Your favorite reverb settings for vocals?

[Geddyleewannabe]

Your favorite reverb settings you like to try on vocals?

[GearHunter]

Always loved Lexicon's "Rich Plate", about 2 seconds long with a pre-delay of between 30ms and 50ms. I used to work at a studio with a 224XL and three PCM70's. Sometimes during a mix I'd have two or three of them on plate programs.

Love 'dem Lexicon Plates!

[C_F_H_13]

I've found myself using verb less and less on vocals the last little bit. However, when I do/did, I had a couple of favorites.

Lately mixing ITB, I've been quite fond of the IR-1s "Bright Plate" patch. I'd modify it to cut the lows, and boost the highs and increase the pre delay...anywhere from 10-60..depending on the song and fx I'm after. I'm loving a couple of my new verbs though and have to really try them out (revibe,altiverb, and TL Space). TL space in particular has this medium studio patch in "true stereo" that I'm loving.

[dbbubba]

You know.... in reviewing so many things that I have recorded and mixed over the years I wish that I could peel away the reverb! I'd start with drum reverbs and then the vocal reverbs. I seem to have had a reverb "deprevation" and over-used it.

In the last ten yeras I just use very little reverb on vocals.
In fact, on rock stuff I just use slap and apparently a lot of the classic engineers have always done this, too.
I always used slap, but I felt that I needed reverb too.

I also went through a stage where I used an "ambience" type reverb with mostly early reflection stuff. That was better, but I wish it wasn't there!

Of course, at the time no one complained and I got paid, people got record deals, etc...
Now, years removed, it sounds rediciulous.
I don't know why I didn't notice it then!

If I use anything on vocals it is the Rich Plate 224xl setting, but I'll shorten it up.
The 2.4 msec "stock" setting eems too long, so I'll start at about 1.8 msec.
I'll keep turning it down and eventually see if muting it matters.

Towards the end of my mixes I start looking for stuff to get rid of!
What things are not contributing anything?
I usually find quite a few things!

Danny Brown

[GearHunter]

Originally Posted by dbbubba

You know.... in reviewing so many things that I have recorded and mixed over the years I wish that I could peel away the reverb! I'd start with drum reverbs and then the vocal reverbs. I seem to have had a reverb "deprevation" and over-used it.

In the last ten yeras I just use very little reverb on vocals.
In fact, on rock stuff I just use slap and apparently a lot of the classic engineers have always done this, too.
I always used slap, but I felt that I needed reverb too.

I also went through a stage where I used an "ambience" type reverb with mostly early reflection stuff. That was better, but I wish it wasn't there!

Of course, at the time no one complained and I got paid, people got record deals, etc...
Now, years removed, it sounds rediciulous.
I don't know why I didn't notice it then!

If I use anything on vocals it is the Rich Plate 224xl setting, but I'll shorten it up.
The 2.4 msec "stock" setting eems too long, so I'll start at about 1.8 msec.
I'll keep turning it down and eventually see if muting it matters.

Towards the end of my mixes I start looking for stuff to get rid of!
What things are not contributing anything?
I usually find quite a few things!

Danny Brown

Luckily, even in the mid '80's I avoided the gated snare verb at all costs. I think it was "Born in The USA" that did me in. I would design a very short ambient room using an Eventide 2016, an AMS RMX, or a Lexicon on a small room. If you could tell it had a digital effect on it, it was no good. It had to sound natural. That's why I can listen to that stuff now and not cringe.

I did like putting a splash of 1.8 second plate on snare, and I'd sneak a little plate in on my cymbals...especially the ride. Still do that to this day actually.

[dbbubba]

Once I was actually able to do the gated snare thing properly I was done with it.
I did get too "into" using a favorite preset on an SPX90 which was a gate BEFORE a short reverb.
I'd usually have a 10 msec. pre-delay with less than a second reverb decay.
I still like the sound on a snare to this day if used in extreme moderation, but it tends to make the snare sound "good" and dis-connected from the rest of the kit (especially the toms.)

As another embarrasing admission, I used to mix one band in the studio and live and in our live rig I had a DDL set to a flange with a lot of regeneration on it.
I would put a gate before it and send the toms to it.
It was cool sounding in the '80s, but so often I was entertaining myself, I think!

