Fuzz Measure Pro 3

[Nu Mixer]

Does the trial version provide any charts or graphs? Or is it necessary to buy the full version? thanks!

[Nu Mixer]

Anyone know?

[Clonkified]

I downloaded the trial and it seems to do everything I need to measure the room. Not sure why I would even need to buy it...doesn't seem to have a time limit either. Provides the frequency response and reverberation plots fine.

[Nu Mixer]

Great to know, thanks!

[jwl]

I've never used Fuzzmeasure (no Mac), but my understanding is that there is a time limit.

I like Room EQ Wizard, it's free, cross-platform, and works very well.

[Weasel9992]

I think there's a 90-day time limit. I'm also a fan of REW for the same reasons...it's full-featured, stable and free.

Frank

[Ethan Winer]

I don't have a Mac either, but I've heard more than once that REW does not work well on Macs. Something about the Java runtime. It's worth trying REW of course, but FuzzMeasure is known stable, and the author Chris Liscio is very responsive.

--Ethan

[Weasel9992]

I've run it on my macbook...seemed to work fine to me. Maybe I didn't try hard enough to break it...

Frank

[bkuijt]

The trial of FuzzMeasure is time limited. Don't know how long, just found out today that it has expired. Now functionality is basic and limited to two measurements.

I also found today the the Room EQ Wizard is NOT correctly working on my MacBookPro. Don't know what is wrong but the impulse graphs were very strange...
Running REW in windows (on my MBP) showed correct impulse response in the same measurement setup.

... of course it could also be my mistake....

Edit: It seems the problem could be caused by the noise at the beginning of the generated audio (in windows it's clean) this seems to upset the measurement...
At the HomeTheaterShack they say you should run REW on Mac with a USB soundcard not firewire as I have...

[DanDan]

FuzzMeasure is an honest attempt at providing a professional product. As such I recommend supporting it. The price is extremely low compared to for instance Bruel and Kjaer distributed similar software. REW is only available from HTS, in my experience a very strange place with a very strange dictator in charge. Read the extensive rules and you will see what I mean.

DD

[Ethan Winer]

Originally Posted by DanDan

HTS, in my experience a very strange place with a very strange dictator in charge. Read the extensive rules and you will see what I mean.

It's even worse than that. Really. Much worse.

--Ethan

[Weasel9992]

....well maybe, but all you have to do is download the software, then you never have to visit HTS again if you don't want to.

Frank

[Ethan Winer]

Believe me, I do download the software, and then I'm all set until a new version comes out.

[DanDan]

I am barred from that site. A long time ago I registered in order to access the software.
I submitted a couple of posts. One of these was when Fuzzmeasure appeared, which I announced as good news. Inadvertently I submitted this twice, as it didn't seem to work first time. The site owner banned me. He is clearly insane, read his rules. He is some sort of fundamentalist nutter, I am guessing from the buckle of the Bible belt.
By the way I never got REW to work on any of my Macs.
Supporting this 'Free' endeavour will undboubtedly do damage to the prospects of ETF, Fuzzmeasure and possibly prevent other professional attempts. This is not healthy. I strongly encourage supporting the honest sane Pros , including encouraging them to develop and improve their product. 150 bucks is absolutely peanuts for ETF or FM.

DD

[Ethan Winer]

All good points Dan.

[jayfrigo]

I bought Fuzzmeasure last year. The price was reasonable, and I hope it helps to support further development. I'm a satisfied customer.

[liscio]

FuzzMeasure Pro has a 14-day trial that lets you do everything the paid version does. After the 14-day trial runs out, you're limited to two measurements per document, and no longer have access to the PlugIns.

One could certainly use FuzzMeasure within the 14 day period and never have to buy a license. That's excellent marketing for me, because that user walks away happy, and ready to spread the word too all his/her friends, which often includes professionals who need FuzzMeasure to make a living, or serious hobbyists who measure regularly (DIY builders, acoustics buffs, etc).

This strategy appears to be working for me. Over a year ago, I was able to quit my full-time job to work on FuzzMeasure and my other products, thanks to my excellent customers.

