How to stop glass windows for resonating

bmckenney · 1st December 2009

I have a listening room with a large wall that contains several older glass windows. I am putting absorption and diffusion on this wall, but the glass windows will still resonate. It is a 60 year old home with original windows and I think it is pretty basic double glazed glass, quite thin. And they are covered with venetian blinds and large heavy drapes/curtains are not an option.

I was checking out the audiophile route and the only thing I came up with are Marigo constrained layer damping dots. You put four dots per window. But it would cost me over $600 for all the dots they prescribe! While this dots sound like the best possible option for damping glass vibration and resonance, I'm not a fool with my money.

I thought maybe the pro audio recording guys might have run in to a material that can be placed on glass windows that reduces resonance.

Thanks,
Bryan

Brainchild · 1st December 2009

First off, I always get a kick out of investigating any new audiophile gimmick I haven't heard of before. Those dippin' dots strike me as being the typical audiphile fake-ass bullshit.

I think you're going to have to measure the actual resonance of the windows before you can determine how to treat them. If you add a significant amount of mass [four minuscule dots are not significant], that will lower the resonance; you'd have to calculate-/measure to see the specific results. If you coat the windows in some kind of self-damping resin or something, that will lower the frequency of resonance and reduce its intensity. If you're talking about an actual constrained layer as in putting some kind of self-damping material between - and touching - both of the panes, that could also be effective. On the other hand, the resonance of the windows may not actually be a significant problem in the first place. What kind of surface area are you looking at with these?

jhbrandt · 1st December 2009

As long as the panes of glass are not loose, get some that self-sticking heavy foam door seal - weather stripping - & put a couple of strips on each pane. - the whole thing might cost you $30.

Constrained layer damping dots are probably bullshit. ~story~ I built a huge studio in a church owned by an audiophile (the whole church was turned into a studio) and saw a lot of crazy stuff there... definitely more money than sense. - He spent $450 thousand on the studio...~end of story~

-- just make sure they aren't rattling. New putty should cure that.

Cheers,
John

tmrstudio · 1st December 2009

How about clear MLV? I probably would have covered up the windows if that was an option.

bmckenney · 1st December 2009

Surface area: 3 windows are 3' wide by 5' high. Then there are three angled windows above each of the 3 rectangular.

Any ideas on how to measure resonating glass?

I could try some of the ideas such as weather stripping, but it would be interesting to be able to measure before and after.

And yes, it maybe be true it's not an issue. But I am picking up a peak that I"m hearing in some female vocals around 1K to 1.2K from what I can tell. I am not sure if it is because of the glass. It was suggested by GIK Acoustics that it "could" be the glass.

I sure as heck don't want to spend $500 on rip off audiophile constrained layered damping dots.

Bryan

jhbrandt · 2nd December 2009

[QUOTE=bmckenney;4842084]Surface area: 3 windows are 3' wide by 5' high. Then there are three angled windows above each of the 3 rectangular.

Any ideas on how to measure resonating glass?/QUOTE]

I didn't know that they were that big,

Probably the easiest and most accurate way to measure the resonance of the glass is by "pinging" it and listening to the pitch of the "ringing". If you have a spectrum analyzer plug-in on your DAW, you can record the ringing and determine this resonant frequency quite accurately.

You can test the effect of the 'fix' by recording after you place some weatherstripping. This should get you moving in the right direction.

1st December 2009	#1
bmckenney Gear interested Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Calgary Posts: 3 Thread Starter	How to stop glass windows for resonating I have a listening room with a large wall that contains several older glass windows. I am putting absorption and diffusion on this wall, but the glass windows will still resonate. It is a 60 year old home with original windows and I think it is pretty basic double glazed glass, quite thin. And they are covered with venetian blinds and large heavy drapes/curtains are not an option. I was checking out the audiophile route and the only thing I came up with are Marigo constrained layer damping dots. You put four dots per window. But it would cost me over $600 for all the dots they prescribe! While this dots sound like the best possible option for damping glass vibration and resonance, I'm not a fool with my money. I thought maybe the pro audio recording guys might have run in to a material that can be placed on glass windows that reduces resonance. Thanks, Bryan

1st December 2009	#3
jhbrandt Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Jakarta, Indonesia Posts: 2,532	As long as the panes of glass are not loose, get some that self-sticking heavy foam door seal - weather stripping - & put a couple of strips on each pane. - the whole thing might cost you $30. Constrained layer damping dots are probably bullshit. ~story~ I built a huge studio in a church owned by an audiophile (the whole church was turned into a studio) and saw a lot of crazy stuff there... definitely more money than sense. - He spent $450 thousand on the studio...~end of story~ -- just make sure they aren't rattling. New putty should cure that. Cheers, John __________________ John H. Brandt Recording Studio Design/Consulting, Acoustics, & Electronics Jakarta, Indonesia go to http://jhbrandt.net & sign up for my free newsletter "Studio Design News" "Twenty thousand dollars worth of Snap-On tools does not make you a Professional Diesel Mechanic"

1st December 2009	#4
tmrstudio Gear nut Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: St. Louis MO Posts: 99	How about clear MLV? I probably would have covered up the windows if that was an option. __________________ www.tmrstudio.com Beautiful music is in the ears of the beholder

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1st December 2009	#2
Brainchild Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: USA Posts: 882	First off, I always get a kick out of investigating any new audiophile gimmick I haven't heard of before. Those dippin' dots strike me as being the typical audiphile fake-ass bullshit. I think you're going to have to measure the actual resonance of the windows before you can determine how to treat them. If you add a significant amount of mass [four minuscule dots are not significant], that will lower the resonance; you'd have to calculate-/measure to see the specific results. If you coat the windows in some kind of self-damping resin or something, that will lower the frequency of resonance and reduce its intensity. If you're talking about an actual constrained layer as in putting some kind of self-damping material between - and touching - both of the panes, that could also be effective. On the other hand, the resonance of the windows may not actually be a significant problem in the first place. What kind of surface area are you looking at with these?

2nd December 2009	#6
jhbrandt Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Jakarta, Indonesia Posts: 2,532	[QUOTE=bmckenney;4842084]Surface area: 3 windows are 3' wide by 5' high. Then there are three angled windows above each of the 3 rectangular. Any ideas on how to measure resonating glass?/QUOTE] I didn't know that they were that big, Probably the easiest and most accurate way to measure the resonance of the glass is by "pinging" it and listening to the pitch of the "ringing". If you have a spectrum analyzer plug-in on your DAW, you can record the ringing and determine this resonant frequency quite accurately. You can test the effect of the 'fix' by recording after you place some weatherstripping. This should get you moving in the right direction.