ProTools Mix Vs Nuendo Mix: MP3s Posted

[Henchman]

I dont know. All I know is that agian, today, a client mentioned specifically how good the dialogue sounded in a Series I was mixing.

The difference?
I did the dialogue premix in Nuendo, as opposed to Pt's.

[RKrizman]

Originally posted by Henchman
I dont know. All I know is that agian, today, a client mentioned specifically how good the dialogue sounded in a Series I was mixing.

The difference?
I did the dialogue premix in Nuendo, as opposed to Pt's.

Everybody knows that PT sucks for dialog premixes.

Come on Henchie, let's be civilized here. To suggest that any modern DAW can't digitally store and spit out tracks with bit for bit accuracy is a bit medieval. If there was some sort of error in this regard the difference would not be some euphonic gradation. There would be buzzing and clicking and silence and and gross distortion and other obvious, unpleasant things. In other words, it would sound like it's broken, because it would be.

-R

[Henchman]

As I've stated before.
I just don't care if you believe me or not. It does not affect me in any way whatsoever. So getting into any kind of debate is pointless.
If you choose to label me as a crackpot, then so be it.

[drew]

Originally posted by Henchman
The difference?
I did the dialogue premix in Nuendo, as opposed to Pt's.

not to mention the literally thousands of other minor decisions that will be different on a day to day basis in anything we do. You hate PT, so you probably don't have the enthusiasm that you do when you're working in Nuendo. that alone is enough to cause the results to be skewed. all things must be equal for a test to be valid. I agree with RKrizman, if you're saying that when you go from one DAW to another that it sounds like your ears have been cleaned out then either something's wrong with one of the systems or you're using hyperbole to try and prove a point. Hench, you love getting into these PT v. Nuendo debates. You must, you do it all the time. I've never seen anybody so intent on validating himself.
drew

[blackcatdigi]

Originally posted by Henchman
As I've stated before.
I just don't care if you believe me or not. It does not affect me in any way whatsoever. So getting into any kind of debate is pointless.
If you choose to label me as a crackpot, then so be it.

Wow...

This is not debatable... This is impossible.

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

ad infinitum

To imply that this is NOT so is ludicrous.

Use whatever you want. You can debate the merits of various systems, but stating that an identical sample (w/no processing or summing, played out through the same DAC) sounds 'better' in one system vs. another is preposterous, and indicative of an error somewhere.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by blackcatdigi

ad infinitum

To imply that this is NOT so is ludicrous.

When doing a dialogue premix you will have at least one EQ plug-in. I usually have 2 types of eq plug-ins.
And the faders are never left ot 0.

So, I'm talking realworld. You are talking bullshit, faders at 0 no plug-ins non-realworld.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by drew

You hate PT, so you probably don't have the enthusiasm that you do when you're working in Nuendo. that alone is enough to cause the results to be skewed.
drew

To imply that I would not try to do a good job using the equipment at hand, for someone who is paying me good money to do so, is insulting.

Maybe that's how you approach your work. I don't.
The fact of the matter is, that I can get better sounding results using Nuendo.
But if the job requires me to use an inferior sounding product, that ****s with yout sound, then that's what I'll use. And I'll do as good a job as is possible without bitching or moaning.

Unlike numerous PT users I have encountered who frewak when they have to use somethign else.

[T_R_S]

I was st AES and attended an engneer talking head panel, Bob Clearmountain, Chris & Tom Lord-Alge, ad J.J.P. All did not have any complaints about how Protools "SOUNDS"
Protools does not seem to affect anyone's record sales.

You know I am tired of you complaing about Protools. BTW it's guys like you who sound like a broken record what really turns a lot of people off these forums. I am not tryind at to offend you or cut you down. You gave your opinion now give it a rest. We ALL know you hate PT and LOVE Radar/Euphonics etc. Just realize this some people drive a Ford and some drive a Chevy. Live with it.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by T_R_S
We ALL know you hate PT and LOVE Radar/Euphonics etc.

I don't have an opinion on Radar one way or the other, as I've never rea;;y used it.

I tend to base my opinions on personal experiences and not on the opinions of others.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by T_R_S


You know I am tired of you complaing about Protools.

FYI, this is a thread called " ProTools Mix Vs Nuendo Mix". If you don't want to read about peoples opinions regarding PT's VS Nunedo, don't read the f'ing thread.

[drew]

Originally posted by Henchman
To imply that I would not try to do a good job using the equipment at hand, for someone who is paying me good money to do so, is insulting.

Maybe that's how you approach your work. I don't.
The fact of the matter is, that I can get better sounding results using Nuendo.
But if the job requires me to use an inferior sounding product, that ****s with yout sound, then that's what I'll use. And I'll do as good a job as is possible without bitching or moaning.

