Drum mic selection for 70's funk / soul sound? - sub 1500 euro!!!

[I.R.Baboon]

Gents,

I guess the title says it all.

I'm after that dead 70's funk sound.

Think Roy Ayers, Parliament, Chic, asorted disco etc.

Can someone suggest a mic collection that would cover this?

I'm thinking

2 x snare mics
1 x hihat
3 x tom mics
2 x overheads
2 x kick

I would like to buy the mic's new, not second hand.

If one of the mics could double up as a semi-usable vocal mic occasionally, that would be a bonus.

Budget is around 1500 euro (which is around 1900 yankee dollars)

I look forward to your input.

sniff.........

I.R.

[chrisso]

Hmm, that works out about $200 per mic.......and you wont buy used.

I've created similar drum sounds and I've tended to use quite expensive mics, old Neumann KM84, Km56, U47 and U67's.

I guess a big characteristic of those sounds is the small space they were recorded in and the way the drums were played, set up and tuned.
Those are probably the most important factors, especially as you don't have much of a mic budget.

Cheap mics I guess I'd start looking at.....
SM57 (Snare)
Avenson (O/heads)
D12 (Bas drum)

[I.R.Baboon]

Chrisso, thanks.

Yes, I'm aware that 1500 euro ($1900) isn't that much.

I'm also aware that the playing, tuning/damping and room treatment will be key to getting that sound.

And anyway, a lot of my favorite records from the 70's don't have great sound, although the playing, tuning and room treatment are very nice.

So i figured that fairly cheap mics would do the trick - anyway, that's all that's available moneywise right now.

Ok, I'm gonna just come out and say it.........the pre's will be Mackie Onyx 1640 (firewire to computer).........shoot me now....sniff

[disco2k3]

You might be able to get away with no overheads, and you probably don't want lots of overheads if you're recording in a very reflective room and are going for a dry close mic sound. Maybe just one well placed overall "room/overhead" mic if you need to get those cymbals in there.

Don't go crazy on the tom mics, but stretch your $$ for a good kick snare and hat mics.

You got to get the drums sounding right first. Check the many threads on how to get a nice dry and tight drum sound. What I find most important is a dead snare and kick. Duct tape or a wallet on the snare, helps to have a head that sounds right to begin with, like coated ambassadors. Pillows/blankets in the kick, take the front head off or get heads for the kick drum that don't resonate forever. Try taking the heads of the bottom of the toms as well.

The tighter the room sound the tighter your drum sound will be. Ideally you want a room that deads the sound, try surrounding the kit with heavy blankets or something.

Here's where I would start looking from with that budget, I know this doesn't neatly cover everything in your list, but you could do it with just these mics):
D112 - Inside Kick
SM57 - Snare Top
Josephcson c42 x2 (or other SD condenser maybe sm81) - Hat and bottom snare
Shure pg56 (or other cheap tom mics) x 3 - Toms
AT4050 (or SE, or Rode or...) - Room/outside kick (and general purpose ld condenser)
Drummer will also need a loud pair of closed headphones, HD280 would work, but I'm sure there are even cheaper options.

[I.R.Baboon]

Thanks Discoman

Anyone else?

[seaneldon]

i'd make sure to choose the actual drums, drummer, and room way before you start thinking about mics. the funk/soul sound of the 70s is very distinctive and it has little to do with the mics they used.

[Steffmo]

70's...I'm not sure there was a D112. The kick is most likely an RE20. Snare 57, or maybe an Altec Saltshaker. Toms...the ubiquetous Senn 421. Maybe a mono overhead.....and 87.

[chrisso]

Originally Posted by Steffmo

70's...I'm not sure there was a D112. The kick is most likely an RE20. Snare 57, or maybe an Altec Saltshaker. Toms...the ubiquetous Senn 421. Maybe a mono overhead.....and 87.

Exactly, but no one is recommending those because a single mic would blow the $2000 budget.

We've already recommended a 57. A D12 or D112 would be ok, but it's the budget that's causing the problem. Finding cheaper mics to sound like the standard 70's mic set up.

[PRobb]

AKG 451s were very common as OH. I just had a chance to use the Oktava 012s as OHs and thought they were in that ballpark and did a great job.

For the 70s thing, you'll need a very dead space for the drums. Booths with carpeted walls were very popular. I'm not sure this is crucial, but the carpet tended to have a permanent smell of pot.

[Steffmo]

Well, the carpet might not be, but the pot smell probably means the band is in the right groove....

[macr0w]

Just get one of these and just tape up your drum heads, and then put 2 pillows in the kick.

[I.R.Baboon]

Ok my chickens, from the answers in this thread (thanks all) plus perusing the archives, I’ve come up with this list. Would this do it?

Snare top:.....................SM57
Snare bottom:................Audix i-5
HiHat:...........................SM81
Toms x 2.......................E604
Low Tom.......................Audix D4
Kick..............................D112
Kick 2...........................SM57
OH’s.............................MK 012 matched

At the end of the day (as discussed), it doesn't really matter, does it?

I.R.B.

[max cooper]

Scratch the hat mic. I use 'em sometimes, but on a budget, don't get a hat mic.

Disco, maybe, but not totally necessary for Funk.

Does it matter? Not as much as how good the drummer is.

I would actually not use the two omni + a kick Earthworks deal as to me, Funk was more about damped, close mic'd sounds most of the time.

That's gonna be more rock or jazz sounding to me.

And don't forget that a mono overhead can totally be fine for now.

[I.R.Baboon]

I'm feelin' ya Max.

What i actually like a about a lot of 70's stuff is the lack of cymbals and general high frequency annoyance.

So maybe the OH's are not necassary. On the other hand, if i want to feature the cymbals in a track (as an overdub) i might miss the lack of a decent pair of mics set up for the purpose.

I didn't get your earthworks refence - i don't think i listed any Earthworks mics!

[I.R.Baboon]

sniff

[max cooper]

Originally Posted by macr0w

Just get one of these and just tape up your drum heads, and then put 2 pillows in the kick.

I've used those Radio Shack boundary mics ($40) to pick up some roominess before. Not bad for the dosh.

Just remember, Funk is it's own reward.

[u b k]

2x oktava mk012 with lomo capsules.
1x fet47.
1x re20.
4x 57.


at'll do ya.


gregoire
del
ubk
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