Shinybox Ribbon - Install Xformer myself?

[pmdundee]

I've been planning for a long time to get some of the Shinybox 46 series with Cinemag transformers. However, I just went to their site and I swear the price suddenly jumped like $75/mic. Since the stock 46 is $150 less than the Cinemag-equipped one, I'm thinking about buying and installing the Cinemag myself in a stock mic. I've read that this is easy to do, but does anyone have a part number for the appropriate xformer or some instructions/guidance?

Thanks!
Eric

[idylldon]

I used a Cinemag CM-9888 transformer and I'm quite pleased with the result.

As for difficulty, I'll just use the slogan that's written on the back of my Mercenary T-shirt: "It ain't rocket surgery."

Cheers,
--
Don

[indravayu]

I was taken aback by the price change, myself (I called Jon at Shinybox and he told me that he now makes the mics himself, thus the new prices) - decided to buy an Apex 205 (the same basic mic as the old Shinybox 46) and add a Cinemag 9888 myself (may do some cap upgrades, too). I have never swapped a transformer on a mic before, but I have done basic mods to some of my amps, so I imagine it won't be too hard. I haven't researched how to do it yet, but I will post any instructions that I find.

- Chris

[pmdundee]

Thanks for the offer to post some instuctions, Chris.

One thing I'm confused on: I thought the Nady RSM-2/Apex 210 was the Shinybox 23, not the 46. Are both of the Shinyboxes just rebranded Chinese mics? Or is it that the old 46 is different from the new 46MX? Sheesh!

Thanks for the help. I have zero DIY experience, so this is a first for me.

Eric

[indravayu]

One thing I'm confused on: I thought the Nady RSM-2/Apex 210 was the Shinybox 23, not the 46. Are both of the Shinyboxes just rebranded Chinese mics? Or is it that the old 46 is different from the new 46MX? Sheesh!

The Shinyboxes used to be rebranded Chinese mics, with capacitor and optional transformer upgrades (and some testing done on the ribbons, I believe) - but now Jon assembles them by hand from imported parts - or at least he does that with the 46's (can't tell what he does with the 23's now).

I could be wrong, but it looks to me like the Apex 205 is a closer match to the Shinybox 46:

Apex 205:
Ribbon Type : Pure aluminum
Pattern : Asymmetrical Figure-8
Impedance : < 200 Ohms
Recommended Load Impedance : < 1000 Ohms
Frequency Response : 40 to 18,000Hz (+/- 3dB)
Max SPL (1% THD @1kHz) : 160dB
==========================================
Apex 210:
Ribbon Type : Pure aluminum Ribbon, 2 microns thick
Patterns : Asymmetrical Figure-8
Impedance (Ohms) : < 200
Recommended Load Impedance : 1000 Ohms
Frequency Range (Hz) : 30 - 18,000
Maximum Input SPL (dB) : 158
==========================================
==========================================
Shinybox 46:
Ribbon Type and Dimensions: Low tension, 2 inch, 2 micron aluminum ribbon
Pattern: Figure 8
Impedance: <= 200 ohms
Recommended Load Impedence: 1000 ohms
Frequency Response: 40 to 18,000 Hz
Max SPL (1% THD @ 1000Hz) 165 dB
==========================================
Shinybox 23:
Ribbon Type and Dimensions: Low tension, 2 inch, 2 micron aluminum ribbon
Pattern: Figure 8
Impedance: <= 600 ohms
Recommended Load Impedence: 1000 ohms
Frequency Response: 20 to 18,000 Hz
Max SPL (1% THD @ 1000Hz) 165 dB

[pmdundee]

So should I buy an Apex 205 or one of the hand-assembled Shinybox's? I'd like to support Jon's company, but the $ always wins out in the end....

[qbert1]

I did the Oktava ML52-2 to Lundahl transformer mod featured in Tape Op a while back. It was really easy. I would think if you have the room in the microphone for a (potentially) larger transformer, it should be a piece of cake.

[tubedude]

Originally Posted by pmdundee

So should I buy an Apex 205 or one of the hand-assembled Shinybox's? I'd like to support Jon's company, but the $ always wins out in the end....

I'm on the fence too. I even talked to him on the phone yesterday. I'm probably going to order one today, he has a perfect return policy so its worth checking it out I guess. Wish I could afford to get one of those and a Royer here at the same time. I'm having trouble deciding between the two and a comparison would do wonders.
I just want a great dirty guitar mic. Everything I have seems too fizzy for me these days.

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by pmdundee

So should I buy an Apex 205 or one of the hand-assembled Shinybox's? I'd like to support Jon's company, but the $ always wins out in the end....

That was my quandry, too. Money won out in the end (205 = $83, Cinemag 9888 = $48, new caps +/- $20 vs. SB 46 @ $400) - I expect my 205 to arrive by next week.

- Chris

[pmdundee]

Chris - "Caps" would refer to new capacitors, right? Can you enlighten us all as to what you are planning to do there?

Thanks!

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by pmdundee

Chris - "Caps" would refer to new capacitors, right? Can you enlighten us all as to what you are planning to do there?

Thanks!

Right. I haven't been able to find any schematics for the Apex 205 yet, so I don't know precisely what I will be swapping out.

Check out this thread on the Apex 460 tube condenser - I would wager the 205 has similar issues:
http://homerecording.com/bbs/showthr...=196274&page=1

[pmdundee]

Please keep us posted on what you find out.

