Fisher Space Expander?

Shandy · 15th September 2006, 05:26 PM

While rooting through the studio basement this morning I came across a Fisher SpaceXpander (an old spring reverb unit from the 60's), completely intact. Okay, it wasn't shiny & new, but all the parts are there and it passes a dry signal.

However, the reverb signal itself is SUPER low, barely there in fact. I'm assuming it needs new tubes (I get a sickly pale orange glow from all three of them) and capacitors. Two questions for those of you in The Know:

a. Any thoughts or impressions from any of you who have used this piece before?

b. I'm pretty good with the soldering iron, but this is pre-PCB stuff, and tube equipment can get scary. Anyone in particular you think I should send this to for repair/overhaul?

dbbubba · 15th September 2006, 06:08 PM

They were pretty cool pieces in their day and I have even seen reference to them being used in "demo" grade studios back in the '60s and early '70s.

I'd plug it in and see what you get.

It isn't going to sound too "modern" but it might have a use.
They are pretty sproingy, but fun!

I have a Panasonic solid state equivelent, but I haven't used it since I got it last year.
It looks kinda' "retro" sitting under one of my computer monitors.

Danny Brown

yeloocproducer · 15th September 2006, 06:38 PM

I have one that is acting the same way and need it fixed but haven't gotten around to it. I can tell you one thing though... this is reportedly THE king tubby spring reverb. The one he used for all of his dub recordings. Nuff said.

max cooper · 15th September 2006, 06:44 PM

Get it fixed! I wanna hear it! It's a K-10, right?

Need the schematics?

here ya go:

http://www.triodeel.com/k10.gif

Legend has it that the K10 reverb was used in car audio. I know it shows up in Hammond organs too.

Did anyone know that Fisher was founded by Avery Fisher (yep, of Avery Fisher Hall fame).

The military set Fisher up with a factory to make radios during the war and after the war, he just kinda stayed there.

Fisher is credited in large part with creating what we consider hifi playback.

yeloocproducer · 15th September 2006, 06:57 PM

Yeah it's a K-10... there's some dub forum on the net where you can read all about it. You're right, it was developed as some sort of reverb unit for car stereo systems back in the sixties... so if your tracks weren't verbed enough already, you could big pimp and put this thing on for your cruising enjoyment.

Listening to "I'm Your Puppet" (Bobby and James Purify) through a K-10 space-expander in a 60's Chevy in east LA... can you imagine? I wonder what it sounded like when you hit a bump in the road with your cut coils/ lowered car...

Shandy · 15th September 2006, 09:21 PM

Yep, this is the King Tubby 'verb. No, not modern by any standards, but I love to collect old/odd gear like this, and I eventually find a use for everything. You should see my freakshow of a mic locker.

Max, I heard about the car audio application... I can't imagine the racket you'd get after hitting a pothole, but I guess it would make the drive more exiting. The owner's manual is all about how it's to be used in conjunction with your home hi-fi... I'd be ripped if someone put some crappy aftermarket reverb on my final mixes. And I definitely intend on getting it fixed, but I'm having some trouble finding someone to do it.

Yelo, I've been to the dub forum, and it does have some info, but for the most part there's a lot of bickering about who's truly "dub" and ads for online casinos. I did find the schematic there though, which has been pretty handy.

Anyone know a good old-school analog repair guy on the East coast/US?

Ghede · 15th September 2006, 10:36 PM

I made a Spacexpander into an effect box. I use it as a send effect on snare, guitar, whatever..ala King Tubby. I built a box for it with mono i/o. The input goes to an M-Audio Audio Buddy for gain to the amp. It needs amplification on top of the K-10 amp. Then put slits in the knobs of the Audio Buddy for gain control thru the holes in the box. I damped one of the springs with a bit of Auralex for maximum Boing. I mounted an electrical outlet box inside to plug the amp and AB into. Then a switch, power indicator light, and the "Reverb amount" pot to the outside. I've used it on Dub and even Rockabilly songs. Check out "Slow Movin' Girl" here if you like.

Here is a pic.

max cooper · 15th September 2006, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shandy

I'd be ripped if someone put some crappy aftermarket reverb on my final mixes.

Uh... you should hear what they're doing to them anyway.

Ghede, damn nice vibe on that track! I listened in mono and it was super cool!

Everyone who skipped that link, go back and listen to it.

And nice job boxing up that 'verb.

yeloocproducer · 15th September 2006, 10:46 PM

Ghede-

You wanna do mine? You could start a little biz here... I'm not kidding.

DC

joeq · 15th September 2006, 11:19 PM

here is mine

I have the tank suspended over the basement stairs away from heavy footsteps and woofers.

It is gritty and a bit noisy, but it's also a sound that is not "covered" by any digital box or plug that I own, so worth the effort of hooking it up. Every now and then it is JUST the thing.