Unlike numerous PT users I have encountered who frewak when they have to use somethign else.

you are human right? Well, people react to their environments and if you dislike PT with the intensity that it seems you do, it's not out of the realm of possibility that you'd be less into what you're doing (fighting the asinine way PT makes you do something for instance) which would be no reflection on your work ethics etc....

btw, have you ever used the mac version? is it the same as the win version? I agree with your last statement and I wouldn't mind trying it out if it's worth it on the mac.
drew

[Henchman]

I would like to hear from the experts (Drew, Rkrizman, T_R_S) what you guys personally feel are the shortcomings and negative things of Nuendo 2.0.

You obviously have used it extensively, since you seem to have an opinion about it.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by drew
btw, have you ever used the mac version? is it the same as the win version? I agree with your last statement and I wouldn't mind trying it out if it's worth it on the mac.
drew

Mac. It blows chunks.

[drew]

I've never said word one about Nuendo because I've never used it.

What blows chunks? macs in general or the mac version?

[Bang]

Originally posted by blackcatdigi
Wow...

This is not debatable... This is impossible.

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

ad infinitum

To imply that this is NOT so is ludicrous.

Use whatever you want. You can debate the merits of various systems, but stating that an identical sample (w/no processing or summing, played out through the same DAC) sounds 'better' in one system vs. another is preposterous, and indicative of an error somewhere.

32 bit floating point and 24 bit fixed point are different processes... then when you incorporate plugins with different bit processing and dithering and truncating etc etc.. your 1's and 0's can turn out different. Of course if you don't believe this then you can use your ears which will confirm it. I use Nuendo. I'll use Pro Tools but I like floating point systems.

Steve
www.bangrecording.com
www.blacklinerock.com

[T_R_S]

Originally posted by Henchman
If you don't want to read about peoples opinions regarding PT's VS Nunedo, don't read the f'ing thread.

Originally posted by Henchman

I tend to base my opinions on personal experiences and not on the opinions of others.

I think this says it all.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by drew
I've never said word one about Nuendo because I've never used it.

What blows chunks? macs in general or the mac version?

we are talking PT's right?

Anyway. Therein lies the rub.

If asked which tastes better, coke or pepsi, and one person says, I've tried them both, and like coke better.
Then the other person says, I've tried Pepsi, but not coke. But the ads and this list of popstars says pepsi is better. So pepsi, of course, is better. I don't have to try Coke to see if it's better or not.


Who do you think has a more valid opinion?


Yes. like Coke better.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by T_R_S
I think this says it all.

Yes, it does. I make my own decisions based on my experiences.
You go by the hype and the trade rags.

Now, what was your extensive experience using Nuendo 2.0 again?

[5down1up]

relax yall hrhrhr its just a thread !

coke vs pepsi ... that explains it totally .

[Tibbon]

Ok, here's the test to see if Nuendo and PT are different on ONE TRACK.
Split a digital signal going into each, create one track, arm track, compensate for the track so that both DAWs have the same latency, run to the D/A and then invert the phase on one of them... it should be dead silence.

If there's a large bass buildup when it's flipped, etc.. then something is definately amiss, and it should be tried with a third system (radar?) to figure out which system is adding/subtracting from the signal!

This reminds me of the Akai vs Emu wars a few years back. (The Emu convertors were 'warmer' which basically meant they added a little bass, and the Akais were what you put in was what you got out), but i guess it's different because there actually was a sound difference

[drew]

Originally posted by Henchman
we are talking PT's right?

Anyway. Therein lies the rub.

If asked which tastes better, coke or pepsi, and one person says, I've tried them both, and like coke better.
Then the other person says, I've tried Pepsi, but not coke. But the ads and this list of popstars says pepsi is better. So pepsi, of course, is better. I don't have to try Coke to see if it's better or not.


Who do you think has a more valid opinion?


Yes. like Coke better.

what the fuk are you talking about?

[Henchman]

Originally posted by drew
what the fuk are you talking about?

Comparing A to B.
You can only have a valid peosnal opinion if you actually compare A to B.

Instead of trying only A and using other people's opinions who have done the same and coming to the conclusion that A is better.

Do I need to draw a picture?

[drew]

Like I said, I've never said a word about Nuendo. I was trying to find out if the mac version was feature for feature equal to the win version and whether it was worth trying and you're talking about soft drinks.

And then a few posts ago you deride someone for taking other opinions to form their own and then in your post you're telling me to value your since you've used both?

make my picture of a red fire truck please.

