My Garage Live Room Build.

orksnork · 12th May 2007, 06:10 PM

So...we've been tinkering....doing the electric, getting the clouds built, and putting the door in. Finally, today, all of the rockwool, sheetrock, and 703 for the treatments arrive. And we build. Oh yes, we build.

First we start with a dirty old nasty garage. We remove the track for the sliding door, affix it to the house, and frame out the new wall.

next, we take our lovely rock wool and we fill up dem derrr walls!

when building a room for recording purposes, it's essential to treat it to have acoustically accurate and pleasing sound. for this, we buy rigid fiberglass...by the palate...

more updates throughout the day, and through the end of the process...
layer 1, 5/8" gypsum almost complete....pictures then....
then the second layer of 1/2"

orksnork · 12th May 2007, 08:38 PM

First Layer of rock up

Starting second layer...Wave hi to Malcolm (soon to be father in law...he makes sure we don't hack up the whole job!

we'll finish this up soon enough....then we use some acoustic caulk, a bit of spackle....then we're ready to prime and paint!!!

then we can finally hang the clouds (already have been hung and adjusted for height and whatnot, moved em so they don't get banged up)

and then! the hardwood! and then! make the acoustic treatments and huzzah!

actual room size is 22 x 12

orksnork · 13th May 2007, 05:04 PM

because of my back, i've spent the last 6 months on my ass, and had surgery two and a half weeks ago...

manual labor has not been any part of that....i...ache.

johnwayne · 13th May 2007, 05:23 PM

keep the pics coming. Should be worth it in the end though.

orksnork · 13th May 2007, 05:29 PM

thanks for posting...it certainly should (especially coming from recording in a shitty basement

e)

my internet had been crapping out, so i cancelled it and I'm getting verizon FiOS thursday (stealing the neighbors now) so I'm gonna try my best to keep it updated...

I've got more than enough rigid fiberglass (i think...) to do a good deal of treatments in there...

hopefully when I post my plans for the treatments, I can get Ethan and some other reasonably apt people to help me fine tune the placement and what have you...

johnwayne · 14th May 2007, 12:21 AM

No doubt ethan will chime in. He seems to really know his stuff. That cello video he did was really cool.

Good luck on the project by the way.

orksnork · 14th May 2007, 05:53 AM

considering his business, i'd hope that he knew what he was talking about!

err actually....im still kind of wonky on what exactly i'm going to be doing as far as treating...

ideally, i'd like to get some hot drum sounds (as hot as i can out of this size room)...

i've got a good deal of 703 to work with for absorption, and can do what i have to as far as diffusion and what not...

all i'm really set on right now is 4" bass traps straddling two foot wide in the corners, from ceiling to floor....

that leaves tons (as you can see, i've got a pallet full)...

i'm going to make some movable baffles so i can tame things as i please (e.g. vocals, etc)...

What I'm thinking is for the long walls (22ish x 8.25 ft) going with 7 2'x4' 2" broadband absorbers, hung an inch of the wall.

they'll be hung like

O O O O
O O O

up down up down....then on the other wall, they'll be hung opposite...
photoshop is messing up on this computer, ill draw up what i mean tomorrow on the other one...still not sure about diffusers...or what i'm gonna do on the short walls...

orksnork · 14th May 2007, 05:58 AM

what i attempted didn't come out right

those are supposed to be offset....so one is up high, then a foot space, one down low, a foot space, one up high...etc

orksnork · 14th May 2007, 06:05 AM

and as far as getting help on this...
i've been posting on john sayers forum, but the cats over there seem to be very enthusiastically avoiding the thread....been asking ideas about the treatment and hvac for weeks with very little in the way of responses...

Glenn Kuras · 14th May 2007, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orksnork

thanks for posting...it certainly should (especially coming from recording in a shitty basement

e)

my internet had been crapping out, so i cancelled it and I'm getting verizon FiOS thursday (stealing the neighbors now) so I'm gonna try my best to keep it updated...

I've got more than enough rigid fiberglass (i think...) to do a good deal of treatments in there...

hopefully when I post my plans for the treatments, I can get Ethan and some other reasonably apt people to help me fine tune the placement and what have you...

yea man post away. Would be glad to take a look.
Rooms looking good, BTW.

Glenn

orksnork · 14th May 2007, 05:34 PM

Idea 1, for the long walls. This idea would be flopped on the other wall (so where the treatment is up on the wall, opposite it would be down, helping to kill the paralells and still leaving some of the room sound...

Idea 2, for the short walls. Basically same thing..

Idea 3. This is the ceiling. As shown, the black is the MDF frame of the clouds (which are already built, have lights built into the corners). The red is going to be 2" rigid, wrapped of course...

Aside from the floor to ceiling 4" bass traps in the corners...That's what I have so far as my idea of treatment.

orksnork · 14th May 2007, 05:35 PM

note: All treatments would be 2" Rigid, wrapped in fabric, and hung 1" from wall...

