Can we trust them?

[dasoundjunkie]

Is there anyone here who thinks that you have to learn to read between the lines with magazine reviews?
My take on this is as follows:
Mix-If they are blown away by it then usually you can believe them, but if they just like it you can usually assume it's shit!
Recording, Electronic Musician and EQ- depends on who is doing the review.!
Tape Op- As far as I can tell they play it straight!
I just find that because a lot of us don't have accses to gear we rely on the industry mags for info, and as such I really believe that tha they should always be straight up about products, we rely on them to be honest no to be a manufactorers lackey!

[lucey]

you have a lot to learn young Skywalker

[jdjustice]

well i don't think you are totally in the wrong. i rarely read completely negative reviews in these magazines; however, Mix and the big boys usually only review products from well-known and respected companies....

i really think you do need to check out the reviewer and read other reviews by that person to see if you think that person is a person of integrity...

but generally i think the reviewer(s) do their best to be honest in 90% of the cases. there are a few reviewers, however, that I do not trust. i will not name them here because i don't want to spread disrespect.

[dasoundjunkie]

Originally Posted by jdjustice

well i don't think you are totally in the wrong. i rarely read completely negative reviews in these magazines; however, Mix and the big boys usually only review products from well-known and respected companies....

i really think you do need to check out the reviewer and read other reviews by that person to see if you think that person is a person of integrity...

but generally i think the reviewer(s) do their best to be honest in 90% of the cases. there are a few reviewers, however, that I do not trust. i will not name them here because i don't want to spread disrespect.

Like I said it depends who is doing the review!Very frustrating sometimes!

[joelpatterson]

Originally Posted by jdjustice

i really think you do need to check out the reviewer and read other reviews by that person to see if you think that person is a person of integrity...

[6strings]

I just read 'em for the pictures. Trade mags are entertaining when you're bored, but the only parts you can really take seriously would be the interviews. As far as reviews go, magazines will never bite the hand that feeds them...

[cosmos]

this is why we have Gearslutz !!! so far people have helped me alot with my gear, and all came out for good .

i rather hear opinion from a gearslut user who worked on the same unit for 2 days or so ... then hear 'professional' opinion from a magazine.

i use to read alot of magazins, somtime i still do ... then thay can be a good use if you stuck in the bathroom and need to wipe you @$$% ...

[Ethan Winer]

> Is there anyone here who thinks that you have to learn to read between the lines with magazine reviews? <

It's much simpler than that. It's basically a matter of competance. In the old days the maxim was "Those who can do, those who can't teach."

Today it's more like "Good audio engineers do that, bad ones write for magazines."

I can say that because I write for magazines.

Of course, I'm one of the few exceptions!

--Ethan

[not_so_new]

Originally Posted by Ethan Winer

> Is there anyone here who thinks that you have to learn to read between the lines with magazine reviews? <

It's much simpler than that. It's basically a matter of competance. In the old days the maxim was "Those who can do, those who can't teach."

Today it's more like "Good audio engineers do that, bad ones write for magazines."

Or dare I say, on the Internet....

(I can say that because I write on the Internet... Of course, I'm one of the few exceptions!) LOL

[Acoustic Cloud]

I think its better to have a few friends local or online that have some good ears. They may not own/tried everything you would be interested in, but I have been steered good directions with some reviews, and some friends.

I just remember the 2 years I subscribed to SOS, that Paul White seemed to love EVERYTHING!

He seemed like a nice bloke, but cmon man!! You cant like everything!

[fross]

You've answered your own question.
And no, you can't expect an honest opinion from ANY magazine, unless they're independent, self sustaining and devoid of paid advertisements, period.

[Reptil]

Originally Posted by Acoustic Cloud

I think its better to have a few friends local or online that have some good ears. They may not own/tried everything you would be interested in, but I have been steered good directions with some reviews, and some friends.

I just remember the 2 years I subscribed to SOS, that Paul White seemed to love EVERYTHING!