[zakco]

Originally posted by studjo
I wonder how many of those nuendo users are traking a whole band at once. Say a funk band with 10 people recorded at the same time - 24 tracks (headphones for everyone - the whole shebang)

Is it easy to do? Just curious - I have to buy a new DAWgrudge

Jo

I do this on a regular basis using Cubase SX (identical sonically, and operatively to Nuendo) although my facility is really only big enough for about 6 or 7 players at once comfortably.

I am tracking through a combination of outboard/console preamps to MOTU 192 interfaces, and using all dicrete outputs for monitoring via Soundcraft Ghost32.

This works very well for my style of working. I much prefer the hands-on approach to monitor mixes, and I can't imagine doing multiple HP mixes through a software interface (Nuendo/PT or otherwise). Click...click....click...click.... sometimes you just gotta drop the mouse for a minute!

However, I don't use any realtime monitoring of plugins during tracking. Any necessary processing or monitor FX is done with outboard gear.

Cubase is simply a tape deck with editing capabilities while I'm tracking beds for a band.

If this style of working suits you, then you would probably be quite satisfied with a Nuendo system.

I know some people are comfortable working entirely within a computer environment, but personally, I can't imagine ever tracking bands without a hardware mixer.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by drew
Like I said, I've never said a word about Nuendo. I was trying to find out if the mac version was feature for feature equal to the win version and whether it was worth trying and you're talking about soft drinks.

And then a few posts ago you deride someone for taking other opinions to form their own and then in your post you're telling me to value your since you've used both?

make my picture of a red fire truck please.

I got a bit mixed up. Generally, from what I've heard, Nuendo runs better on the PC.

I am not askign anyone to take my word as he truth. But to try other options. The fact of the matter is, that most PT users simply have not spent anytime using a program like Nueno to have an opinion about it. So, I do not take them serious at all.

[blackcatdigi]

Excuse me Mr. Henchman, but you're playing a shell game here. Reading is FUNdaMENTAL

YOU posted:

Originally posted by Henchman
Ans at the end of th day, Nuendo does just sound better.
Even on a single track.

To which I responded:

So, you're saying that a single track, no processing, no summing, just sounds better in Nuendo?

Which begat:

Originally posted by Henchman
Yes. As I said, you don't have to believe it.

Prompting my next response:

This is not debatable... This is impossible.

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

is identical to

011111000101111011000101

ad infinitum

To imply that this is NOT so is ludicrous.

Use whatever you want. You can debate the merits of various systems, but stating that an identical sample (w/no processing or summing, played out through the same DAC) sounds 'better' in one system vs. another is preposterous, and indicative of an error somewhere.

Finally, resulting in this from you:

Originally posted by Henchman
When doing a dialogue premix you will have at least one EQ plug-in. I usually have 2 types of eq plug-ins.
And the faders are never left ot 0.

So, I'm talking realworld. You are talking bullshit, faders at 0 no plug-ins non-realworld

I respectfully disagree; YOU'RE TALKING BULLSHIT.

I asked, point blank, you responded, I called BS, and then you twist it around to this "realworld/non-realworld" footsie game...

Say what you mean / Mean what you say. You said Nuendo sounds better, even just one track with no processing or summing... Then you changed it. You're backpedalling.

So, I can now surmise you to be saying "Nuendo's EQ and summing even on one track, sounds a lot better (than PT) to me and a bunch of other people I work with."

Fine. Whatever. But to imply that either system is flawed/superior and/or cannot playback bit-for-bit perfectly is absurd, or rather as you put it "BULLSHIT"...

I mean you no disrespect, I just do not appreciate circular arguments.

Please carry on.

[Henchman]

Originally posted by blackcatdigi
Excuse me Mr. Henchman, but you're playing a shell game here. Reading is FUNdaMENTAL

I asked, point blank, you responded, I called BS, and then you twist it around to this "realworld/non-realworld" footsie game...

Say what you mean / Mean what you say. You said Nuendo sounds better, even just one track with no processing or summing... Then you changed it. You're backpedalling.

So, I can now surmise you to be saying "Nuendo's EQ and summing even on one track, sounds a lot better (than PT) to me and a bunch of other people I work with."

Fine. Whatever. But to imply that either system is flawed/superior and/or cannot playback bit-for-bit perfectly is absurd, or rather as you put it "BULLSHIT"...

I mean you no disrespect, I just do not appreciate circular arguments.

Please carry on.

You are absolutely right. responding to numerous posts quickly etc, things get mixed up and blurred qucikly and easily.

The fact that one of our dialogue mixers himself said that his source tracks sounded better at home on his nuendo rig than they did here led to my post.
Now, I cannot for certain say if he did or did not have any processing on his chain at that point.