70's Trident Studio piano questions
Old 24th July 2011
  #61
and was that a dark roast or medium light roast coffee you spilled all over the Sergeant Pepper masters?
Old 24th July 2011
  #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philip S Bova View Post
and was that a dark roast or medium light roast coffee you spilled all over the Sergeant Pepper masters?
ok.


this is getting a bit disrespectful.





you should know better.












dark.
Old 25th July 2011
  #63
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skybluerental's Avatar
 

hey Ken and Alan,

here is a link to a thread i started about trident a while back if you are interested:

Photos of Trident Studios...........

it actually got quite a few comments and views.

thanks again for your contributions to the discussion.
Old 25th July 2011
  #64
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Old 25th July 2011
  #65
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ken,
how did you get that backward sound on "Madman Across the Water?"
is it just the acoustic guitar track backwards?
such a cool sound.

anything else you remember about that record?
Old 27th July 2011
  #66
Quote:
Originally Posted by skybluerental View Post
ken,
how did you get that backward sound on "Madman Across the Water?"
is it just the acoustic guitar track backwards?
such a cool sound.
I defer to Ken on this, but I'm pretty certain that this guitar you mentioned has backwards EMT plate on it. So basically the effect is that the reverb swells into the guitar then stops. This used to be achieved by flipping the tape reel over to play the song backwards. You would then send the backwards (in this case) guitar track to the reverb and record the returns back onto some free tracks on the tape. Flip the tape over and now you've got backwards reverb that swells into the guitar. It's a very cool sound and something that probably takes less time to rig up using a tape machine than doing it in a DAW.
Old 27th July 2011
  #67
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Thank you Philip. You told it exactly right and probably better than I could.

Cheers
Old 27th July 2011
  #68
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excellent!
ill have to try that with my EMT!

were Tumbleweed and Madman 16 track or 24 track?
seems like they were right on the cusp, but i am guessing 16 track.

also, ken, can you remember anything about what you did come mix time to get the vocal sound on Madman? would you have been EQ ing and compressing at mix time or would most of that been done in recording?? what would you guys have been using to compress the vox back then???
LA 2A, 175b, 1176, LA 3A?????
Madman is still one of my favorite vocal sounds EVER!

thanks guys.
Old 27th July 2011
  #69
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cinealta's Avatar
 

Is it true that Roy Thomas Baker now has the Trident Bechstein in America? Is he on this site? Thanks.
Old 27th July 2011
  #70
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Mark Kaufman's Avatar
 

Could someone please assert something inaccurate and annoy Ken again? Because it creates a marvelous and spontaneous flow of wonderful information.
Old 27th July 2011
  #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Kaufman View Post

Could someone please assert something inaccurate and annoy Ken again? Because it creates a marvelous and spontaneous flow of wonderful information.
Okay, I'll bite:

Most people don't know this (and with good reason), but did you know that the white VW on the front cover of Abbey Road was actually owned by Ken Scott?

...Oh yeah, and believe it or not, that blurry "woman" in the blue dress walking by on the back cover is actually Ken!

(...Er, back when he still had great legs.)

.
Old 31st July 2011
  #72
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Alan, Ken, you still around???

anything else to add?

please and thank you.

: )
Old 1st August 2011
  #73
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According to RussTee61:

"When Trident Studios was sold to Tape One in 1987, the piano was badly damaged as it was being moved to Trident 2 (which WAS in the Victoria area and still owned by Trident at the time!). The cradle supporting the piano broke as it was being extracted from Studio 1 and the piano went tumbling down the stairs! This happened in front of me, so I know what I'm talking about! The frame was split and the harp cracked! The bits were then crated off to Trident 2 where I understand it was eventually rebuilt before being sold."

So what is left of the piano now and what is the seller trying to sell for $300,000+? Did someone just glue the piano back together? Was everything replaced with a new harp, soundboard, and frame? If everything got replaced, then how is it the same piano? I can't believe someone would ask that much money for it and not mention the damage done in 1987, what was done to restore the piano and what parts are not original.
Old 1st August 2011
  #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 12ax7 View Post
Okay, I'll bite:

Most people don't know this (and with good reason), but did you know that the white VW on the front cover of Abbey Road was actually owned by Ken Scott?

...Oh yeah, and believe it or not, that blurry "woman" in the blue dress walking by on the back cover is actually Ken!

(...Er, back when he still had great legs.)

.
Wow.
I learn so much from this forum!
Old 1st August 2011
  #75
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Ken Scott's Avatar
 

Hi and WOW, the GOM is actually smiling. That's almost unheard of.
FYI. Both Madman and Honky were 16 track. The limiters at Trident at that time were LA2s and 1176 in the studio and 1176s and maybe LA3s in the mix room.
EQ and limiting would be done on recording and if needed also at mix.
Cheers.

ps. Looking back I don't know what I saw in that blue dress. I had a lime green taffeta one that was so much more becoming, but Ernie didn't like it.
Old 1st August 2011
  #76
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this thread makes me happy
Old 1st August 2011
  #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skybluerental View Post
excellent!
ill have to try that with my EMT!

were Tumbleweed and Madman 16 track or 24 track?
seems like they were right on the cusp, but i am guessing 16 track.

also, ken, can you remember anything about what you did come mix time to get the vocal sound on Madman? would you have been EQ ing and compressing at mix time or would most of that been done in recording?? what would you guys have been using to compress the vox back then???
LA 2A, 175b, 1176, LA 3A?????
Madman is still one of my favorite vocal sounds EVER!

thanks guys.