Danny Brown

[warhead]

I really like the UAD-1's 140 plate verb on vocals lately. It's kind of 2D but in a good way.

War

[stagefright13]

ACK! the gated snare syndrome! I have an ep from the 80's that had that... I digress...

So people don't use reverb on vocals anymore? I think not. I have 2 verbs in the tracking room alone. Just so the singer can hear and sound good. Most singers feel insecure without it. And most singers (Not all) would say "what's wrong wit dat?" if I didn't mix some in during mixing.
It just takes much less these days. But tracking with some nice lushy plate (In headphones) makes the singer really perform. It's all about getting the singer comfortable. Drums are a different story. That's why there are 2 units.
Typically now I add verb then subtract it till it sounds too dry and then up it an "RCH".
But with some good layering of vocals the need for reverb decreases. But a good compression scheme increases ;) Depends on how many tracks. Wich depends on how much time is paid for. . .

OOPS original post was what settings. I'm sorry what reverb ya got?

[bing81]

Originally Posted by C_F_H_13

I'm loving a couple of my new verbs though and have to really try them out (revibe,altiverb, and TL Space). TL space in particular has this medium studio patch in "true stereo" that I'm loving.

While I love TL Space for post prod and "special FX", I haven't quite found a plate sound or similar in it to match my external Lex 300, so I either go to that or Revibe. What's the "medium studio" patch you're using? Curious.

[DigitMus]

I was gonna say something like "I don't have a favorite" or "It depends..." when I realized I've been gravitating to the 'Opera House' on the KSP8 with the highs rolled off at about 2800hz, 35-40ms of pre-delay, and a reverb time of 1- 1.8 seconds. I push the returns up until it's definitely noticeable, then back it off 'til I can just not hear it (unless I REALLY listen for it).

Scott

[u b k]

despite repeated and ongoing attempts to get with the program, i keep coming back to the same setting: off.

delay, otoh, is another matter entirely, and i couldn't live without it. well, i suppose i could live, but it would be a dull, dreary existence.


gregoire
del
ubk
.

[ToneRanger]

Warhead, how you think the UAD Dreamverbs "140 Plates" compare to the UAD EMT 140 plugin?

The stuff we do has changed vocal reverb wise totally. We used to have kind of heavy room reverb going on all the time, sometimes sounded good, usually pretty bad, 'cause it seems like realitistic room reverb seems hard to get with plug ins. Now we have big plates on vocals, the rest of the mix is fairly dry. I guess the UAD EMT emulation would be a step up, and a clever one too, since we use it so much?

[Gabriel Sousa]

anyone use the powercore reverb ?

[xist]

I'd be interested in Altiverb's most used settings for vocals...

[thethrillfactor]

Still use reverbs here(since 1986) and all effects on vocals.

It comes down to your skills, taste and your signature sound on how to employ it.

Its never gone out of style for me.

[warhead]

Originally Posted by ToneRanger

Warhead, how you think the UAD Dreamverbs "140 Plates" compare to the UAD EMT 140 plugin?

I'm mixing all weekend, I'll try and remember to do a direct comparison and post the results for you.

War

[ToneRanger]

Originally Posted by warhead

I'm mixing all weekend, I'll try and remember to do a direct comparison and post the results for you.

War

Thanks, that would be really cool and helpful! The final mix of our album is getting closer and if the EMT is all what it's hyped to be, I guess the upgrade would be a good move. We're pretty satisfied with the Dreamverb as well, though.

[Jim Williams]

224XL rich plate split is very good, I add a variation of each to blend by messing with crossovers, diffusion, space and RT.

I also really like the room programs when I don't want a reverb wash. Everything else is thin and artificial to me, even the Echoplate II real plate reverb sounds "metallic". Good for lots of stuff, just not so good for vocals unless you want the early 70's sound.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

[dbbubba]

I don't know what it is with reverb, but it is what seperates the men from the boys in mixing. It is the first place that people fall down when mixing a lot of times.

Reverb is like cocaine!
Even monkeys can't quit using it!

A few years back I read the book Behind the Glass and I was amazed at how few people used reverb on vocals.
Those that do use VERY little unless it's Hoolio Iglesias (a good friend was his live guy for years) or Celine Dion.

