm a believer.

[boggy]

Originally Posted by Johnkenn

Seriously. It sounded like - well - a professional studio. I've spent years plastering Auralex to my walls, hanging blankets, etc...but I've never gotten the effect of what I just heard until I tried real basstrapping. (I'm sure some will poo poo my hybrid mineral wool/703 combo - I had no choice, that's as thick as they had the 703) I'm a believer.

... this is just a beginning... and there are no boundaries, limits... or whatever!

Good luck!

[DanDan]

Johnkenn, I am delighted to see a post describing the amazing change brought about by relatively little expense and trouble.
Treatment rewards!
I noticed the word plywood in your cryptic description of your traps.
Is that a frame or a backing?
5.5 inches is decent but if the trap were open front and back you could space it out from the wall by say 4-6 inches. This would double the peformance, reaching a whole octave lower, for free.
See the airgap vs flat on wall performance of fibre here.
DD

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by DanDan

Johnkenn, I am delighted to see a post describing the amazing change brought about by relatively little expense and trouble.
Treatment rewards!
I noticed the word plywood in your cryptic description of your traps.
Is that a frame or a backing?
5.5 inches is decent but if the trap were open front and back you could space it out from the wall by say 4-6 inches. This would double the peformance, reaching a whole octave lower, for free.
See the airgap vs flat on wall performance of fibre here.
DD

Also to add when straddling corners you need to have the front and back open. Great to read another success story!! Happy mixing!!

[Johnkenn]

I'm still really blown away by the difference this has made...Honestly, this would be the VERY FIRST move I would suggest to someone reaching for a better sound. Can't wait to record and see if that actually benefits as well...

[RScott]

Would you mind a pic or description of your trap placement? You have me a bit giddy too! I'm a few weeks out from building some "faux-vaulted-ceiling" tri trap style treatments around my living room ceiling. I can't wait!

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[Johnkenn]

These are bad ipad photos, but you can get the gist...

[Johnkenn]

I have no idea why these came over landscape...oh well...Nothing spectacular looking - and I have two in the back corners - but the difference it's made is pretty audible to me...


BTW - How many different angles are in there in that third pic? It looks like a funhouse...

[musikmaschine]

This is great to read, I bought some mineral panels recently that I don't know the acoustic properties of so I was considering doing something like this.

What type of mineral wool is it? My panels also happen to be 4 inches so maybe I can add some rw5. Also good to know that plywood works. I know of a GS member who might be interested in this.

I think will be doing a ghetto bass trap build!

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[localhost127]

Originally Posted by Johnkenn

These are bad ipad photos, but you can get the gist...

remove the plywood, as mentioned above! the front/back should be open (albeit covered with fabric)

[DanDan]

We know that open traps work as a result of many many tests, including in labs.
It seems obvious that a plywood or other hard back will simply become the 'wall' eliminating the very useful airgap.
However this is untested territory. A plywood panel on the back could be called a damped resonant panel or membrane even.
G.E. has had remarkable success recently with steel panels on damping.
The Modex Plate is like this.
Now plywood is not steel and it is on the inside, but ....
No tests, we don't know.


DD

[RScott]

Well, you can see that corner foam behind the plywood, so I would bet money that there is some quite useful stuff going on because of the plywood. If it's better or worse than no plywood is out for debate, but I say if it sounds great, it sounds great!

IMO it comes somewhat close to how bass hanger type devices are made, right? With absorption covering a rigid plane, hung in an air space.

Thanks for the pics!! You rock!

[VCF]

Originally Posted by Johnkenn

I went and bought 4 inch thick mineral wool and added to that 1 1/2 inches of Owens 703. Applied plywood, fabric and made four 5 1/2 inch thick bass traps. I haven't mixed with them in the room yet, but I SWEAR my stereo field is twice what it was. It's like the sound has depth and surrounds you. I really don't think this is wishful hearing, because this is a byproduct that I totally didn't expect. So - I guess that brings me to my question: can adding bass traps really effect the stereo field this way? I'm as giddy as a schoolgirl.

I started treating my room today and for every little piece of foam i put up the room sounded better, but i didn't get any basstraps. Reading this, i'm going on a little shopping spree tomorrow! DIY day! Thank you sir.

[Johnkenn]

All the Auralex did for me was stop the flutter echos and deaden the room...I didn't notice a change in the stereo field until the basstraps...

[takman]

acoustics is the #1 priority.

/end thread

[PMortise]

Originally Posted by Johnkenn

These are bad ipad photos, but you can get the gist...

Very encouraging! A couple of questions please -
Do you have traps behind your listening position as well?
What's the rooms dimensions?

Thanks for posting this.

[cebolao]

Originally Posted by DanDan

We know that open traps work as a result of many many tests, including in labs.
It seems obvious that a plywood or other hard back will simply become the 'wall' eliminating the very useful airgap.
However this is untested territory. A plywood panel on the back could be called a damped resonant panel or membrane even.
G.E. has had remarkable success recently with steel panels on damping.
The Modex Plate is like this.
Now plywood is not steel and it is on the inside, but ....
No tests, we don't know.


DD

i suppose the plywood is "invisible" for low frequencies

[Deltones]

It does make a great difference doesn't it? I recently bought a pair of these puppies from ATS Acoustics and they have made a huge impact indeed.

Corner Bass Trap - 24x48

I still have a massive dip at 93-110hz, but I realized while reading this forum that my sense of symetry screwed me over: Monitors 3 feet away from the back wall, 3 feet between the centers of the drivers and 3 feet from center of driver to the floor/ceiling boundary (6.3 feet height only in my room, can't really fix that one)

P.S. I'm amazed at the amount of people having so much problems in the 100hz region, which is not important at all right? ...

Doing a search for 100z dip on Google is really eye-opening.

[recordinghopkins]

how did it test afterwards?

[scottrod]

Ok, I'm finally convinced.

Next stop, bass traps.

[Maverick87]

Hey all. Im trying to grasp the concept of a basic home-made bass trap, but am getting a little confused regarding the plywood and how its supposed to be layered. Should be:

fabric/mineral wool/OC 703/plywood/OC 703/mineral wool/fabric??

How thick is thick enough?
What is it about plywood thats making some people say not to use any at all? Is having something simliar to plywood essential for the vibration/abosrbtion of the bass traps?

[Glenn Kuras]

How thick is thick enough?

No less then 4" when straddling corners and honestly I like 6 to 8" if you have the funds.

What is it about plywood thats making some people say not to use any at all?

plywood will reflect.

Is having something simliar to plywood essential for the vibration/abosrbtion of the bass traps?

Maybe this will help.
How Bass Traps Work. Acoustic Panels and Bass Traps.

[7thbass]

Assume 4" Basstrap straddling the corner. would make any difference to stuff area behind with R-30 insulation?

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by 7thbass

Assume 4" Basstrap straddling the corner. would make any difference to stuff area behind with R-30 insulation?

Sure you can do that.

[tenchijin2]

Not surprised at all. I had a similar experience when I built my first bass traps, and was giddy all over these forums. My theory (which I'm sure is easily provable) about the stereo field improvement is that by eliminating all the comb filtering and interference, the stereo image can be better localized by your ears, making everything seem to be floating in the air around you. That was my experience.

Also, mixing became much easier. I didn't have to test mixes in my car, and on the home stereo, etc, because I could trust what I heard from my (relatively low end) monitors.

Sadly I've since lost the space I once had for that. My current tiny little space has a few broadband panels on the walls, which certainly helps but is nowhere near good enough. Maybe one day again.