Read through that thread too, and it went way over my head. I've never done any DIY before--can anyone recommend somewhere that I can pick up some basic audio-related electronics knowledge?

Thanks!
Eric

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by pmdundee

Please keep us posted on what you find out.

Read through that thread too, and it went way over my head. I've never done any DIY before--can anyone recommend somewhere that I can pick up some basic audio-related electronics knowledge?

Thanks!
Eric

Well, I am pretty much a novice when it comes to electronics, but earlier this year I bought a couple Epiphone Valve Junior guitar amps (because they were cheap and supposedly easy to mod), then acquired a soldering iron for the first time and started swapping out their caps and resistors like there was no tomorrow. It's really not hard to do as long as you are patient, have a steady hand and good vision (I have terrible vision, though, and had to rely on my glasses _and_ a magnifying glass, which was quite awkward). Of coutse, I had the help of a number of people on the Epiphone forum, who told me which caps and resistors to yank, etc. I couldn't have done it on my own.

[tubedude]

Originally Posted by indravayu

Well, I am pretty much a novice when it comes to electronics, but earlier this year I bought a couple Epiphone Valve Junior guitar amps (because they were cheap and supposedly easy to mod), then acquired a soldering iron for the first time and started swapping out their caps and resistors like there was no tomorrow. It's really not hard to do as long as you are patient, have a steady hand and good vision (I have terrible vision, though, and had to rely on my glasses _and_ a magnifying glass, which was quite awkward). Of coutse, I had the help of a number of people on the Epiphone forum, who told me which caps and resistors to yank, etc. I couldn't have done it on my own.

Hows the Valve Jr doing then? Post some samples, I'm interested in that also. Why dont these jackasses just build stuff right in the first place? Sick of it.

[BrettPortzer]

Originally Posted by tubedude

Hows the Valve Jr doing then? Post some samples, I'm interested in that also. Why dont these jackasses just build stuff right in the first place? Sick of it.

Originally Posted by indravayu

(205 = $83, Cinemag 9888 = $48, new caps +/- $20 vs. SB 46 @ $400)

[pmdundee]

Originally Posted by indravayu

That was my quandry, too. Money won out in the end (205 = $83, Cinemag 9888 = $48, new caps +/- $20 vs. SB 46 @ $400) - I expect my 205 to arrive by next week.

- Chris

By the way, where do you find a 205 for $83. Is that a non-branded one?

Thanks!

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by pmdundee

By the way, where do you find a 205 for $83. Is that a non-branded one?

Thanks!

Fullcompass - and it should be a regular Apex 205. Mine apparently shipped today, so I should have it in a few days.

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by tubedude

Hows the Valve Jr doing then? Post some samples, I'm interested in that also. Why dont these jackasses just build stuff right in the first place? Sick of it.

Ehh...after having them for a few months now, I am not as impressed as I was at first. I mean, they are interesting for the price you pay, but unless you are really skilled at modding amps (I am not), you have to go for something like the Mercury Magentics mod kit to get them sounding genuinely good (and I don't have the money for two MM kits - they cost $300 each!). Of course, this is a very subjective thing - some people love the VJr right out of the box (though I tend to think these folks are letting the pricetag influence their ears).

You should go to the Epiphone forum - lots of people have posted samples there and you can hear amps that have been more expertly modded than mine. Also check out the Mercury Magnetics Vjr page:
http://www.mercurymagnetics.com/page...Pjt/EVJ-01.htm

- Chris

[indravayu]

Just an update - got my Apex 205 in and had a chance to test it out the other day - sounds pretty good so far - definitely better on guitar than some of the other mics in my collection. I haven't received my Cinemag xformer yet, but I performed one mod on the mic already - I removed the extra inner layers of mesh. This was not easy at all! The inner mesh looked like it was woven into the outer grill, or something, and I nearly destroyed the outer grill yanking out the inner layers. Guess I need some better tools!

I used it to record some new guitar tracks on an outtake from my band's last album and was pleased with the initial results - the new tracks in comparison to the old ones (recorded with an SM-57) were fuller and rounder, with less fizziness in the high end (I didn't even mess around much with mic placement for this test). I threw a Waves SSL Channel Strip plugin on them afterwards and they ended up sounded pretty damn cool - was definitely impressed - especially since this is a $90 mic. I am anxious to get the Cinemag installed now.

- Chris

[pmdundee]

Thanks, indrayavu!

Keep us posted on what the Cinemag does for it!

Eric

[needlz]

Will a Cinemag 9888 work with the Apex 210 too?

[indravayu]

Originally Posted by needlz

Will a Cinemag 9888 work with the Apex 210 too?

I am not 100% sure - but if the 210 is the same mic as the original, rebranded ShinyBox 23 (and I believe it is), then it should be able to handle the 9888 no problem (ShinyBox used to offer the 9888 as an upgrade to their 23, but recently stopped).

- Chris

[indravayu]

Finally got my Cinemag xformers in the mail and will hopefully have time to install them in my Apex 460 & 205 this week - if I am not forgetful, I will record some before and after clips for you guys.

- Chris

[lang_dave]

For anyone who's replaced the transformer in an Apex 210 / Nady RSM-2 with the Cinemag 9888 - did you use the Cinemag that is in a mu-metal can or the uncased version. My preference would be to use the version in the can, but I'm not sure if it will fit.

thanks,
dave