At one time, long ago, I had an EQ and a compressor in front of it and an expander after it. Now I usually want it to ping.

Ghede · 15th September 2006, 11:23 PM

Thank you for the kind words Max...Yelo, I would consider doing another, I do have another Audio buddy sitting around. email me, we'll talk. ghedesound at gmail dot cm.
Steve B.
Another view

Shandy · 16th September 2006, 03:20 AM

Ghede, if you have the time, I wouldn't mind getting in line for a little SpaceXpander repair. I really like the enclosure you built for it, too. For mine I'm picturing something in dark hardwood. ;)

I also noticed that in the user's manual, they say to mount the springs vertically, which I suppose makes sense, but I've yet to see a guitar amp where the springs aren't sitting horizontal.

Hmm.

yeloocproducer · 16th September 2006, 06:11 PM

Yeah, b/c the cleanest possible signal path, ICs and caps always result in the best music.

Go get a King Tubby record and smoke out buddy.

max cooper · 17th September 2006, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Williams

It always amazes me what old boxes I used and hated are now desired and collected. Go figure.

I think this is one of the most fun things about the gear end of music production. It actually crops up in the general production techniques end too.

There's a similar phenomenon in fashion as well. It's something like taking the most embarrasing things about the past and embracing them.

Jim Williams · 18th September 2006, 04:32 PM

I can see that with the new generation "discovering" these older pieces.

For me it's more of a "been there, done that" situation. I don't want to buy bellbottoms or get a afro either...

Nostalgia isn't what it used to be....

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

joeq · 18th September 2006, 04:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by yeloocproducer

Ghede-

You wanna do mine? You could start a little biz here... I'm not kidding.

DC

forget the fancy metal chassis! I can come over to your place with a couple of screw eyes and some twine! cheap!

pan60 · 31st January 2008, 03:24 AM

very cool!

KingDaddyO · 31st January 2008, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shandy

Anyone know a good old-school analog repair guy on the East coast/US?

Yep - Prototypes, on Howard Ave in Kensington MD (240) 223-0020. A real old school repair shop. Tiny hole in the wall place, with mounds of equipment everywhere, the smell of flux, warm transformers, and burnt silicon wafting in the air. Mmmm ... better than Xmas.

There's also Joe Rodgers-Professional Audio Services (301) 230-3106, on Ridgeway Ave in Rockville MD.

I've used them both and was pleased with their services.

Captn' · 4th October 2008, 02:16 AM

Fellows I'm an old '70's radio DJ top 40 days. I have been looking for one of these fisher units for years. I've recently gotten back in the biz after years of doing other things.

Do any of you have a unit for sale? And if so what do you want for it. Does it work or will I need to find parts to make it work.

Please advise.
Thanks,
Captn'

15th September 2006, 05:26 PM	#1
Shandy Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Burlington, CT Posts: 222	Fisher Space Expander? While rooting through the studio basement this morning I came across a Fisher SpaceXpander (an old spring reverb unit from the 60's), completely intact. Okay, it wasn't shiny & new, but all the parts are there and it passes a dry signal. However, the reverb signal itself is SUPER low, barely there in fact. I'm assuming it needs new tubes (I get a sickly pale orange glow from all three of them) and capacitors. Two questions for those of you in The Know: a. Any thoughts or impressions from any of you who have used this piece before? b. I'm pretty good with the soldering iron, but this is pre-PCB stuff, and tube equipment can get scary. Anyone in particular you think I should send this to for repair/overhaul?

31st January 2008, 03:24 AM	#17
pan60 500 series nutjob Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: 500 series Guru land ; ) Posts: 5,959	very cool! __________________ www.pan60.com quote: The Hammer is like sonic crack. I'm actually afraid to use it for tracking Brad McGowan IF YOU ARE NOT INTO THE 500 FORMAT, THEN YOU'RE JUST JEALOUS! quote: your secret identity is safe with me superman! Peter Montessi it is easy to sound as though one was endowed with great intelligence, whilst speaking amongst a crowd of total morons

4th October 2008, 02:16 AM	#19
Captn' Gear interested Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 1	fisher spacexpander Fellows I'm an old '70's radio DJ top 40 days. I have been looking for one of these fisher units for years. I've recently gotten back in the biz after years of doing other things. Do any of you have a unit for sale? And if so what do you want for it. Does it work or will I need to find parts to make it work. Please advise. Thanks, Captn'

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15th September 2006, 06:08 PM	#2
dbbubba Lives for gear Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 3,651	They were pretty cool pieces in their day and I have even seen reference to them being used in "demo" grade studios back in the '60s and early '70s. I'd plug it in and see what you get. It isn't going to sound too "modern" but it might have a use. They are pretty sproingy, but fun! I have a Panasonic solid state equivelent, but I haven't used it since I got it last year. It looks kinda' "retro" sitting under one of my computer monitors. Danny Brown

15th September 2006, 06:38 PM	#3
yeloocproducer Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: los angeles Posts: 934	I have one that is acting the same way and need it fixed but haven't gotten around to it. I can tell you one thing though... this is reportedly THE king tubby spring reverb. The one he used for all of his dub recordings. Nuff said.

