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Riding faders in DAW with inserted compressors
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Swurveman
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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Riding faders in DAW with inserted compressors

This is a much discussed topic, but I have not seen this concern raised. So, I have a question for people riding faders while using a compressor in a DAW insert:

When you ride the fader, which was originally designed for volume control, do you simultaneously have your hand on the compressors gain? Because if you're raising the fader with a compressor insert- the compressor is just squashing it more- which is defeating the purpose, isn't it?

If someone could help clarify this, I'd appreciate it.
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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I would suggest sending the vocal to a new group channel and putting the compressor on that, then riding the original vocal channel, this I assume would eliminate any problems as the level hitting your compressed channel will depend on the volume of the orignal vocal channel? correct me if I'm wrong.
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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cbdrummer44 is offline
DAW insert on the channel or on the mix bus?

On the channel - fader is post compressor.

Mixbuss - yes it makes a difference but it depends on your attack/release times and threshold.

Either way use your ears. If it sounds good who cares!
Swurveman
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mphazes View Post
I would suggest sending the vocal to a new group channel and putting the compressor on that, then riding the original vocal channel, this I assume would eliminate any problems as the level hitting your compressed channel will depend on the volume of the orignal vocal channel? correct me if I'm wrong.
I believe you are correct if the send is prefader. However, aren't compressors used as inserts instead of sends for a purpose?
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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bergj00 is online now
I normally do a pass just riding the fader with the compressor is bypass. Once I'm happy with the levels, I coalesce the volume to clip gain. That way all my riding happens before the plug in chain. The compressor is then used to just catch any peaks. Then if I really wanted a "compressed" sound I send the track to a bus and place a compressor on that. This way I know that the signal I'm sending the bus is at a consistent level.
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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mphazes is offline
sorry maybe I didn't explain correctly, sending the vocals to a group bus and putting the compressor on that channel as opposed to on the actual vocal channel, then you can ride the fader of the original vocal channel and the compressor will act accordingly, not as a send effect
Swurveman
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cbdrummer44 View Post
DAW insert on the channel or on the mix bus?

On the channel - fader is post compressor.

Mixbuss - yes it makes a difference but it depends on your attack/release times and threshold.

Either way use your ears. If it sounds good who cares!
I'm talking about a channel insert. And yes, the fader is post compression. So, you can't be riding into the compressor. But this is about those people who ride faders into a compressor. Hence, my question.

Edit: I want to thank you though for helping me understand that the only way to do this in a DAW is to put the compressor (in Cubase at least) in inserts 7-8 which are post fader.
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15th February 2013
Old 15th February 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergj00 View Post
I normally do a pass just riding the fader with the compressor is bypass. Once I'm happy with the levels, I coalesce the volume to clip gain. That way all my riding happens before the plug in chain. The compressor is then used to just catch any peaks. Then if I really wanted a "compressed" sound I send the track to a bus and place a compressor on that. This way I know that the signal I'm sending the bus is at a consistent level.
Thanks befgjOO.

What do you mean by "coalesce levels to clip gain"? I took that to mean that you used the gain knob on the DAW's channel(s) to raise the level to 0dB. Is that what you meant?
Swurveman
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15th February 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mphazes View Post
sorry maybe I didn't explain correctly, sending the vocals to a group bus and putting the compressor on that channel as opposed to on the actual vocal channel, then you can ride the fader of the original vocal channel and the compressor will act accordingly, not as a send effect
By "sending" you mean outputting/routing the channel to the Group Channel instead of the stereo mix bus. Correct?

If you are outputting say a vocal channel to a group channel and riding the vocal channel, isn't the same result happening when you raise the fader of the vocal channel? Aren't you you also raising the level routed to the group channel's compressor insert, which would lower the volume according to the ratio and threshold settings?
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15th February 2013
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brew is offline
Quote:
I have a question for people riding faders while using a compressor in a DAW insert: When you ride the fader, which was originally designed for volume control, do you simultaneously have your hand on the compressors gain? Because if you're raising the fader with a compressor insert- the compressor is just squashing it more- which is defeating the purpose, isn't it?
Signal flow duders. A channel insert on any console or DAW is prefader unless you tell it otherwise for some wacko reason. Therefore it normally does not behave as you are describing unless you have done something differently. Is this a theoretical exercise or are you sitting in front of your DAW (what DAW?) as you test this?

mphazes describes a complicated solution to a problem that doesn't exist. I'm surprised this is tripping us up so thoroughly. cbdrummer44 is correct.
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15th February 2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brew View Post
Signal flow duders. A channel insert on any console or DAW is prefader unless you tell it otherwise for some wacko reason. Therefore it normally does not behave as you are describing unless you have done something differently. Is this a theoretical exercise or are you sitting in front of your DAW (what DAW?) as you test this?
Thanks for your thoughts brew.

This is both a theoretical and practical concern. My DAW software is Cubase 6

I did more searching and found this tip which answers my question.

Sorry for the bother.
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16th February 2013
Old 16th February 2013
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mphazes is offline
Quote:
Originally Posted by Swurveman View Post
By "sending" you mean outputting/routing the channel to the Group Channel instead of the stereo mix bus. Correct?

If you are outputting say a vocal channel to a group channel and riding the vocal channel, isn't the same result happening when you raise the fader of the vocal channel? Aren't you you also raising the level routed to the group channel's compressor insert, which would lower the volume according to the ratio and threshold settings?
yes you are correct, my fault!
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