BEst Mic Pre: Focusrite Red series, Neve, API, other?

[lawrence_o]

Hi guysm what's your opinion in these.

What would you rather have and why. Don't tell me you want a Neve instead of an API if you haven't worked with both please. I am looking for people's opinions here, from people who can tell. no offense.

And how do e.g. Mic Pres of an SSL4000 compare to those above? And how about Mic Pres in a 9000? Difference hearable?

I am aware it is the complete vocal chain together with the Mic that makes the sound, but still, this should be an interesting debate. Bring it on guys!

Thanks.
Cheers
Lawrence.

[TonyBelmont]

Originally Posted by lawrence_o

Hi guysm what's your opinion in these.

What would you rather have and why. Don't tell me you want a Neve instead of an API if you haven't worked with both please. I am looking for people's opinions here, from people who can tell. no offense.

And how do e.g. Mic Pres of an SSL4000 compare to those above? And how about Mic Pres in a 9000? Difference hearable?

I am aware it is the complete vocal chain together with the Mic that makes the sound, but still, this should be an interesting debate. Bring it on guys!

Thanks.
Cheers
Lawrence.

Another preamp thread...

Just kidding... Well, I love Neve and API... I would get 2 or 4 x channels of each and call it a day!

For the second part of your question, the 4000 pre's are nothing special. The 9000 pre is a marked improvement over the 4k, but I wouldn't pick an SSL pre over either Neve or API.

[James Guitar]

i think the best results will be yielded by you performing a search for this in the archives. a lot of people have expressed a lot of opinions on this topic over time and you can glean a lot of information by looking it up. just a thought...
-J

[ajakoner]

Never liked the red series. The gain is in, what, 6 db detents? not my fav. IMO

[Meriphew]

Search the forums and you'll find tons and tons of threads that have already covered this.

[lawrence_o]

Well I guess I must have searched the wrong way then. I looked for Focusrite and indeed found a few threads in which it appeared but nowhere a focusrite versus SSL versus NEve etc. Will try harder

Thanks anyway.
Cheers

[lawrence_o]

Originally Posted by JuanPabloCuervo

dacs clarity mic-pre

spl-usa.com
gainstation1 it's like a super presonus bluetube on steroids
has dual path original from summit, and no-capacitors original from john hardy m-1

adk mp-1 with millenia media mm-990 and jensen transfomer
or old api2550 op-amp + lundalh?or sowter

john hardy m-1

millenia media

www.thelisteningsessions.com
www.blacklionaudio.com
www.mytekdigital.com

are files to listen

look here:
http://www.thelisteningsessions.com/micpregraph.htm
www.dacs-audio.com

if you buy dacs promise to post some a/b files against mbox1 or something everybody knows

promise?

Hi,

Thanks for this. If there is one thing I noticed from these tests is that I like the Neve sound and I hate the API Mic Pres. They sound flat, and people been talking so much about API. Never worked with it but sorry, am very disapointed in their sound from these examples...

On the other hand, the differences that I can hear are so subtle that I'm sure I could EQ and verb the signals so that in the final mix, no-one would be able to tell me what I recorded it with. THis proves to me once more that we're sometimes paying thousands of bucks for very very subtle differences that the ear can detect. Silly people we are :-)

Thanks for this. I could send you A/B files from an SSL Mic Pre versus a Focusrite Mic Pre soon but that's all I have, really. Would like to have a Neve Pre someday...

Cheers Lawrence

[Gregg Sartiano]

I remember delcosmos talking about mixing a vocal track (which he hadn't originally tracked) that sounded dark and not-so-great at first and then ended up being exquisite in the final mix, because the mic/chain 'took' to the processing he gave it in mixdown.

I have had this happen many times as well.

This lack of contextual processing is the downfall of most of these listening tests, if you ask me.

Also, one 'flavor' of mic/pre/comp/EQ will work great on ONE voice but not on ANOTHER voice. That's a given.

[robmix]

[quote=lawrence_o]Hi,

Thanks for this. If there is one thing I noticed from these tests is that I like the Neve sound and I hate the API Mic Pres. They sound flat, and people been talking so much about API. Never worked with it but sorry, am very disapointed in their sound from these examples.../QUOTE]

I'll probably get flamed for this but I agree. I'm just not an API fan.

Originally Posted by lawrence_o

On the other hand, the differences that I can hear are so subtle that I'm sure I could EQ and verb the signals so that in the final mix, no-one would be able to tell me what I recorded it with. THis proves to me once more that we're sometimes paying thousands of bucks for very very subtle differences that the ear can detect. Silly people we are :-)

My mentor once said, "engineering is a game of inches", and he's right. We're constantly fighting for that last 1% or 2%, and sometimes that extra bit of quality costs money.

Back on topic. . . I like the Red and ISA series but they're certainly not as exciting or vibey as Neves. I've got an ISA-110 that I keep around for pop vocals. On the right source they kill most other preamps. SSL 4000 pre's are usable but nowhere near my top 10. THe 9000 was a step up but still not in the league of Neve's, Wunder, Trident A Range, Daking, Millenia, etc.

