How much power for studio...?

[mojo1]

Howdy GS buddies!

Just bought a house with some very faulty wiring, so a call to an electrician is just a few days away. While he's here I'd like him to make sure I have enough dedicated, clean power. He'll be replacing the main trunk from the road to the house and installing a new breaker box ( I have two old ones... with screw-type fuses and electric chair -type throw levers...eeek!). I'd be happy to have a 2nd box just for the studio, if that might help......?

What does a typical, small-type, home studio need for power?

I'm recording mostly acoustic/americana/bluegrass and will have a DAW control room, vocal booth, and 4-5 other tracking booths. Each booth will need at least 2 outlets for tube mics and/or small amps (I know I said acoustic... but I can have a little fun too, eh?).

I'll be installing a dedicated HVAC so I'll need power for that too.

Anyone with any suggestions?

How much power do I need?????

THANKS!!!

[DSD_Mastering]

My basement studio is on it's own power with an Equi=tech 100amp wall cabinet. There are 2 dedicated circuits in each area of the studio. I don't ever see needing more power.

The Equi=tech website has formulas for calculating how much power you will need.

Regards,
Bruce

[jdg]

100amp would be good to start unless ur getting a huge console and some tape machines.. then i would just start adding amps up.

i have two 20amp circuts, and no hvac. just daw, small amount of outboard, and lights. ... still have lots of juice left over.

[nosebleedaudio]

For tech power only one 20 amp will be plenty...

[Doublehelix]

As part of my build-out, I added:

-20 amp circuit for the control room electronics (recording gear only) with star isolated ground
-20a for the live room
-20a for the iso room
-20a for the service plugs and lights
-20a for HVAC

-----

100 amps total

[mojo1]

Thank you'ns!

DSD, those Equitek systems are PRICY! Yeesh! Do you notice a huge difference between that an a standard Monster-type conditioner?

D-Helix are you completely satisfied with what you added... ie. would you do it any differently the second time around?

Thanks a BUNCH for your suggestions!!

-Mojo out!

[DSD_Mastering]

Originally Posted by mojo1

Thank you'ns!
DSD, those Equitek systems are PRICY! Yeesh! Do you notice a huge difference between that an a standard Monster-type conditioner?
-Mojo out!

Yeah, I spent over $30k on electrical. The cabinet are about $10k and I'm using JPS labs in-wall cable and Oyaide R1 receptacles. The cabinet is tied with #4 copper wire to (2) 20' x 3/4" copper rods at 16' apart into the ground. I do have a couple of non-technical outlets in there and the difference is not subtle, even when using a Furman conditioner.

It's really a cumulative thing, where no one thing will make an audible difference, but putting them all together will make a major improvement. The difference can be heard mainly on amps and converters.

Regards,
Bruce

[avare]

This thread has been staying mostly on topic per the original post, so I will correct that.

If you are spending the money to do it right, what you may find more economical is to have the main audio power outlets wired with isolated grounds. Cheaper than balanced systems like what Equitech sells. Nothing negative about their products, but if you are doing wiring, isolated ground is cheaper. Isolated ground systems is a mature technology, and amongst the most common uses for it is in hospitals. Hospitals are not concerned about what something sounds like, they are concerned with saving lives. They do it right.

Living,
Andre

[mojo1]

Pardon my ignorance... isolated ground system... what's that?

I'm sure it has something to do with isolating the ground... but... um.... (I'm not an electrician and I don't even play one on tv!!).

Thanks for all of your help!

-Mojo

[pan]

In a home-environment the Neutral is usually tied to Ground somewhere down the Line...

Isolated Ground means that you have a dedicated run for the Ground that is not connected to Neutral but directly connected to Earth - usually by a Groundpole.

[mojo1]

Seems easy... and logical...

So I should just tell my electrician about this and he'll know what to do? I'd like it done the right way, the first time!

Thanks again!

-Mojo

[jammybastard]

when the power company showed up at my house for a service call and saw my studio and my 100amp service. they stayed and installed a 300 amp service.

[jamsmith]

Originally Posted by Doublehelix

100 amps total

Assuming standard line voltages, that a capacity for 12,500 peak power.

You growing weed in there?

Grounding. Yes. Isolation. Isolation transformer if you can. Technically neutral and ground are the same thing - but in practice resistance can be found between them and that source of ground loop hum. This is what you do. Your breaker box has a grounding strip that you can run all the grounds too. Get a grounding rod - galvanized steel at least 8-10 ft long, 5/8 inches thick, drive that sucker in the ground and connect your grounding strip to that. This is called star grounding.

Extra nice ground: dig down a couple of feet before driving in rod. After the rod is inserted, pack some rock salt around the rod. Keep the ground moist. This is an old radio trick, probably over-kill for audio, but hell, it costs next to nothing.

[nosebleedaudio]

Originally Posted by jamsmith

Assuming standard line voltages, that a capacity for 12,500 peak power.