Ant-

Try a longer delay on your cool plate when you play around with this, also compression, eq, and varispeed [ooops you are in the box alas]. Also longer than you think RT times. An AKG spring sounds great for this as well... We did this so much back in the day...trying to copy those cool UK records- HA!


ps- Love hearing the wartime tales from Ken and Co. Keep them coming!
Old 1st August 2011
  #78
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For those of you who worked at these studios...

What where the differences, in your view, between recording at Trident or Olympic or EMI? In what ways did one of them outshine the others?
Old 1st August 2011
  #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan@FPA View Post
Ant-

Try a longer delay on your cool plate when you play around with this, also compression, eq, and varispeed [ooops you are in the box alas]. Also longer than you think RT times. An AKG spring sounds great for this as well... We did this so much back in the day...trying to copy those cool UK records- HA!


ps- Love hearing the wartime tales from Ken and Co. Keep them coming!
JP,
i will try all that.
i am not totally in the box cause i have the RADAR (which does do varispeed quite well actually) and your old B room console. using these 2 things without the computer is quite the old school feel.........

i was hoping you would see this thread cause i knew it would make you smile.

ill be in your hood in few weeks playing BASS on a show with Andy for his record release. hopefully i will see you then.

cheers.
Old 1st August 2011
  #80
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I really miss varispeed! You can keep your timestretching elasticity just give me varispeed back!

Sent from my X10i using Gearslutz.com App
Old 2nd August 2011
  #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveUK View Post

I really miss varispeed!

[...]
Yep.

...One of the reasons I still like the Alesis HD24 (for all its faults).

As far as workflow is concerned, it acts like a just like a real tape recorder (but with instant rewind).
.
Old 2nd August 2011
  #82
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Many DAWs have varispeed now - Reaper being an early example. It's basically sample rate conversion by another name/interface. (Pitch shifting with no attempt at time stretching or formant shifting, which is where the serious digital artifacts tend to come from).

I don't see any significant difference between this and using digital tape varispeed - because the end result is that the originally recorded bits get slowed down or speeded up to effectively a higher or lower sample rate, which then gets recorded/resampled to the current project rate. If this is done with digital tape via digital i/o, it's really just SRC.

I've been inspired by varispeed ever since discovering The Beatles as a kid. Actuall, I probably 'discovered' for myself prior to that by playing vinyl at the wrong speed.
Old 2nd August 2011
  #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kiwi View Post

Many DAWs have varispeed now - Reaper being an early example. It's basically sample rate conversion by another name/interface. (Pitch shifting with no attempt at time stretching or formant shifting, which is where the serious digital artifacts tend to come from).

I don't see any significant difference between this and using digital tape varispeed - because the end result is that the originally recorded bits get slowed down or speeded up to effectively a higher or lower sample rate, which then gets recorded/resampled to the current project rate. If this is done with digital tape via digital i/o, it's really just SRC.

I've been inspired by varispeed ever since discovering The Beatles as a kid. Actuall, I probably 'discovered' for myself prior to that by playing vinyl at the wrong speed.
I agree with your analysis here.

...And to put this more on topic for the OP:

Sometimes you might be playing back a multitrack session for a piano overdub, and it's a whole lot cheaper to grab the vari-speed knob than to call a piano tuner!


.
.
Old 2nd August 2011
  #84
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Interesting,might have to lose my fear of the reaper

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Old 13th December 2011
  #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Scott View Post
Hi and WOW, the GOM is actually smiling. That's almost unheard of.
FYI. Both Madman and Honky were 16 track. The limiters at Trident at that time were LA2s and 1176 in the studio and 1176s and maybe LA3s in the mix room.
EQ and limiting would be done on recording and if needed also at mix.
Cheers.

ps. Looking back I don't know what I saw in that blue dress. I had a lime green taffeta one that was so much more becoming, but Ernie didn't like it.
hey ken,
quick question about “All Things Must Pass.”
who played drums on “Let it Down.”?
that track sounds brilliant and the drum performance and sound is incredible.
just curious.
it does not sound like Ringo to my ears.

thanks very much for your input here.
Old 14th December 2011
  #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by skybluerental View Post
hey ken,
quick question about “All Things Must Pass.”
who played drums on “Let it Down.”?
that track sounds brilliant and the drum performance and sound is incredible.
just curious.
it does not sound like Ringo to my ears.

thanks very much for your input here.
I'm not the inimitable Ken Scott, but according to the Beatle Bible it was Jim Gordon...

George Harrison: Let It Down | The Beatles Bible
Old 14th December 2011
  #87
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thanks JP11.

i just LOVE that track.
Old 20th December 2011
  #88
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Hi,

Unfortunately most of the people involved in the recording have forgotten who played on what tracks. Although the list of musicians is fairly well documented their particular involvement is lost in time. Sorry I couldn't be of more help.

Cheers
Old 29th December 2011
  #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by superburtm View Post
this thread makes me happy
Exactly. What a thrill.
Old 19th March 2012
  #90
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bechstein

hello, the piano is an ancient bechstein concert grand, but not a big one, probably 7'6". i played it in 1987 and it sounded just like hunky dory from the first note.
trident studios were (are) in st, anne's court, soho, nowhere near brick lane.
cheers.
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