Ethan Winer · 15th May 2007, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orksnork

Idea 1, for the long walls ... Idea 2, for the short walls

I got your PM asking me to chime in. This all looks fine, but obviously you need to be sure all the first reflection points are treated. I'm partial to either stripes or a checkerboard pattern. Whatever floats your boat and covers enough surface to avoid flutter echo is fine.

--Ethan

Glenn Kuras · 15th May 2007, 06:07 PM

As Ethan said that should be fine, but here is a little cool idea. Get some 4 foot x 6 inch panels and cover the wall with them 4" apart. This will give you a little diffusion/absorption in the room. We did one room that way and it sounded REALLY cool. It was a idea Bryan, our lead room set up guy came up with.

Glenn

orksnork · 15th May 2007, 07:26 PM

Thanks for chiming in guys...definitely something to consider...

Does anyone have any ideas on how they'd go about mounting this stuff so it's off of the wall?? that's really leaving my scratching my head.

Glenn Kuras · 15th May 2007, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orksnork

Thanks for chiming in guys...definitely something to consider...

Does anyone have any ideas on how they'd go about mounting this stuff so it's off of the wall?? that's really leaving my scratching my head.

If our stuff it hangs on the wall like a picture frame so you can just put a spacer (piece of wood or PVC pipe) between the panel and the wall. The weight of the panel keeps it in place.

Glenn

Ethan Winer · 16th May 2007, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orksnork

Does anyone have any ideas on how they'd go about mounting this stuff so it's off of the wall??

Here's how we do it:

RealTraps - RealTraps Rigid Mounting

--Ethan

orksnork · 16th May 2007, 06:09 PM

now there, my friend, is quite an idea...

i'll have to peer around home depot and see if i can get the size brackets i want for my treatments...

as opposed to a mounting bar, which doesn't come standard with my homeade treatments, i could just use a bit of wire secured across the top to rest inside the brackets...

then the weight of the treatment itself should pull it down to rest on the bottom bracket....

this also leaves the option of removing the treatments and replacing them...as I've been mulling the idea of making some angled slat panels as well to being able to change the characteristics of my room...

ideas ideas....hmm

orksnork · 16th May 2007, 07:04 PM

Watching some videos on your site Ethan, funny and informative stuff..
Bear's bag of cat toys hahaha...

Anyways... I think the last thing I have left to worry about here is the type of fabric I'm going to be using.

What sort of fabrics are good, what are bad...what what what.

I'd much much rather stay away from grays, whites, etc. I'm looking to find some red fabric. A friend of mine has told me of a place that sells fabric around here, and usually has bolts for very cheap of older fabric they are looking to get rid of.

What should I look for? What should I stay away from?

Any thoughts, ideas, or links to fabrics would be helfpul, or if this is really just not that important, phew.

Ethan Winer · 16th May 2007, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by orksnork

Watching some videos on your site Ethan, funny and informative stuff..
Bear's bag of cat toys hahaha...

Bear says he's glad you liked that.

Quote:

What sort of fabrics are good, what are bad...what what what.

The blurb below is from my Acoustics FAQ.

--Ethan

Quote:

Nearly any porous fabric is appropriate, and one popular brand is Guilford type FR701. Unfortunately, it's very expensive. One key feature of FR701 is that it's made of polyester so it won't shrink or loosen with changes in humidity when stretched on a frame. But polyester is a common material available in many styles and patterns at any local fabric store. Another feature of FR701 is that it's one of the few commercial fabrics rated to be acoustically transparent. But since you're not using it as speaker grill cloth to place in front of a tweeter, that feature too is not necessary. Shiny fabrics having a tight weave should be avoided because they reflect higher frequencies. The standard test for acoustic fabric is to hold it to your mouth and try to blow air through it. If you can blow through it easily, it will pass sound into the fiberglass. Burlap and Muslin are two inexpensive options, but nearly any soft fabric will work and also keep the glass fibers safely in place.

Glenn Kuras · 16th May 2007, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ethan Winer

Bear says he's glad you liked that.

--Ethan

Looks like to me he is saying "GO AWAY I AM SLEEPING".

orksnork · 20th May 2007, 06:55 PM

little update...

Yesterday I got the last of the rock hung and got the room caulked and the first coat of spackle is up. Today or tomorrow, I'll sand it and give it a skim coat where necessary and then it's time to boogie...