15th September 2006, 06:44 PM	#4
max cooper Lives for gear Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: tx Posts: 8,819	Get it fixed! I wanna hear it! It's a K-10, right? Need the schematics? here ya go: http://www.triodeel.com/k10.gif Legend has it that the K10 reverb was used in car audio. I know it shows up in Hammond organs too. Did anyone know that Fisher was founded by Avery Fisher (yep, of Avery Fisher Hall fame). The military set Fisher up with a factory to make radios during the war and after the war, he just kinda stayed there. Fisher is credited in large part with creating what we consider hifi playback.

15th September 2006, 06:57 PM	#5
yeloocproducer Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: los angeles Posts: 934	Yeah it's a K-10... there's some dub forum on the net where you can read all about it. You're right, it was developed as some sort of reverb unit for car stereo systems back in the sixties... so if your tracks weren't verbed enough already, you could big pimp and put this thing on for your cruising enjoyment. Listening to "I'm Your Puppet" (Bobby and James Purify) through a K-10 space-expander in a 60's Chevy in east LA... can you imagine? I wonder what it sounded like when you hit a bump in the road with your cut coils/ lowered car...

15th September 2006, 09:21 PM	#6
Shandy Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Burlington, CT Posts: 222	Yep, this is the King Tubby 'verb. No, not modern by any standards, but I love to collect old/odd gear like this, and I eventually find a use for everything. You should see my freakshow of a mic locker. Max, I heard about the car audio application... I can't imagine the racket you'd get after hitting a pothole, but I guess it would make the drive more exiting. The owner's manual is all about how it's to be used in conjunction with your home hi-fi... I'd be ripped if someone put some crappy aftermarket reverb on my final mixes. And I definitely intend on getting it fixed, but I'm having some trouble finding someone to do it. Yelo, I've been to the dub forum, and it does have some info, but for the most part there's a lot of bickering about who's truly "dub" and ads for online casinos. I did find the schematic there though, which has been pretty handy. Anyone know a good old-school analog repair guy on the East coast/US?

15th September 2006, 10:36 PM	#7
Ghede Gear interested Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 15	I made a Spacexpander into an effect box. I use it as a send effect on snare, guitar, whatever..ala King Tubby. I built a box for it with mono i/o. The input goes to an M-Audio Audio Buddy for gain to the amp. It needs amplification on top of the K-10 amp. Then put slits in the knobs of the Audio Buddy for gain control thru the holes in the box. I damped one of the springs with a bit of Auralex for maximum Boing. I mounted an electrical outlet box inside to plug the amp and AB into. Then a switch, power indicator light, and the "Reverb amount" pot to the outside. I've used it on Dub and even Rockabilly songs. Check out "Slow Movin' Girl" here if you like. Here is a pic.

15th September 2006, 10:46 PM	#9
yeloocproducer Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: los angeles Posts: 934	Ghede- You wanna do mine? You could start a little biz here... I'm not kidding. DC

15th September 2006, 11:19 PM	#10
joeq Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New York Posts: 3,796	here is mine I have the tank suspended over the basement stairs away from heavy footsteps and woofers. It is gritty and a bit noisy, but it's also a sound that is not "covered" by any digital box or plug that I own, so worth the effort of hooking it up. Every now and then it is JUST the thing. At one time, long ago, I had an EQ and a compressor in front of it and an expander after it. Now I usually want it to ping.

15th September 2006, 11:23 PM	#11
Ghede Gear interested Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 15	Thank you for the kind words Max...Yelo, I would consider doing another, I do have another Audio buddy sitting around. email me, we'll talk. ghedesound at gmail dot cm. Steve B. Another view

16th September 2006, 03:20 AM	#12
Shandy Gear maniac Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Burlington, CT Posts: 222	Ghede, if you have the time, I wouldn't mind getting in line for a little SpaceXpander repair. I really like the enclosure you built for it, too. For mine I'm picturing something in dark hardwood. ;) I also noticed that in the user's manual, they say to mount the springs vertically, which I suppose makes sense, but I've yet to see a guitar amp where the springs aren't sitting horizontal. Hmm.

16th September 2006, 06:11 PM	#13
yeloocproducer Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: los angeles Posts: 934	Yeah, b/c the cleanest possible signal path, ICs and caps always result in the best music. Go get a King Tubby record and smoke out buddy.

18th September 2006, 04:32 PM	#15
Jim Williams Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: beautiful Carlsbad, CA Posts: 4,071	I can see that with the new generation "discovering" these older pieces. For me it's more of a "been there, done that" situation. I don't want to buy bellbottoms or get a afro either... Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.... Jim Williams Audio Upgrades