Does the Vintech X73i really have St Ives transformers?

[robertshaw]

I built a couple nevish clones bought much of my stuff from here

Audio Maintenance Limited Transformers and Inductors

if anyone cares........

from my research and studying photos, DYI boards etc... many of the neve cloner
parts are all available retail. I disected a BA unit found virtually every part online

the vintech unit has custom trannys? hmmm why bother? the retail stock carnhills sound killer

[kafka]

Originally Posted by True North

Well yes and no. I do stand corrected on one issue, I was not aware that Iron quality had varied greatly over the years.

NOW, whether or not a human being could tell the difference in sound between higher quality Iron and lower quality Iron is huge question mark for me and perhaps discussion for another thread.

Old, old thread, and an old, old point. I'm just piping up to emphasize that in my own former life in materials science, it was amazing to see how one 'standardized' material would vary from one batch to another. My area of research was in the elasticity, plasticity, and wear characteristics related to the crystalline structure of metals. However, I can also see that electromagnetic properties could also vary from batch to batch.

It's well known that certain fine tool makers seek out iron forged before 1876, because at that time purification processes were developed that enabled the use of lower grade iron. This resulted in an iron product that was significantly cheaper, but also inferior to the earlier product for the purpose of blade making. Since the development of the basic oxygen furnace in the 1950's, the previously used Bessemer process has been entirely replaced worldwide. Older mills in the US were replaced by newer mills in Asia in the 80's, and with that, the demise of the Bessemer process. Also significant to changes in steel quality would be the large percentage of recycled material used today.

Of course, any discussion of quality without reference to a specific performance standard is essentially meaningless. "Better" could mean lighter, or stronger, more wear resistant, or just cheaper. That said, for the purpose of recreating old technology, it's safe to say that newer materials are simply different, and can't be expected to perform exactly the same in all respects.

[Blewgrass]

Originally Posted by robertshaw

I built a couple nevish clones bought much of my stuff from here

Audio Maintenance Limited Transformers and Inductors

Cool link, thanks.

those little 500 series mic amps look like a good bang for the buck. Too bad I am not 500 series mobile .... yet!

[robertshaw]

Originally Posted by Blewgrass

Cool link, thanks.

those little 500 series mic amps look like a good bang for the buck. Too bad I am not 500 series mobile .... yet!

I was tempted but the damn US $$$.
If I lived in the UK I'd fill a lunch box with those. I bet they sound killer

anyone?

[E.rOk.stA]

I'm pretty sure that they were trying to avoid China. Oh well.

[bc184c]

The transformers we've been using in all of our gear for about the last five years are all made here in the U.S. I discussed earlier in the thread about their construction information.

Thanks,
Dallas Upton
Vintech Audio

[andrewenson]

hey dallas i got a question for you (even though this thread is crusty old)
just got a x81 from a good trade today.
i got to demo the pre before i decided to do the trade (small private studio in north hollywood)
they had one male singer and they used 3 mics. a vintage neumann u47, telefunken ak47, and a at4060. i loved it and did the trade. he said it was extremely new besides the scratches from racking (to be expected of course)

so i just got home and opened it to look at its innards and look what i found.
i'm not worried or anything but i'd like to know approximately when this was manufactured
when did you guys stop manufacturing your pres replacing the carhills with the new custom ones?

btw is the electrical tape supposed to be there?

[dale661]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

It has been theorized that the reason old transformers generally sound better, is because the quality of iron available in decades past was much better.

Actually, that is an incorrect statement. The quality of iron available is actually much better, as it's purer than it was back in the day. Metallurgy has gotten better with the advancement of technology over the years.

With all of that said, the steel that is being made today, when applied in the context of output transformers, doesn't sound as good as the steel that was made "back in the day". Steel comes in varying grades. Most transformer manufacturers compensate for these variances in order to get closer to the inferior grades of steel from that past that were used in transformers in the past. In other words, the impurities in the steel played a huge role in the end result.

Modern production techniques are different than those of the past as well. Sure, this creates more consistency, yet it can also degrade the end result. Inconsistencies of the past led to some great sounding transformers. Regardless of specification sheets, no two transformers will sound exactly the same, as it's an older form of technology with many variables that interleave and play a huge role in the overall scheme.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by dale661

Actually, that is an incorrect statement. The quality of iron available is actually much better, as it's purer than it was back in the day.

Tell that to the transformer manufacturers.