Didn't get to take any pictures because it was starting to rain and I had to get a bunch of stuff back inside of the room from the yard.

octatonic · 20th May 2007, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ethan Winer

Here's how we do it:

RealTraps - RealTraps Rigid Mounting

--Ethan

On the cheap I've used a couple of 2x4 offcuts cut to the same width and just placed them at the top and bottom of the trap.
The traps are hung on lightweight chain.

outoftune · 20th May 2007, 08:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by myfipie

As Ethan said that should be fine, but here is a little cool idea. Get some 4 foot x 6 inch panels and cover the wall with them 4" apart. This will give you a little diffusion/absorption in the room. We did one room that way and it sounded REALLY cool. It was a idea Bryan, our lead room set up guy came up with.

Glenn

do you have any pictures of this? i think i know what you mean but am having a bit of trouble picturing it.

orksnork · 5th June 2007, 02:39 PM

im gonna run outside once the blood starts flowing and snap a few pictures....

the room is painted and looks good. the trim around the top is up as well as two of the clouds (without the insulation)....

the middle cloud isn't up yet, as we still need access to the trap door in the ceiling to run the rest of the cabling (didn't want to run it into the room during the build....

we've got 98% of the flooring in...the only part left is the last run against the wall where it's skinnier and we'll have to rip cut it all long ways....

we would've gotten around to it the other night, but it started raining and we had to pack up the saws and stuff...

Glenn Kuras · 5th June 2007, 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by outoftune

do you have any pictures of this? i think i know what you mean but am having a bit of trouble picturing it.

Instead of making the panels 2x4 just make them 6"x4 and the mount them on the wall side by side 4" or 6" apart. Does that clear it up?

Glenn

stresstour · 6th June 2007, 03:53 PM

Hey, how about some more pics?

orksnork · 6th June 2007, 04:30 PM

DOH...manana

Glenn Kuras · 6th June 2007, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stresstour

Hey, how about some more pics?

I just put some up and if I can find

my dig camera I will post them.

Glenn

orksnork · 11th June 2007, 09:31 PM

gotta get a new battery charger for my dslr...

the girlfriend's crap camera reveals only this

looking damn hot in person...tomorrow i'll get all of the junk out of there (most of it is the fiberglass for the treatments) and start putting them together...wooo

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12th May 2007, 06:10 PM	#1
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	My Garage Live Room Build. So...we've been tinkering....doing the electric, getting the clouds built, and putting the door in. Finally, today, all of the rockwool, sheetrock, and 703 for the treatments arrive. And we build. Oh yes, we build. First we start with a dirty old nasty garage. We remove the track for the sliding door, affix it to the house, and frame out the new wall. next, we take our lovely rock wool and we fill up dem derrr walls! when building a room for recording purposes, it's essential to treat it to have acoustically accurate and pleasing sound. for this, we buy rigid fiberglass...by the palate... more updates throughout the day, and through the end of the process... layer 1, 5/8" gypsum almost complete....pictures then.... then the second layer of 1/2"

13th May 2007, 05:23 PM	#4
johnwayne Lives for gear Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Athens, Ga Posts: 540	keep the pics coming. Should be worth it in the end though. __________________ www.learningguitarnow.com

14th May 2007, 12:21 AM	#6
johnwayne Lives for gear Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Athens, Ga Posts: 540	No doubt ethan will chime in. He seems to really know his stuff. That cello video he did was really cool. Good luck on the project by the way. __________________ www.learningguitarnow.com

15th May 2007, 06:07 PM	#14
Glenn Kuras Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 3,905	As Ethan said that should be fine, but here is a little cool idea. Get some 4 foot x 6 inch panels and cover the wall with them 4" apart. This will give you a little diffusion/absorption in the room. We did one room that way and it sounded REALLY cool. It was a idea Bryan, our lead room set up guy came up with. Glenn __________________ Glenn Kuras - GIK Acoustics www.GIKAcoustics.com Need help with your room? click here

12th May 2007, 08:38 PM	#2
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	First Layer of rock up Starting second layer...Wave hi to Malcolm (soon to be father in law...he makes sure we don't hack up the whole job! we'll finish this up soon enough....then we use some acoustic caulk, a bit of spackle....then we're ready to prime and paint!!! then we can finally hang the clouds (already have been hung and adjusted for height and whatnot, moved em so they don't get banged up) and then! the hardwood! and then! make the acoustic treatments and huzzah! actual room size is 22 x 12

13th May 2007, 05:04 PM	#3
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	because of my back, i've spent the last 6 months on my ass, and had surgery two and a half weeks ago... manual labor has not been any part of that....i...ache.

13th May 2007, 05:29 PM	#5
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	thanks for posting...it certainly should (especially coming from recording in a shitty basement e) my internet had been crapping out, so i cancelled it and I'm getting verizon FiOS thursday (stealing the neighbors now) so I'm gonna try my best to keep it updated... I've got more than enough rigid fiberglass (i think...) to do a good deal of treatments in there... hopefully when I post my plans for the treatments, I can get Ethan and some other reasonably apt people to help me fine tune the placement and what have you...

