Linear Phase or "Knob" EQ plug in???

Slater · 16th November 2006, 10:33 AM

Hello Everyone,

It's time for me to get some high end eq plug-ins.

I have been using the built-in "EQ4" in Ableton Live 5. I believe that type of eq is called "Linear Phase"... is that correct? Its the type that has points along a line which you can drag up or down to change the eq curve. It also shows the frequency numbers along the bottom.

I've come to like this design because I can for example view my kick drum channel with a spectrum analyzer, see where the energy is rising then go back into a bass channel and pull out eq in that exact range... so keep the bass and kick clear of each other.

But now as I look into plug-ins the URS-N and A seem to get high praise, run Native and the price of admission is low. Of course these are "knob" eqs.

I was considering maybe the Sony Oxford EQ when it becomes available as an Audio Unit to cover my Linear Phase and the URS. This would get me to about 800€.

However the Waves SSL Bundle here is 850€.

I would appreciate any opinions!!!

Thank you very much.

blaugruen7 · 16th November 2006, 11:12 AM

i would demo aireq.
i love the fact that it has no graphics.
http://www.eliosound.com/

Kiwiburger · 16th November 2006, 11:18 AM

The term "linear phase" has nothing to do with whether the GUI has knobs or faders or graph nodes or whatever.

Linear means in a line. Phase is about the time of a cycle (phases of the moon).

A major issue with most eq's (especially analog hardware) is that the electronics or code can introduce a "phase shift" - and that phase shift can be different for different frequencies. Capacitors take time to charge and discharge; inductors take time to build a magnetic field, and then collapse it again. Code takes time for the numbers to crunch.

Phase shifts add color - and often that color is highly desirable.

It is possible to build an eq that has the same phase shift for ALL frequencies - in otherwords, a completely flat or linear phase shift. This requires careful component selection and trimming (probably a switchable eq, rather than any knobs or faders). With digital code, there a other tricks that ensure linear phase. One cool trick is to do the eq in two passes - forwards, and then backwards. Any phase shifts which are introduced in the forwards pass are reversed out on the backwards pass.

The end result is a transparent, clean, surgical, boring eq. Ideal for mastering, or surgical work, where you don't want to introduce color.

I adore my PSP plugins, and have the Master EQ and Neon, for both options. Huge CPU hit and latency on Neon, but when you need quality it costs.

I think SonicFlavours eq is an amazingly efficient and good sounding eq, and I really like their GUI. I like to type in numbers when I am going for a specific frequency, or have the option of moving a graph around. I don't like knobs - this is digital eq, so why not take advantage of software GUI features.

narco · 16th November 2006, 11:49 AM

I'm guessing you would like a coloured eq like the URS ones

linear phase eq's like the neon don't generally have the same character, they are more transparent. If you want an eq you can hear the sound of (in a good way) something like the URS is a good bet

narco

Slater · 16th November 2006, 12:21 PM

Thanks for the responses.

I guess what I really want is a musical sounding eq like the URS-N and A but with the GUI which shows me the "graph" and has points on it to drag.

I will buy an iLok tomorrow and start demo-ing all I can.

narco · 18th November 2006, 02:23 AM

alot of people think its best not to have the graph, it gets in the way of your judgement.

One with a graph you might like is the eq from sonalksis

http://www.sonalksis.com/

narco

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16th November 2006, 10:33 AM	#1
Slater Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 122	Linear Phase or "Knob" EQ plug in??? Hello Everyone, It's time for me to get some high end eq plug-ins. I have been using the built-in "EQ4" in Ableton Live 5. I believe that type of eq is called "Linear Phase"... is that correct? Its the type that has points along a line which you can drag up or down to change the eq curve. It also shows the frequency numbers along the bottom. I've come to like this design because I can for example view my kick drum channel with a spectrum analyzer, see where the energy is rising then go back into a bass channel and pull out eq in that exact range... so keep the bass and kick clear of each other. But now as I look into plug-ins the URS-N and A seem to get high praise, run Native and the price of admission is low. Of course these are "knob" eqs. I was considering maybe the Sony Oxford EQ when it becomes available as an Audio Unit to cover my Linear Phase and the URS. This would get me to about 800€. However the Waves SSL Bundle here is 850€. I would appreciate any opinions!!! Thank you very much.

16th November 2006, 11:49 AM	#4
narco Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Switzerland/New Zealand/guitar case Posts: 3,381	I'm guessing you would like a coloured eq like the URS ones linear phase eq's like the neon don't generally have the same character, they are more transparent. If you want an eq you can hear the sound of (in a good way) something like the URS is a good bet narco __________________ The last thing for me to sell! FS: Mytek 896 D-A + exp card (located in new zealand) - will ship worldwide

18th November 2006, 02:23 AM	#6
narco Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Switzerland/New Zealand/guitar case Posts: 3,381	alot of people think its best not to have the graph, it gets in the way of your judgement. One with a graph you might like is the eq from sonalksis http://www.sonalksis.com/ narco __________________ The last thing for me to sell! FS: Mytek 896 D-A + exp card (located in new zealand) - will ship worldwide

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16th November 2006, 11:12 AM	#2
blaugruen7 Lives for gear Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: berlin Posts: 1,654	i would demo aireq. i love the fact that it has no graphics. http://www.eliosound.com/

16th November 2006, 11:18 AM	#3
Kiwiburger Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 3,767	The term "linear phase" has nothing to do with whether the GUI has knobs or faders or graph nodes or whatever. Linear means in a line. Phase is about the time of a cycle (phases of the moon). A major issue with most eq's (especially analog hardware) is that the electronics or code can introduce a "phase shift" - and that phase shift can be different for different frequencies. Capacitors take time to charge and discharge; inductors take time to build a magnetic field, and then collapse it again. Code takes time for the numbers to crunch. Phase shifts add color - and often that color is highly desirable. It is possible to build an eq that has the same phase shift for ALL frequencies - in otherwords, a completely flat or linear phase shift. This requires careful component selection and trimming (probably a switchable eq, rather than any knobs or faders). With digital code, there a other tricks that ensure linear phase. One cool trick is to do the eq in two passes - forwards, and then backwards. Any phase shifts which are introduced in the forwards pass are reversed out on the backwards pass. The end result is a transparent, clean, surgical, boring eq. Ideal for mastering, or surgical work, where you don't want to introduce color. I adore my PSP plugins, and have the Master EQ and Neon, for both options. Huge CPU hit and latency on Neon, but when you need quality it costs. I think SonicFlavours eq is an amazingly efficient and good sounding eq, and I really like their GUI. I like to type in numbers when I am going for a specific frequency, or have the option of moving a graph around. I don't like knobs - this is digital eq, so why not take advantage of software GUI features.

16th November 2006, 12:21 PM	#5
Slater Gear nut Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 122	Thanks for the responses. I guess what I really want is a musical sounding eq like the URS-N and A but with the GUI which shows me the "graph" and has points on it to drag. I will buy an iLok tomorrow and start demo-ing all I can.