In fact, the George Martin interview is kinda' funny because he alludes to the fact that he mixed a Celine track on the "tribute to the Beatles" record and the Celine camp must have not liked it. He did the reverb and vocal treatment different than Humberto Gattica (sp?) did it at that time.

Danny Brown

[EngineEars]

Originally Posted by dbbubba

Reverb is like cocaine!

Is that why the 80's were so wet?

[dbbubba]

Reverbs suddenly became cheap(er) and smaller.
It was hard to build a good sounding live reverb chamber and took up a lot of room.

Yeah, it fueled the '80s sound.

What did?

Danny Brown

[Geddyleewannabe]

Originally Posted by stagefright13

OOPS original post was what settings. I'm sorry what reverb ya got?

Ibanez SDR1000

All reverbs have the same basic parameters, so I'm not seeking people who just have my unit.

[Geddyleewannabe]

Originally Posted by u b i k

despite repeated and ongoing attempts to get with the program, i keep coming back to the same setting: off.

delay, otoh, is another matter entirely, and i couldn't live without it. well, i suppose i could live, but it would be a dull, dreary existence.


gregoire
del
ubk
.

OK...what delay settings do you like to use on vocals?

[dreamsongs]

It all depends on your reverb...

If you smear your tracks with sh**ty reverbs, I can almost guarantee it will sound awful.

If you use a high end reverb judiciously and without abuse, there's nothing like it.

I don't buy who says they record dry tracks. What do you do, stick the mics in a vaccum ? Although it's possible to mic any source and limit reflections, you're going to get some reverb whether you like it or not. Therefore, I doubt very much you can get a completely dry recording.

Oops, did I get a bit of track here ?

Anyway, I agree with Thrill in that Reverbs will never go out of style. Good reverbs that is...

[dbbubba]

I'll give away a "secret" I have used for several years mixing live events.

I send to two DDLs or a unit with stereo delays and seperate outputs.
One delay is set for 120 msec. and the other for 242 msec. and there is little or no regeneration. Maybe 5% on the 242 msec.
I bring each DDL output up on a fader and have them muted until I want them.
I'll use maybe 120 msec. for a whole song, maybe 242 msec. for anaother. A lot of times it's 120 msec. on the verses and 242 on the chorus.
I gain ride the DDLs and have my left hand on the lead vocal and my right hand on the DDL fader(s) 95% of the time I am at the console mixing.
I have a close in / short 120 msec. and the slightly longer 242 msec. which are close to 15 ips and 7.5 ips slap on a tape deck.

Occasionally on ballads I'll use longer like 320 msec.
I might also use 170 msec. on some rock stuff.
I learned the 170 msec. from Glenn Danzig's live F.O.H. guy and found it kinda' cool.

I use any of these settings for support and I try to keep them almost in-audible.
I don't have echo on the vocal per se, but it's there.
Most people wouldn't say there was echo, but if I turn it off the vocal sounds smaller.
Most artists I mix for love me for this live.
I put the vocalist out front like a record if he's any good and most people I mix are good.

I find that these settings work real well for dense rock stuff, too.

Unless I am in the middle of a big, outdoor field mixing live on a large system, I rarely use reverb on vocals.
I might use a tiny bit on studio mixes for ballads.
Mostly I stay close to the settings I mentioned above.
I'll vary them to the tempo of the song but I don't try to make them match beats.
I also have one side shorter than the other and with a bit of stereo spread on studio mixes.

If the vocalist requires it I will insert a de-esser before his DDL.
The vocal will have a DDL dedicated to it and maybe I'll add a 2nd vocal (harmony) or poerhaps a bit of the BGs. I try to keep the double dry.

Doubling... there's a whole different thread!

In the words of an old aquaintance Buford Jones (he's mixed a few people live)
"Set the effects to where they are not too loud. Make them sound good to your ear. Now, turn them down."

Danny Brown

[Rev. Robb]

480L Plates...edit the settings to fit the song. Not that I have heard every reverb, but from what I have heard the 480L is the best!