14th May 2007, 05:53 AM	#7
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	considering his business, i'd hope that he knew what he was talking about! err actually....im still kind of wonky on what exactly i'm going to be doing as far as treating... ideally, i'd like to get some hot drum sounds (as hot as i can out of this size room)... i've got a good deal of 703 to work with for absorption, and can do what i have to as far as diffusion and what not... all i'm really set on right now is 4" bass traps straddling two foot wide in the corners, from ceiling to floor.... that leaves tons (as you can see, i've got a pallet full)... i'm going to make some movable baffles so i can tame things as i please (e.g. vocals, etc)... What I'm thinking is for the long walls (22ish x 8.25 ft) going with 7 2'x4' 2" broadband absorbers, hung an inch of the wall. they'll be hung like O O O O O O O up down up down....then on the other wall, they'll be hung opposite... photoshop is messing up on this computer, ill draw up what i mean tomorrow on the other one...still not sure about diffusers...or what i'm gonna do on the short walls...

14th May 2007, 05:58 AM	#8
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	what i attempted didn't come out right those are supposed to be offset....so one is up high, then a foot space, one down low, a foot space, one up high...etc

14th May 2007, 06:05 AM	#9
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	and as far as getting help on this... i've been posting on john sayers forum, but the cats over there seem to be very enthusiastically avoiding the thread....been asking ideas about the treatment and hvac for weeks with very little in the way of responses...

14th May 2007, 05:34 PM	#11
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	Idea 1, for the long walls. This idea would be flopped on the other wall (so where the treatment is up on the wall, opposite it would be down, helping to kill the paralells and still leaving some of the room sound... Idea 2, for the short walls. Basically same thing.. Idea 3. This is the ceiling. As shown, the black is the MDF frame of the clouds (which are already built, have lights built into the corners). The red is going to be 2" rigid, wrapped of course... Aside from the floor to ceiling 4" bass traps in the corners...That's what I have so far as my idea of treatment.

14th May 2007, 05:35 PM	#12
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	note: All treatments would be 2" Rigid, wrapped in fabric, and hung 1" from wall...

15th May 2007, 07:26 PM	#15
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	Thanks for chiming in guys...definitely something to consider... Does anyone have any ideas on how they'd go about mounting this stuff so it's off of the wall?? that's really leaving my scratching my head.

16th May 2007, 06:09 PM	#18
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	now there, my friend, is quite an idea... i'll have to peer around home depot and see if i can get the size brackets i want for my treatments... as opposed to a mounting bar, which doesn't come standard with my homeade treatments, i could just use a bit of wire secured across the top to rest inside the brackets... then the weight of the treatment itself should pull it down to rest on the bottom bracket.... this also leaves the option of removing the treatments and replacing them...as I've been mulling the idea of making some angled slat panels as well to being able to change the characteristics of my room... ideas ideas....hmm

16th May 2007, 07:04 PM	#19
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	Watching some videos on your site Ethan, funny and informative stuff.. Bear's bag of cat toys hahaha... Anyways... I think the last thing I have left to worry about here is the type of fabric I'm going to be using. What sort of fabrics are good, what are bad...what what what. I'd much much rather stay away from grays, whites, etc. I'm looking to find some red fabric. A friend of mine has told me of a place that sells fabric around here, and usually has bolts for very cheap of older fabric they are looking to get rid of. What should I look for? What should I stay away from? Any thoughts, ideas, or links to fabrics would be helfpul, or if this is really just not that important, phew.

20th May 2007, 06:55 PM	#22
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	little update... Yesterday I got the last of the rock hung and got the room caulked and the first coat of spackle is up. Today or tomorrow, I'll sand it and give it a skim coat where necessary and then it's time to boogie... Didn't get to take any pictures because it was starting to rain and I had to get a bunch of stuff back inside of the room from the yard.

5th June 2007, 02:39 PM	#25
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	im gonna run outside once the blood starts flowing and snap a few pictures.... the room is painted and looks good. the trim around the top is up as well as two of the clouds (without the insulation).... the middle cloud isn't up yet, as we still need access to the trap door in the ceiling to run the rest of the cabling (didn't want to run it into the room during the build.... we've got 98% of the flooring in...the only part left is the last run against the wall where it's skinnier and we'll have to rip cut it all long ways.... we would've gotten around to it the other night, but it started raining and we had to pack up the saws and stuff...

6th June 2007, 03:53 PM	#27
stresstour Gear maniac Join Date: Apr 2007 Posts: 222	Hey, how about some more pics?

6th June 2007, 04:30 PM	#28
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	DOH...manana

11th June 2007, 09:31 PM	#30
orksnork Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: long island, ny Posts: 741	gotta get a new battery charger for my dslr... the girlfriend's crap camera reveals only this looking damn hot in person...tomorrow i'll get all of the junk out of there (most of it is the fiberglass for the treatments) and start putting them together...wooo