He seemed like a nice bloke, but cmon man!! You cant like everything!

yeah even Logic 7.0, great software, hardly any bugs

[mhartman]

I agree about Sound on Sound. I am in the middle of a subscription and I am pretty bored by it. I approach the magazines as if they are just advertisements. Basically, it is gear porn -- look at the pictures but don't believe the stories. I agree with a previous poster though, the interviews are worth reading.

[Jim Williams]

REP magazine used to do honest reviews, I know, I did a few. I would review the features, comment on the sonics and then rip it apart with the Audio Precision analyzer. Sometimes it didn't look too good. I would always contact the manufacturer if I found serious problems first for comments or potential corrections. If they blew me off, I would run it as is.

I once found bad design flaws on the AMEK Mozart console. I ran it honest and they wouldn't talk to me for years. They threatend to sue, I offered to modem over the test results, they then shut up about it. They lost a multi million dollar sale to Paramount Pictures as a result of that review. I still feel good about that today.

Here's a "modern" review: I used it, I liked it, now go buy it.

Here's a hint: If you see an ad for the product reviewed, consider it paid advertising.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

[vixapphire]

Originally Posted by Jim Williams

REP magazine used to do honest reviews, I know, I did a few. I would review the features, comment on the sonics and then rip it apart with the Audio Precision analyzer. Sometimes it didn't look too good. I would always contact the manufacturer if I found serious problems first for comments or potential corrections. If they blew me off, I would run it as is.

I once found bad design flaws on the AMEK Mozart console. I ran it honest and they wouldn't talk to me for years. They threatend to sue, I offered to modem over the test results, they then shut up about it. They lost a multi million dollar sale to Paramount Pictures as a result of that review. I still feel good about that today.

Here's a "modern" review: I used it, I liked it, now go buy it.

Here's a hint: If you see an ad for the product reviewed, consider it paid advertising.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

I loved REP and also StudioSound (i think that's what it was called). They used to sell them at OpAmp Technical Books in Hollywizzle. I preferred their format to Mix in many ways. Now that St. Croix is no longer around to pen great columns for Mix, that magazine has lost its utility in my life...

I've found that the British edition of "FutureMusic" is a pretty straight-up magazine. It used to be much better, a few formatting changes ago (so was the gear...), but it's still pretty solid, review-wise. They're generally not afraid to slag something if it's lame. Their record reviews are similarly wide-ranging. They used to have a couple of featured records every month - I had the spare dough so I picked up both recommended discs a couple of months in a row, and I'll be damned if those recommendations weren't spot on! The recently-introduced US edition of FutureMusic is pathetic - it's so poorly laid out that it's pretty much impossible to read anything. Plus, with the general tendency away from actual reading anymore, there's less and less text and more lousy pictures - not "good pictures", but lousy ones - so you're left wondering what you just paid $10 for. Of course, the UK edition is next-to-impossible to find, as luck would have it.

I read a review of the newish Virus TI synth in EM a couple months ago, and immediately began lusting after one, as in, "this is the sound/features/etc. that I need to break through a barrier of sound and inspiration"... Within a few weeks of putting the magazine aside and hanging out among my Nord 3, Waldorf Q and XT, super Jupiter synths, I realized that I'd been had!!! Glad I didn't have the money burning a hole in my pocket at the time. Obviously, they're good writers to be able to sell their audience on the goods like that, but I still have no idea whether the TI is such a great improvement over the previous iteration of the Virus soundwise (and most people whose opinions I've seen are still reeling from the TI's bugginess). Who needs truth in advertising - the reviews aren't classified as adverts!!!

v

[DAWgEAR]

Trust no one.

[AdamLazlo]

Originally Posted by DAWgEAR

Trust no one.

Honestly... for the most part.... yup.

The things I own/use/want are things I actually had a chance to use either elsewhere or demo'd. When it gets to be $1000 per channel for this-or-that, I can't trust what others think cuz they might come from a completely different perspective at that given moment. Hell, I've been blown away by gear one day and not the next. Even if it's a review by someone I love as an engineer and/or know personally, I'd rather check it out for myself.