For the 'fans' out there: I'm hard at work on version 3.2 (you can get the latest beta at FuzzMeasure Pro 3 - Latest) which adds more scripting support via AppleScript, and some other much-needed performance improvements. Check it out when you get a chance...

Cheers,

Chris

[Ethan Winer]

Originally Posted by liscio

ready to spread the word too all his/her friends, which often includes professionals who need FuzzMeasure to make a living, or serious hobbyists who measure regularly (DIY builders, acoustics buffs, etc).

Just to add that everyone who is serious about audio needs room measuring software like FuzzMeasure. Measuring your room should be done whenever you move things in the room, add more treatment, or just to confirm your speakers and crossovers are still correct. Between my home studio and my home theater living room setup, I measure stuff all the time. I'm getting ready to move some things around in my living room system to accommodate a new projector and 110" screen. You can be sure I'll measure several times during that process.

--Ethan

[DanDan]

If everyone used REW Chris would not make a living. I would ask Ethan, Frank, Glenn, etc. here to consider not recommending REW anymore. It does have a very real cost.
Dirac is software distributed by Bruel and Kjaer. It is broadly similar to FuzzMeasure and ETF. Last time I checked it cost about 2K Euros.

DD

[liscio]

Originally Posted by DanDan

If everyone used REW Chris would not make a living.

I'm not so sure that's true. I think that REW and ETF help me position FuzzMeasure as a viable alternative. Complaints about either product could turn into sales for me.

For instance, if someone isn't happy with the graph quality in either of the products, I've got that covered. Or, if the audio hardware support isn't as extensive, I've got that covered as well. Etc.

I would ask Ethan, Frank, Glenn, etc. here to consider not recommending REW anymore. It does have a very real cost.

I think that's pretty extreme. REW gets folks up & running measuring their rooms with no requirement to pay. If REW didn't exist, some folks might never get into this field.

Once the users start to get serious, though, they'll start looking for improved tools, and then eventually I hope that the users come my way. I've had folks go as far as buying Macs just to use FuzzMeasure, which always puts a smile on my face.

Dirac is software distributed by Bruel and Kjaer. It is broadly similar to FuzzMeasure and ETF. Last time I checked it cost about 2K Euros.

Yikes. That's a MacBook, an audio interface, a microphone, and a copy of FuzzMeasure right there. The whole measurement studio, to go!

As pricey as FuzzMeasure is, it's the only product that I regularly hear my customers refer to as 'cheap'. My $25 and $39 products, on the other hand, are constantly being complained about as too expensive. Figure that one out... :/

Chris

[Ethan Winer]

In fairness, REW works fine on Windows computers. At least it does on all the Windows computers I've tried it on. And the developer is not the same person as runs that forum!

--Ethan

[DanDan]

Well OK perhaps I am a little OTT on this. However I do believe there are very real down sides to the 'free' REW. If it works well on Windows it is clearly a bigger threat to ETF or any new Windows effort. Who would write a new Windows product in the face of a 'free' competitor, regularly recommended by forum experts? Perhaps REW is funded by advertising on HTS. Is it fair to recommend and support the use of a product with an unfair advantage? I understand your points Chris, but your generous demo conditions kinda remove any reason to go REW, which in my experience doesn't work on Macs.

DD

[jwl]

Interesting points, Dan. Not sure I agree, though. Has Ardour displaced Pro Tools? Has OpenOffice displaced M$ Office? Firefox IE, etc etc. Though these programs are Free Software (free as in speech), and REW is not (though it is free as in beer).

I definitely agree that the forum is a strange place, but I don't spend much time there.

Also, I haven't spent much time iwth ETF, but I prefer REW to ETF any day, personally. In part because I run Linux and I can run REW from Linux.

Chris, any chance you'll release a crossplatform version of fuzzmeasure? I'd think Linux would be possible at least....