[bushwick]

Hey, I'll answer for you. The tape on the switch is supposed to be there. All good. The date should be on the back of the unit. It'll say something like x81 021. Or it'll look like x81 012 123105. The longer number at the end is the date code (Dec. 31, 2005)

Something unrelated. . . if you like the pre as it is now, you are going to freak out before too long. I have twelve x81's and have used the hell out of them for the last five years. After talking extensively with Dallas about them, I started messing around with them and with his advice, they have been retuned if you will. I am peeing my pants with excitement. Also, my tech and I are going to design daughter board assemblies to add peaking switches to the outside two bands, something that I thought would make these units much more useful. Stay tuned. Dallas isn't ready to do it yet, but he will be performing these mods to X81's. I am absolutely not joking here. The difference is fantastic, though primarily when the eq is engaged. And don't worry about the iron guys. These units sound fab.

Best,
josh
Bushwick Studio
Bushwick Studio - Welcome to Bushwick Studio

Originally Posted by andrewenson

hey dallas i got a question for you (even though this thread is crusty old)
just got a x81 from a good trade today.
i got to demo the pre before i decided to do the trade (small private studio in north hollywood)
they had one male singer and they used 3 mics. a vintage neumann u47, telefunken ak47, and a at4060. i loved it and did the trade. he said it was extremely new besides the scratches from racking (to be expected of course)

so i just got home and opened it to look at its innards and look what i found.
i'm not worried or anything but i'd like to know approximately when this was manufactured
when did you guys stop manufacturing your pres replacing the carhills with the new custom ones?

btw is the electrical tape supposed to be there?

[Faderjockey]

Here is a LTD-1 transformers (old pic) but the is serial #69

[Fleaman]

Originally Posted by Faderjockey

Here is a LTD-1 transformers (old pic) but the is serial #69

On the early Chandler LTD-1's they basically used Neve 1073 guts/parts in a Chandler chassis. Depending on how early (first 50 to first 100 units), you could get the original Neve B184/B284 amp card (or is it B183/B283?), marinair tranny's, etc.

I have #49 and it has Neve cards and Marinair trannys, basically a real deal Neve 1073 in a Chandler Chassis.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by Fleaman

On the early Chandler LTD-1's they basically used Neve 1073 guts/parts in a Chandler chassis. Depending on how early (first 50 to first 100 units), you could get the original Neve B183/B283 amp card, marinair tranny's, etc.

I have #49 and it has Neve cards and Marinair trannys, basically a real deal Neve 1073 in a Chandler Chassis.

Are you sure they are Marinair's?

I don't think Chandler ever used any in the LTD's, but it's possible. I could tell you if you send me a photo.

[Fleaman]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

Are you sure they are Marinair's?

I don't think Chandler ever used any in the LTD's, but it's possible. I could tell you if you send me a photo.

Again, it was on the very early units only. I remember the green input tranny's had 10468(?) and I think they also said 'marinair' on them. The output was just LO1166 w/o any marinair stamp, but it looked old (not like a new repop).

The circuit board cards said 'Neve' on them and B184 etc.

It's in the rack, so I'd have to take it out to do pics. I'll post here if I do.

I did look at a newer (than mine) LTD-1, but still an early unit, like in the 0060's serial #'s, and it had the Neve cards, Marinair inputs, but had an aftermarket reproduction LO1166 output tranny....I passed on the unit (as I think that output tranny is where most of that magic happens). The earlier serial the better on the LTD-1's, If you want the most Neve parts in them....

[Faderjockey]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

Are you sure they are Marinair's?

I don't think Chandler ever used any in the LTD's, but it's possible. I could tell you if you send me a photo.

Yes mine are in that pic and hard to see..but the boards do say Neve on them.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by Faderjockey

Yes mine are in that pic and hard to see..but the boards do say Neve on them.

I'm almost positive that output transformer is not a Marinair... but the inputs certainly look like they might be. But, it's difficult to see in the picture.

[Faderjockey]

Originally Posted by TonyBelmont

I'm almost positive that output transformer is not a Marinair... but the inputs certainly look like they might be. But, it's difficult to see in the picture.

Yes.. I meant the input. That pic is from like 2002 or 2003 or something. I don't recall. I need to open it and clean it anyway when I get time. It's been a while since I looked..
But I thought the output could have been a St. Ives. but that may have been another one of my units.. I'll have to look when I get a chance.