Sure, when there's hype, I can't help but get caught up in the frenzy... but it's not until I put on my "practical hat". There are plenty of things that people, even on this message board, that keep going back to certain units but even then I won't BUY anything just because of that... even if it's a budget thing. I'll have to try anything myself before committing.

Would you buy a car without a test drive even if it was a brand new Ferrari? Especially if you've never drove a Ferrari? But if you can afford a Ferrari, sight unseen, I'm guessing it's all for vanity sake.... or you can just cuz you can.... or you're being sponsored to drive one. Gee, now I feel like that was a cliché.

-- Adam Lazlo

[dbbubba]

Opinions are like.....

You older guys can recall when what are now coveted as great pieces were considered absolutely worthless junk and it was THAT long ago either!

Now if something just doesn't work very well.

Them Mozarts did stank, too!
How about a Hendrix?
Einstein?

I can remember when the classic pieces only had spec sheets that you'd get at a pro dealer and those places were rare, too! The only mass advertised equipment was stuff like TASCAM which would be in the music mags like Contemporary Keyboard or Guitar player.
It might have been before they were around, too. You just didn't see ads for recording or audio gear much less reviews!

Hell, I recall first seeing an ad for a Crybaby Wah pedal in Boys Life Magazine! I swear to GOD! I can still picture the ad and where I was when I saw it... elementary school in Houston, TX. I guess Boy Scouts needed to rock out, too! It seems wierd don't it?

Danny Brown

[84K]

Originally Posted by lucey

you have a lot to learn young Skywalker

Reviews are usually awards for advert blocks.

When was the last time anyone here read a bad review in any of the recording mags???

Also, when you see a review, flip through that very same mag and look for a ad for that manufacturer.

1 + 1

[Mike Caffrey]

Honesty and accuracy are very different things. You get a reviewer using sloppy methods or in an untuned room and they may be 100% honest, but that doesn't mean it will be an accurate review.

[Jim Williams]

Yep, and they only give subjective opinions based on their potentially flawed experience with it.

Worst part is the objective tests are missing. AP tests are the only real world data that can separate subjective magazine reviewers that are all gushy about playing with a new piece from real world performance.

At least the tests can alert the potential buyer to problems before the purchase, can a reviewer do that? Will they?

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

[Don S]

Originally Posted by Jim Williams

Here's a "modern" review: I used it, I liked it, now go buy it.

Jim Williams
Audio Upgrades

Yup! I think they're like politicians, someone's already bought and paid for what you're hearing from them.
The only mag I've ever seen a bad review from is Sound on Sound. So as in politics, they are truely the lesser of the evils!

[skopje]

I agree with a lot said on this thread. I always try and listen to gear before i buy, but recently i have been swayed by reviews, and i'm slightly bitter about it.

You do definately have to read between the lines. My last few duff purchases have been when i have listened to a few products which had pros and cons, but the glowing reviews have sometimes swayed me. Especially when there are glowing reviews in more than one magazine.

As a whole i really like sound on sound. It is really well written and i enjoy reading it. But now if they are raving about something i will almost write it off becasue i don't trust there opnion anymore.

If you go back and read this old joe meek review, you will find it to be very balenced
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1997...oemeekvc1.html

But when you read more recent reveiws it is very slanted.

I would also agree with the gearlustz member who made the point avout advertising. The last 3 duff products i have bought, just swayed by SOS reveiws have all been HEAVILY, HEAVILY. ADVERTISED!!!!!!

Now when i see Sound on sound reviews, and lot's of adverts of the same product i run a mile...........

I think they do try and point out lemons but you have to read between the lines. For example. There were glowing reviews of the saffire and saffire LE. But when talking about the preamps they used the word "Usable" But this kind of got lost in the weight of all the other postive reviews.

I don't think they have an easy job. Too subtle and you piss of the readers, too harsh and you piss off the advertisers. However, i currently feel that the balence leans too heavily towards the industry and not the consumer

It has also made me listen to things more carefully when i audition them. If the shop asssistant has to wait, then they can wait, i'm the one spending my money then tough titty!!!!!

stephen

[john caldwell]

Originally Posted by 84K

Reviews are usually awards for advert blocks.