[Jazzy Alz]

Originally Posted by JuanPabloCuervo

dacs clarity mic-pre

spl-usa.com
gainstation1 it's like a super presonus bluetube on steroids
has dual path original from summit, and no-capacitors original from john hardy m-1

adk mp-1 with millenia media mm-990 and jensen transfomer
or old api2550 op-amp + lundalh?or sowter

john hardy m-1

millenia media

www.thelisteningsessions.com
www.blacklionaudio.com
www.mytekdigital.com

are files to listen

look here:
http://www.thelisteningsessions.com/micpregraph.htm
www.dacs-audio.com

if you buy dacs promise to post some a/b files against mbox1 or something everybody knows

promise?

Was that english

[Jazzy Alz]

i like neve for vocals, guitar, sometimes drums. api for drums/percussion/guitar. If I was you i'd buy -

2 x 1073/1084 - $7000
api 6 slot lunch box (2x512, 2x550a, 2x525) - $7000

It will sound great and keep its value

[lawrence_o]

Originally Posted by robmix

Back on topic. . . I like the Red and ISA series but they're certainly not as exciting or vibey as Neves. I've got an ISA-110 that I keep around for pop vocals. On the right source they kill most other preamps.

Are the ISAs better than the red? Are they higher quality products? Where do they situate themselves between the Red Range?

Originally Posted by robmix

THe 9000 was a step up but still not in the league of Neve's, Wunder, Trident A Range, Daking, Millenia, etc.

That's quite a bit statement given the fact that SSL9000 are all over the place and Dakings are not. Nevertheless, SSL is hyped, Daking is not. Been hearing good things about daking. I like the 9000 Mic Pres I must admit.

Cheers

[robmix]

Originally Posted by lawrence_o

That's quite a bit statement given the fact that SSL9000 are all over the place and Dakings are not. Nevertheless, SSL is hyped, Daking is not. Been hearing good things about daking. I like the 9000 Mic Pres I must admit.

Cheers

Re: daking vs SSL9000. It's not really a bold statement at all. Mcdonalds is everywhere, that doesn't mean they make the best hamburgers :)

Daking's are based on Trident A-Range, I doubt you'd find many engineers that would choose to track with SSL pre's over Trident A Range/Daking - even SSL jockies. Now when it comes to mixing that would be a different story based on functionality (automation, recall, sends, busses, gates and compressors), not on sound. If I had the cash I'd have both a 9000 for labor intensive mixes and the Daking for tracking and small mixes. For now I chose my Daking console over an SSL.

[The MPCist]

I doubt there are alot of people who love SSL micpres enough to track everything thru them.... Mostly people are using them cuz they're on the board and convenient for tracking--But that's about it I think.

The whole SSL thing is for mixing. They sound good for mixes but I'd rather use other pres to track.

[Jazzy Alz]

Alot of tupacs deathrow era recordings were -

u87 - ssl 4000 channel strip - dbx 160

They sound fine to me

[Jazzy Alz]

Originally Posted by robmix

Re: daking vs SSL9000. It's not really a bold statement at all. Mcdonalds is everywhere, that doesn't mean they make the best hamburgers :)

Daking's are based on Trident A-Range, I doubt you'd find many engineers that would choose to track with SSL pre's over Trident A Range/Daking - even SSL jockies. Now when it comes to mixing that would be a different story based on functionality (automation, recall, sends, busses, gates and compressors), not on sound. If I had the cash I'd have both a 9000 for labor intensive mixes and the Daking for tracking and small mixes. For now I chose my Daking console over an SSL.

Make that 2 please. anyone here in finance?

[lawrence_o]

Originally Posted by robmix

Re: daking vs SSL9000. It's not really a bold statement at all. Mcdonalds is everywhere, that doesn't mean they make the best hamburgers :)

Daking's are based on Trident A-Range, I doubt you'd find many engineers that would choose to track with SSL pre's over Trident A Range/Daking - even SSL jockies. Now when it comes to mixing that would be a different story based on functionality (automation, recall, sends, busses, gates and compressors), not on sound. If I had the cash I'd have both a 9000 for labor intensive mixes and the Daking for tracking and small mixes. For now I chose my Daking console over an SSL.

haha, your McDonalds statement, I love it

I understand what you mean. I heard it before where really big recording studios purchased Neve desks for recording and the SSL for mixing. But these days such is no longer affordable. I'm already happy with my 6000 desk. Love the sound together with the Prisms ADACs but I'm sure there will be other nice gear too.

However, been listening to http://www.thelisteningsessions.com/ and honestly, besides the Neve Pres are really the only ones that I liked. All the rest sounded like crap to my ears, even the API pres and they are said to be in the top 3 of the brands. But then again, these differences are so small sometimes or maybe hearable but as I said before, nothing that good EQ and verb or room can't fix... And who will hear it in the final mix? If after mixing one could not tell if it was recorded with an SSL pre or an expensive API or Daking, than what the hell are we spending our money for, right?

Cheers

[lawrence_o]

Originally Posted by The MPCist

I doubt there are alot of people who love SSL micpres enough to track everything thru them.... Mostly people are using them cuz they're on the board and convenient for tracking--But that's about it I think.

The whole SSL thing is for mixing. They sound good for mixes but I'd rather use other pres to track.

I'm already happy I can afford a used SSL let alone I have money left to buy tons of Mic Pres. But I'm happy with them as I use it only for vocals and guitars... That will change in the future but for now...

Regards