[DanDan]

JWL, if I may answer in contrat. For many of us Apple has replaced WinTel. We pay a premium for this but consider it worth it. I do admit to a little hyperbole to magnify my points. However, I don't think 'free' or cheap is generally sustainable. If we buy Chinese knock-offs this could hypothetically result in no original products resulting from R and D and experience. Furthermore unemployment and poverty is simply shifted from one country to another.
There is real cost, other than the short term financial, to these choices.
Personally I try to stick with originators and seek new ones, thus my early recommendations for FuzzMeasure, Haun/MBHO microphones and such.
Best, DD

[JohnPM]

I thought I should step in and defend myself before Dan has a chance to pin global warming, the banking crisis and MPs fiddling their expenses on me

I wrote the original code that turned into REW in 2003 as a front end to setting up the EQ features in TMA AV processors. Couldn't justify getting the software team to work on it as they were too busy on other stuff, so did it myself in the evenings as a little hobby activity. At the time I used and recommended (and still do, for that matter) ETF to make the measurements. After TMA got sold off to the Chinese and I found myself out of the audio industry I decided to extend the code to make its own measurements, so I would have a more useful EQ adjusting tool and keep in touch with an area I enjoy. I knew I did not have, and would not have, sufficient time to provide the support I felt paying users would deserve, so I made the software available for free. I still feel that way, and I'm happy that a small community of users has built up that are in turn happy to offer their time in supporting new users. I continue to work on the code, both the measurement and EQ parts of it, and will release updates in due course. It is a hobby for me and I enjoy it, though I don't think my wife appreciates the time I spend on it.

For the record, I think fuzzMeasure is a great product and I have been recommending it to Mac users since 2006, when I first became aware of it.

[DanDan]

Hi John, glad you have appeared. I had considered inviting you. Trust me, I have no personal beef with you whatsoever. I am standing on principles here. Such principles do have an effect. For instance if the US consumer consistently buys foreign cars, then there will be no American cars. This is quite real.
Your software has become over time, very sophisticated and I believe, stable on Windows. Surely you can see that offering a free and sophisticated product endangers ETF, which I am told is not stable and clearly in need of some TLC. Hardly worth Doug's making this better, since there is a free and maybe better alternative don't you think? If REW had worked on my Mac I would most likely have never bothered finding FuzzMeasure, and perhaps Chris might not have seen a point in writing it.
I can see that your intentions, and from observation, that your work is laudable, however it does have this unfortunate side effect. The road to hell is paved with good intentions! Furthermore it is a real nuisance that it is only available at HTS, a toxic place. I would be a lot happier if it were available here on GS.
DD

[JohnPM]

I believe that all products, whether American cars or acoustic software, have to stand on their own merits and offer value for what they charge. That's easier to do if you don't charge anything, but that doesn't mean others cannot charge and still give value for money. It is not as if REW is the only free measurement app, off the top of my head I can think of AcMus, RMAA, CARMA, HOLMImpulse, SynRTA and Speaker Workshop. The free alternatives give more incentive to those who charge to raise the quality of their offering, the end result should be more choice and better products.

[liscio]

Originally Posted by JohnPM

For the record, I think fuzzMeasure is a great product and I have been recommending it to Mac users since 2006, when I first became aware of it.

Which is very kind of you. I do appreciate it...

Chris

[liscio]

Originally Posted by JohnPM

The free alternatives give more incentive to those who charge to raise the quality of their offering, the end result should be more choice and better products.

Exactly.

Also, with free software comes the reasonable expectation of no support (though REW doesn't fall into that category). Many authors of free software do it in their spare time, and cannot handle the level of support required to ship a software product (or the pains of selling and collecting money for the software).

When you buy a paid app, you can demand a certain level of support. Furthermore, you can rest assured that updates and fixes will continue to come (provided you're not the sole customer ).

[liscio]

Originally Posted by jwl

Chris, any chance you'll release a crossplatform version of fuzzmeasure? I'd think Linux would be possible at least....

It's not gonna happen, sorry. I've yet to see a well-executed cross-platform app that behaves natively on each platform.

On the Mac, details are king. Apple awards excellence in design, and continually drives the developer community to make outstanding applications and not just mediocre ones. I know there are plenty of exceptions to this (not everyone listens!), but folks who do sweat the details tend to come out quite successfully in their respective markets.

This is why I enjoy working on my Mac, and as long as my bills are paid I'm not budging from this position.

Chris