You growing weed in there?

Grounding. Yes. Isolation. Isolation transformer if you can. Technically neutral and ground are the same thing - but in practice resistance can be found between them and that source of ground loop hum. This is what you do. Your breaker box has a grounding strip that you can run all the grounds too. Get a grounding rod - galvanized steel at least 8-10 ft long, 5/8 inches thick, drive that sucker in the ground and connect your grounding strip to that. This is called star grounding.

Extra nice ground: dig down a couple of feet before driving in rod. After the rod is inserted, pack some rock salt around the rod. Keep the ground moist. This is an old radio trick, probably over-kill for audio, but hell, it costs next to nothing.

This is a BAD idea...and NOT to code..
Ground MUST be connected to the center tap of the main AC drop or you WILL not have a path for ground fault current, and will not trip a breaker.
A true dedicated ground means its connected at one point only and is a home run to the main panel, connected at the SAME point as neutral...
And salt is highly corrosive, drive more grounds rods...

[mojo1]

Hey Jammy!

Did they explain why they did that? Isn't that overkill? I'm up for it, just don't want to throw money away!!!!

Thanks!

-Mojo

[mojo1]

Anyone...?

[nosebleedaudio]

Let me say this another way, a better ground on the AC side will NOT compensate for a poorly designed piece of gear.

[plexisys]

It's cheaper in the long run for the power company to put in a larger service than install just what is currently needed. They do not want to have to come back and reinstall a new box/service.

I've been talking with an electrical engineer about a new studio design. They recommend you get a service that is at least 3 times larger than your current need. You also have to keep in mind the spikes from AC and heating units every time they start up. This is as true for a home studio as it it is for a stand alone pro studio.

[jamsmith]

Originally Posted by nosebleedaudio

This is a BAD idea...and NOT to code..
Ground MUST be connected to the center tap of the main AC drop or you WILL not have a path for ground fault current, and will not trip a breaker.
A true dedicated ground means its connected at one point only and is a home run to the main panel, connected at the SAME point as neutral...

THIS IS A GOOD IDEA AND COMPLETLY UP TO CODE!

Technically correct: NEC does not permit isolation transformers to be installed in such a way to isolate the customers neutral from the utilities neutral. However, NEC does permit a "Separately Derived System" which a isolation transformer may create, providing 250.30 provisions are met. In a nutshell, NEC 250.30 provides that you can use an isolated transformer as long as you have "suitable grounding electrode" hence the "grounding rod". In all fairness, the grounding rod size and dimensions may not neccesarily fit the code for an particular installation. The actual size needed can be in found in NEC 250.66

Originally Posted by nosebleedaudio

And salt is highly corrosive, drive more grounds rods...

Yes, salt is highly corrosive that is the purpose for the galvanized steel.

[nosebleedaudio]

Originally Posted by jamsmith

THIS IS A GOOD IDEA AND COMPLETLY UP TO CODE!

Technically correct: NEC does not permit isolation transformers to be installed in such a way to isolate the customers neutral from the utilities neutral. However, NEC does permit a "Separately Derived System" which a isolation transformer may create, providing 250.30 provisions are met. In a nutshell, NEC 250.30 provides that you can use an isolated transformer as long as you have "suitable grounding electrode" hence the "grounding rod". In all fairness, the grounding rod size and dimensions may not neccesarily fit the code for an particular installation. The actual size needed can be in found in NEC 250.66



Yes, salt is highly corrosive that is the purpose for the galvanized steel.

Your confusing two different things, first I know section 250: and section 647: in the code book. My point was and STILL is all grounds have to be connected together at one point only or you will/can have a difference of potential between them, even if you use a iso trans...
IM a big fan of isolation transformers more so for balanced iso trans.
But a floating ground that is NOT connected is a bad idea.
It seems quite a few people have confused an isolated ground plug with an isolated ground, 2 totally different things.
Have been around AC for many years and have done my homework.
And if you need a better connection with the big ball of dirt "earth" then if it was me I would use 2 or more ground rods or a ground plate and connect all together.
And like I said the best ground connection to the earth will NOT compensate for poorly designed gear...
And I might have misread or added incorrectly to what your were saying, if I did.. Sorry..
It's just that this is a VERY important topic that has some giving wrong and dangerous advice...
Have seen many times someone states you need to disconnect the ground wires from the main AC ground, drive a separate ground rod and connect your ground wire to this, an isolated ground that DOES NOT accomplish anything and is dangerous...Safety first, hum/buzz can be corrected in other ways...

[jamsmith]

I never advocated a floating ground. I only advocation having a single ground, and all internal grounds connected to in a star methods. Every ground on every device directly to the one grounding point. And the grounding point be a single ground be one I have installed and know that there will be a single ground point. Why do I want to trust some municipal power company to ensure the ground they supply me with a proper ground? A "Separately Derived System" allow you to build an electrical system that give you complete control of your grounding.