This is the paradigm, I am increasingly afraid. This exchange governs all of our media and the way that it covers every industry. For example, my employer is a huge health care system. My employer is the largest paid advertiser in our city's most subscribed newspaper. I can't help but be aware that this newspaper exercises extraordinary prejudice in terms of the types of health care stories it runs. Coverage that could be unflattering to their largest advert customer (and every large health care system could provide plenty of substrate for unflattering coverage) is strictly avoided, while glamorous and happy topics (like new minimally invasive surgery methods) are given tremendous coverage.

So in essence, the newspaper "article" is no less a paid advertisement than is the full-page ad depicting silver-haired seniors at their grandkids' birthday parties.

Health care and pro audio are just examples of this economy, I suspect. A more insidious mechanism by which this operates is in the type of news that gets reported-or not reported at all. Forget the tone of the report. So it goes very deep to the heart of our system in the USA, and maybe elsewhere in the world, I believe.

In now way am I a liberal conspiracy theorist; quite the opposiste. This is just the way I've come to see our society.

John-

[Don S]

Can we say the oposite is true? I.E. If you can't find a review on a product that lots are using and it's not heavily advertized, then is it good enough not to need one?
Case in point, the Dynaudio bm6A I just bought. SOS was the ONLY review I could find in the mags and online. And it was dated 1997!

[lucey]

Originally Posted by Don S

Can we say the oposite is true? I.E. If you can't find a review on a product that lots are using and it's not heavily advertized, then is it good enough not to need one?
Case in point, the Dynaudio bm6A I just bought. SOS was the ONLY review I could find in the mags and online. And it was dated 1997!

A good point, but to be fair that's an older product ... and Dyn is now through TC Electronic. TC has been pushing the Air 6 for the last 5 years pretty hard, and let go of BM6a marketing, that had dwindled already when they took over from Dynaudio.

(Truth Audio 1A would be my vote for no hype sleeper monitors. $1298/pr. direct. )

[Don S]

Originally Posted by lucey

(Truth Audio 1A would be my vote for no hype sleeper monitors. $1298/pr. direct. )

I could not get them. They are in the process of making them via a larger manufacturer. China maybe? So, as usual, I find out about things too late!
Any other suggestions - I'm about to listen to the TB2Sa.

[T.RayBullard]

Originally Posted by Don S

I could not get them. They are in the process of making them via a larger manufacturer. China maybe? So, as usual, I find out about things too late!
Any other suggestions - I'm about to listen to the TB2Sa.

Don, Link Audio has a demo pair for sale...1400...fantastic for classical music..id be glad to send em to you..

(our needs are quite different than the rest!)

[octatonic]

Way back when I wrote for several Australian magazines, which I really shouldn't name.

Basically a good review = you can keep the product.

Personally I never gave a bad product a good review- but I did have reviews heavily edited or refused to be printed.
Creamware's Scope was one I caned on a first view- the supplier got a copy of my review (yes, they often get to see the reviews) and went ballistic so they dropped it.
I still got paid.
Didn't write another review after that- was pretty pissed with the situation.

Every industry has its share of sharks and scammers.

I'm surprised people still buy magazines these days- there is better info on the web, here at GS and it is more honest. Bit of a waste of money from my POV.
Still, I have a subscription to SOS- good to read on the bog- and useful if you run out of toilet paper.

[Glenn Kuras]

Originally Posted by richmondjames

I'm surprised people still buy magazines these days- there is better info on the web, here at GS and it is more honest. Bit of a waste of money from my POV.
Still, I have a subscription to SOS- good to read on the bog- and useful if you run out of toilet paper.

I could not agree more. When a customer calls and asks "Do you have any reviews" my answer is "Go to Gearslutz.com and type in GIK". When I buy a piece of gear the first thing I do is come here and just do a search.
Not to say that it is kind of fun bragging about mag reviews to my family.

Glenn