[u b k]

Originally Posted by Geddyleewannabe

OK...what delay settings do you like to use on vocals?

i'll primarily use 1/4 and 1/2 note delays.

for general thickening and a vibe that is more than dry but less than wet, which is often what i want in a verse, i'll tuck a lowpassed 1/4 note mono line right under the primary vox, with generous feedback. this delay will almost never be heard as a distinct element, it will swim below the surface and give a sense of depth and lushness to the voice. lowpassing is usually quite low, in the 400-1k zone. no sibilants, no mids to make it distinct, only low mids so that it blurs with the voice.

for a feel that is wider, trippier, spacier, more heady, i'll go with a stereo line around 1/2 note, but with a 10-50ms difference between the two sides. the greater the time difference, the wider the illusion. these are panned maybe 9 and 3, maybe full out. these are lowpassed closer to 2 or 3k, they sit higher in the mix (not just louder, but higher up). the more trippy or intense the mood, the more they get pushed. this is SOP for choruses that want to get big, and it's also a good trick for the occasional line that you want to jump out or have extra drama.

the art of the delay is to find that perfect feedback, eq and level so that it gives the density and wetness you need without screwing with the intelligibility of the voice (unless that's the effect you want, say something pyschedelic). again, i find that mixing loud (85db) is critical when dialing it in, if you're mixing quietly it's easy to overdo the effect.

it can also be cool to send these delays, rather than the vocal itself, into a reverb. dark plates and long halls especially, those who've played with eventide boxes know what i'm talking about. oceans of sound, a fine place to drift.


gregoire
del
ubk
.

[cjogo]

I just dial in the delay on a TC ..just tap it in> for the vocal feel/time you require. Although we are mainly TC equipped (great presets & easy to tweak) ...my fav verbs are in the early LXP5 .

Wasn't that guy from the Beatles --Macca >> that dials in a 181msec ~ for his live vocal shows

[Jim Williams]

Originally Posted by dbbubba

I'll give away a "secret" I have used for several years mixing live events.

I send to two DDLs or a unit with stereo delays and seperate outputs.
One delay is set for 120 msec. and the other for 242 msec. and there is little or no regeneration. Maybe 5% on the 242 msec.
I bring each DDL output up on a fader and have them muted until I want them.
I'll use maybe 120 msec. for a whole song, maybe 242 msec. for anaother. A lot of times it's 120 msec. on the verses and 242 on the chorus.
I gain ride the DDLs and have my left hand on the lead vocal and my right hand on the DDL fader(s) 95% of the time I am at the console mixing.
I have a close in / short 120 msec. and the slightly longer 242 msec. which are close to 15 ips and 7.5 ips slap on a tape deck.

Occasionally on ballads I'll use longer like 320 msec.
I might also use 170 msec. on some rock stuff.
I learned the 170 msec. from Glenn Danzig's live F.O.H. guy and found it kinda' cool.

I use any of these settings for support and I try to keep them almost in-audible.
I don't have echo on the vocal per se, but it's there.
Most people wouldn't say there was echo, but if I turn it off the vocal sounds smaller.
Most artists I mix for love me for this live.
I put the vocalist out front like a record if he's any good and most people I mix are good.

I find that these settings work real well for dense rock stuff, too.

Unless I am in the middle of a big, outdoor field mixing live on a large system, I rarely use reverb on vocals.
I might use a tiny bit on studio mixes for ballads.
Mostly I stay close to the settings I mentioned above.
I'll vary them to the tempo of the song but I don't try to make them match beats.
I also have one side shorter than the other and with a bit of stereo spread on studio mixes.

If the vocalist requires it I will insert a de-esser before his DDL.
The vocal will have a DDL dedicated to it and maybe I'll add a 2nd vocal (harmony) or poerhaps a bit of the BGs. I try to keep the double dry.

Doubling... there's a whole different thread!

In the words of an old aquaintance Buford Jones (he's mixed a few people live)
"Set the effects to where they are not too loud. Make them sound good to your ear. Now, turn them down."

Danny Brown

We used to do that to Stevie Wonder's vocals on tour back in the 80's with Maryland Sound. I believe it was PCM42's combined with a 224XL and Stevie would bring his R2D2 EMT 250 out on the road too. Most of the hockey rinks would get little or no 224, the EMT I hear all over the board tapes we made, but the delay was distinct as the room's reverb would wash out the need for the 224 most of the time. Where they really shined was on the outdoor gigs, like a certain soccer stadium in Swansea, Wales, where the 224 made for an "indoor" experience. Stevie still has the 250 and you can hear it all over his new CD, "A Time for Love".

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades