Pacifica or Great River

[chrispick]

Hey all.

My first question here:

I'm torn between purchasing an A-Designs Pacifica or a Great River MP-2NV. Can't afford both. I've heard audio samples from both, and found both to sound impressive.

Some context: I'm an instrumentalist/composer for tv content. Due to most budgets, I usually track and mix at home in my project-sized studio. The only pres I have are a Presonus Eureka (cleanish, utilitarian, decent enough) and a UA 6176 (good for dark coloring, love it on DI bass). I'd like to add a single, good versatile pre with punch and clarity (particularly to track all kinds of electric guitar) to balance things out.

So, I'm asking you to lend your mix engineer experience to help out a small-timer.

Pacifica or GR MP-2NV?

What say you?

[mdsmith64]

Hmmm...well let me predict what kind of answers you may get. The Pacifica and Great River pres are both stand out products. The Pacifica sounds good on anything you throw at it, but is particularly yummy on vocals. The Great River sounds good on anything you throw at it, but is particularly yummy on electric guitars. I own the Great River and I record tons of electric guitars and I can personally vouch for its utility on guitars (and direct bass). I have no experience with the Pacifica, but I have placed it at the top of my short list of future purchases. I don't see how you could go wrong with either one, frankly. Good luck.

Best Regards,

Mike.

[seaneldon]

we got launched into pacifica land earlier this year and after spending 4ish months with it i can say it's one of the coolest mic pres i've ever used. really cool grainy texture to it, yet it works for almost every mic and every source and it's difficult to make it sound bad.

i think i heard a great river mic pre like, once, and i don't think i could make a fair judgement on it.

if for some reason you want to put all your trust in me...buy a pacifica. find a dealer that carries both, and get them both on "loan" and send back the one you don't want.

[chrisgraff]

I've never heard the Pacifica. I used to own the MP2-NV. Gotta be honest...I didn't care for it - and I'm a freakin' guitar player!

If I had to do it all over again, I'd spend an extra $400 to get the B.A. 1073. Tried that and loved it on guitars.

YMMV

[Brad McGowan]

I own both and use both on every session I do.

Pacifica hands down. I'll tell you why.

First let say that "grainy" is never a word I would pick to describe either a Pacfica or a Great River. The Pacifica is detailed, lush, big, and very musical. On any source you throw at it, it will deliver harmonically engaging musical output. The Pacifica sounds especially good on vocals, electric guitars, and drum overheads. I personally would pick the Pacifica for electric guitars any day of the week over the Great River. The Great River is indeed very cool on electric guitars and it's actually possible to get a bigger variety of tones out of it an guitars with limitless combinations of the input gain, impedance, and loading switches. However, I still prefer the more forward presentation that the Pacifica delivers. It's less "soft" sounding than the Great River. The only source that I routinely prefer the Great River for is direct bass. But now I own a REDDI so that will probably change. The Pacifica has a top end that is like no other preamp I've heard. It will consistently give you the most effortless vocal tracks you've ever captured. I find that I never boost the high end on vocals tracked with condensers through the Pacifica. Things just sit right.

The Great River is versatile. It will give you a few different tones. The Pacifica will give you one tone, but it such an incredibly good tone that does wrong to nothing, so in that sense I find it to be more versatile.

For solid state preamps I like to think of the sonic spectrum being capped off by softer Neve flavors on one side and harder, more aggressive API flavors on the other. The Pacifica falls somewhere in between, whereas the Great River tends to lean toward the Neve side, to my ears.

I wouldn't feel bad if someone robbed me of all my preamps and replaced them with Pacificas. If the same happened with Great Rivers I think I'd freak out and wonder how I would go on without a Pacifica. It's a sonic drug.

Brad

[shortyprs]

I have both. As mdsmith64 said, they're both stand out products. Its rare that I do a project where either of them doesn't get used. The 1NV is very flexible. The ability to juggle input and output gain means you can really beef things up or really clean things up. Fantastic.

But, if I had to pick one, it would be the Pacifica.....without a moments hesitation. This is a pre that makes me not want to touch EQ. Everything I throw at it sounds sweet. Sure, there are plenty of times where another pre fits the bill just a little better. But, its never more than just a little better and there are more times when I pick the Pacifica than with any of my other pres.

[AB3]

While Peter is an incredibly guy to bring us the Pacifica product, a lot of credit has to also go to Jon Helsing. Anything that guy puts together, I want. I have his Sphere 920s that he racks and tweeks somehow (transformer? power supply? I do not know all the details.).

Anyway, they both sound awesome.

I imagine the Great River is fantastic as well. I hear great things about it from people I trust, including its great DI capabilities. I would love to have both.

The comparision threads are difficult when you are comparing awesome products.

Maybe I will get one channel of great river some day, just to know for myself.

[Brad McGowan]

I think you mean Jon Erickson. His company is Helsing Audio.

Jon also designed the new 500 series PEQ1 that is going to hit the market soon. It sounds super delicious as well.

Brad

[MooWahmBah]

I too am on the fence with some money in the pocket .Thanks for the helpful info .....Shameless hijack here has me wondering if anyone could up the ante and compare the Aurora to these 2 pre`s ..... thanks

[MichaelT]

Originally Posted by MooWahmBah

I too am on the fence with some money in the pocket .Thanks for the helpful info .....Shameless hijack here has me wondering if anyone could up the ante and compare the Aurora to these 2 pre`s ..... thanks

I second this hijack of the thread!

[MooWahmBah]

Yeah Michael ...looks like we got a mutiny here

[AB3]

Thanks for correcting me Brad. The guy deserves to have his name out there - JON ERICKSON!!!

PEQ1 - crap - something else I have to get now - plus a lunchbox for it. Is it on the A Designs website or somewhere else? Parametric I assume?

Originally Posted by Brad McGowan

I think you mean Jon Erickson. His company is Helsing Audio.

Jon also designed the new 500 series PEQ1 that is going to hit the market soon. It sounds super delicious as well.

Brad

[robot gigante]

Originally Posted by chrisgraff

I've never heard the Pacifica. I used to own the MP2-NV. Gotta be honest...I didn't care for it - and I'm a freakin' guitar player!

If I had to do it all over again, I'd spend an extra $400 to get the B.A. 1073. Tried that and loved it on guitars.

YMMV

Well, compared to a real Neve 1073 (B.A. did a fantastic job of racking them btw) the Pacifica definitely hangs with it, including for guitar duties, although it's not the same sound of course. I'd be happy with either.

I haven't used the Great River (or the B.A. 1073), so I have no comments on those.

[robot gigante]

Originally Posted by AB3

PEQ1 - crap - something else I have to get now - plus a lunchbox for it. Is it on the A Designs website or somewhere else? Parametric I assume?

Here you go pal:

Which A-Design 500 Series

I was stoked about those, but I think I'm going to have to wait for the Hammer (see the next page). A tube EQ from A Designs- man oh man I can't wait (huge fan of the Reddi and the MP2A).

[chrispick]

Originally Posted by Brad McGowan

However, I still prefer the more forward presentation that the Pacifica delivers. It's less "soft" sounding than the Great River...

The Pacifica has a top end that is like no other preamp I've heard. It will consistently give you the most effortless vocal tracks you've ever captured. I find that I never boost the high end on vocals tracked with condensers through the Pacifica...

The Great River is versatile. It will give you a few different tones. The Pacifica will give you one tone, but it such an incredibly good tone that does wrong to nothing, so in that sense I find it to be more versatile...

For solid state preamps I like to think of the sonic spectrum being capped off by softer Neve flavors on one side and harder, more aggressive API flavors on the other. The Pacifica falls somewhere in between, whereas the Great River tends to lean toward the Neve side, to my ears.

Interesting. This was my opinion as well based on my brief encounters with both pres in question. And I agree with your API vs. Neve assessment; I sort of categorize them the same way.

For what it's worth, for my needs, I'd been leaning more toward the Pacifica prior to posting. But, since I'm not a by-trade-engineer with my ear to gear every day, I've sought some opinion support here. Good to know my impressions aren't too out of step.

Thanks all for the input. Any other opinions, keep 'em coming.

[RCM - Ronan]

I have not used the great river so I can not say one vs. the other, but I can say that that I own several nice mic pres, and the Pacifica is my fist choice on stuff 90% of the time.

Its a strange little trick but the Pacifica with or without the pad in is a slightly different sounding pre.

[chrispick]

A last, sweet, sweet bump for any additional opinions.

[mdsmith64]

How about an additional point to make?

What kind of guitar sounds are you recording/into? Are you into dark heavy sounds? Do like bright, biting tones? Clean, or distorted? These questions will play into your decision as well. The Great River has been described as heavy with a lot of "iron" in the path. Some people call it a "dark" preamp (although I think that's a misleading term as you can get some very bright open sounds, especially if you play with the impedence and loading swithces and depending on your mic and micing technique). The Pacifica is known for being open with a special "something" in the high end. Here is a post with the Pacifica on vocals and acoustic guitars:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/showp...2&postcount=27

The Pacifica sounds amazing to me on the vocals and is the clear winner for my tastes in this test. I actually preferred the Millenia for the acoutic guitar, however.

As I said, the Great River pre has a lot of versatility in the sense that there are plenty of switches to play with along with the gain and ouput. While the Pacifica doesn't have the tweakability (although many users report a noticible difference in sound using the pad) that the Great River has, many of it's users (if not all) feel it is very, very versatile in the sense that it just seems to "work" on everything the throw at it. In fact, maybe we can get Brad to mic up a XXX for us and post some sound clips comparing his ME-1NV to the Pacifica. What say you Brad?

What am I getting at? Well, I think you and I need to get both preamps! For me it was a question of which do I get first. I chose the Great River for my first purchase because I'm into, and record big, heavy distorted guitar sounds and I believed that the Great River was going to get me there. I didn't come to that conclusion by myself. I read tons, and asked lots of questions and got advice from people who's opinions I trust impeccably. I did not audition the Great River before I bought it, but I have never, even for a moment, regretted purchasing it. I have been getting the best heavy, distorted guitar tone of my entire career with the ME-1NV (actually I have a pair now). If I wasn't so convinced that the Great River should be first, I would have done the obvious thing (which is what I suggest you do if you are not so sure after all of this) and gotten both into my project studio and auditioned them. I am now ready for my Pacifica. It's a different design and as you have heard a different animal althogether from the Great River and I am excited to have it in my studio. In fact, I will be auditioning the Pacifica in Peter's booth at the AES conference this Saturday. I can hardly wait. Anyway, sorry to ramble. Hopefully you can tease out something useful from this.

Best Regards,

Mike.

[pan60]

Originally Posted by AB3

PEQ1 - crap - something else I have to get now - plus a lunchbox for it. Is it on the A Designs website or somewhere else? Parametric I assume?

also http://gearslutz.com/board/showthrea...649#post810649
that is a early photo.

Originally Posted by Brad McGowan

Jon also designed the new 500 series PEQ1 that is going to hit the market soon. It sounds super delicious as well.

Brad

sounds super delicious is putting it lightly.
this thing is a must!

[pan60]

oh
you already know you will get no sleep until you have the Pacifica.

[chrispick]

Originally Posted by pan60

oh you already know you will get no sleep until you have the Pacifica.

Guess I'll be sleeping well tonight. Bit the bullet; ordered the Pacifica. Should receive it in a few days. Looking forward to it.

Thanks for the input.

[chrispick]

Originally Posted by mdsmith64

What kind of guitar sounds are you recording/into? Are you into dark heavy sounds? Do like bright, biting tones? Clean, or distorted? These questions will play into your decision as well. The Great River has been described as heavy with a lot of "iron" in the path. Some people call it a "dark" preamp (although I think that's a misleading term as you can get some very bright open sounds, especially if you play with the impedence and loading swithces and depending on your mic and micing technique). The Pacifica is known for being open with a special "something" in the high end.

Thanks for input. I have taken these attributes into account and decided to err with the Pacifica. I can cull some darker, "slower" (albeit not really iron-like) tones out of my 6176, and it has numerous pad and impedance settings, so I feel I have that area dealt with, at least in part. Right now, I think I need the more present sound the Pacifica offers. Plus, the "nice highs" thing. And it's less expensive for two channels.

Still, the Great River may likely be a future purchase. I definitely like what I've heard come out of it.

Anyway, sorry to ramble. Hopefully you can tease out something useful from this.

I did. I appreciate you taking to time to post. Thanks.

[Yetti]

Originally Posted by chrispick

Guess I'll be sleeping well tonight. Bit the bullet; ordered the Pacifica. Should receive it in a few days. Looking forward to it.

Thanks for the input.

Good choice!
Let us know how you like it.

[mdsmith64]

Originally Posted by chrispick

Thanks I appreciate you taking to time to post. Thanks.

thumbsup

Yes, do let us know what you think! Maybe we could even talk you into posting a clip....


Congrats and Best Regards,

Mike

[Snatchman]

Must be nice....to be able to choose between such fabulous gear..!....Congrats..

[alcohol]

I don't have the Pacifica so I can't comment, but for bass guitar and bass drum the Great River does exactly what I want. Sounds good on everything else too.

[Brad McGowan]

Originally Posted by mdsmith64

the throw at it. In fact, maybe we can get Brad to mic up a XXX for us and post some sound clips comparing his ME-1NV to the Pacifica. What say you Brad?

I could do that. What do you want to hear?

For anyone else on the fence regarding these two pieces, let me say this about thier application on electric guitars. I used to own a Vintech 1272 that I used religiously on guitars. Then I got the Great River. I found that I could cover the same ground as the Vintech with the Great River and then some. Then I got the Pacifica and heard the guitar tone of the gods. The Pacifica made me sell the Vintech, not the Great River. And besides, it has red knobs.

Brad

[chrispick]

Originally Posted by mdsmith64

thumbsup

Yes, do let us know what you think! Maybe we could even talk you into posting a clip....


Congrats and Best Regards,

Mike

Thanks man. Yeah, I'll let everyone know my thoughts once I've driven it around the track once or twice. I intend to use it on an upcoming job. Maybe I'll post the results.

BTW, thanks to everyone for your input. Some GS threads can spin out of control. This one stayed cooled and informative, and I appreciate that.

[not_so_new]

Okay.... okay.... I know this has been covered many times before but while I have all you Pacifica fans on one thread.....

So the 500 series "Pacifica" (that is the P-1 right?) how close does it actually come to the two channel Pacitica?

I told myself I would not be buying any more mic pres any time soon but if the P-1 is just as cool I might just pick on up when I get my 500 rack. I know the P-1 has a little different design, is it 50% of the Pacifica, 80%, 95%?

So.... what do ya know?

[mdsmith64]

Originally Posted by Brad McGowan

I could do that. What do you want to hear?

For anyone else on the fence regarding these two pieces, let me say this about their application on electric guitars. I used to own a Vintech 1272 that I used religiously on guitars. Then I got the Great River. I found that I could cover the same ground as the Vintech with the Great River and then some. Then I got the Pacifica and heard the guitar tone of the gods. The Pacifica made me sell the Vintech, not the Great River. And besides, it has red knobs.

Brad

Hey Brad,

Doesn't have to be anything special. Just grip a 5th or something and give it a little chuga-chuga...know what I mean? I think it would be helpful for those of use who have no easy way to compare the two for ourselves. Thanks for taking my comment seriously.

As an act of good faith, here is a musical sketch of a song I'm working on. It's just two changes recorded quickly for composition purposes. I don't think I even bothered to tune the guitars. The bass and the left/right guitars were tracked through a Great River ME-1NV. All the usual disclaimers apply (i.e., it sounds like shiite now after having to sample rate convert using a freeware software converter from 96 to 44.1, it sounds even more like shiite after converting the first piece of shiite to MP3, it hasn't been mixed, mastered, or had anything done to it with any kind of care at all, it's my song - don't steal my ideas).

http://www.pariah-now.com/Music/GreatRiver.mp3

Best Regards,

Mike.