U87 vs. U87ai Shootout

[johnnybregar]

I never do these.

I'm guessing 1 is the vintage, 2 is the ai.

2 sounds thinner to me. The ai I have in the studio now sounds a little thin. It cuts though...

[guitarmax_99]

Drum Roll Please!!!

... and the results:

Mic 1 = U87

Mic 2 = U87ai

Thanks to all who commented on these files. I hope folks found this test helpful and educational.

[bluejbill]

That I have heard (from experts) is a big difference between the two mikes. The old ones had more headroom. I have heard loud singers even stress out an ai.

Originally Posted by kats

I didn't listen to the files because none of them stress the mic out, and that is why I find the older ones more versatile. An AI will distort in front of a high SPL source sooner than a non AI (like guitar cab) And even before distortion occurs on an AI, they start getting harsh when stressed out. Under more gentle applications I have no real preference, many times I prefer an AI - I just find them less versatile.

[dysenterygary]

Thanks for the shootout! Interesting that almost everyone guessed correctly too.

[James Lugo]

Originally Posted by dysenterygary

Thanks for the shootout! Interesting that almost everyone guessed correctly too.

I know. I own and use both. I only listened to vocal takes but 1 sounded brighter and more modern to me. Who cares they are both great.

[DirtyMan]

I did not listen to the files but from reading the responses it seems it doesnt matter really what 87 you buy they are interchangeable via minor eq tweaks at most

[guitarmax_99]

Originally Posted by James Lugo

I know. I own and use both. I only listened to vocal takes but 1 sounded brighter and more modern to me. Who cares they are both great.

To my ears they are pretty similar, although I do hear some differences in the higher frequencies. I agree with you though, both are lovely (and very usable!).

[Shannon Adkins]

Don't know which is which, but on both the guitars I like mic 1 better. It definitely had more high freq info....in a good way.
As for the vocal, I'd have to hear them in a mix for context.
Both mics sound great though and the guitar playing is nice too!

[Shannon Adkins]

Oh, I just read through the thread and saw you've already released the results.
Well, I guess if I ever go after a U87 it'll have to be a vintage one

[MichaelAngelo]

Originally Posted by Shannon Adkins

Oh, I just read through the thread and saw you've already released the results.
Well, I guess if I ever go after a U87 it'll have to be a vintage one

I have to tell you on the vocal,.. the vintage wins hands down for me.. I own 4 vintage 87's and I really like them.. Just a note,... try recapping the 2 electrolitics on the vintage one, it really does make a difference.. The new one is OK for very low level stuff, and I thought the new one did good on AC GTR.. good high frequency detail...

[vincentvangogo]

I reckon

Mic 1 = U87

Mic 2 = U87ai

[The Listener]

Ha, so the U87 does indeed sound more balanced and smoother than the newer version and it was audible even on earbuds, it's no myth.

Anyway - they are close and with a bit of EQ it can be changed...

[James Lugo]

Originally Posted by The Listener

Ha, so the U87 does indeed sound more balanced and smoother than the newer version and it was audible even on earbuds, it's no myth.

Anyway - they are close and with a bit of EQ it can be changed...

See to me on the vocals it was the opposite, the old one sounded brighter and a hair spitty but again with a touch of eq they could be shaped the same. IMO this whole demo really proves that it's a matter of taste because so many people actually preferred the new ai over the "Vintage" one. Honestly to me if you're a remotely skilled engineer and you can't get an old 87 or new ai 87 to work on most application you may wanna rethink things. With all the bashing and BS you read on here I bet 87s are on more records then 47s and 67s combined. I've been mixing a metal record this week that I tracked using my ai through my 1073 and a touch of 1176, the vocal sounds perfect in the mix to me. Punchy and clear yet sunken in just right.

[dibravibra]

Originally Posted by guitarmax_99

Drum Roll Please!!!

... and the results:

Mic 1 = U87

Mic 2 = U87ai

Thanks to all who commented on these files. I hope folks found this test helpful and educational.

Are you sure :-)

[guitarmax_99]

Originally Posted by dibravibra

Are you sure :-)

I'm sure which mic is which! As for which one you prefer, that is another matter altogether. I don't think there are any "right" or "wrong" answers in that regard - ultimately, there is only personal preference. I posted this test because I thought it might contribute to the general level of knowledge about these two mics (and shed some light on the differences between the two). I'm actually surprised that no one had posted a shootout like this one to date. Well, now it exists, and the files are here for all to hear. I hope this helps the pros (who have strong opinions about which mic they prefer) as well as the noobs who have never had a chance to sample either the U87 or U87ai.

Originally Posted by DirtyMan

I did not listen to the files but from reading the responses it seems it doesnt matter really what 87 you buy they are interchangeable via minor eq tweaks at most

Why not listen to the files and hear for yourself what they sound like? Personally, I'll trust my own ears when it comes to sound (and not take someone else's word for it!)

[Shannon Adkins]

Originally Posted by guitarmax_99

I'm sure which mic is which! As for which one you prefer, that is another matter altogether. I don't think there are any "right" or "wrong" answers in that regard - ultimately, there is only personal preference. I posted this test because I thought it might contribute to the general level of knowledge about these two mics (and shed some light on the differences between the two). I'm actually surprised that no one had posted a shootout like this one to date. Well, now it exists, and the files are here for all to hear. I hope this helps the pros (who have strong opinions about which mic they prefer) as well as the noobs who have never had a chance to sample either the U87 or U87ai.




Why not listen to the files and hear for yourself what they sound like? Personally, I'll trust my own ears when it comes to sound (and not take someone else's word for it!)

I want to personally thank you for this shootout. It's been very educational for me

[gideon352]

Originally Posted by James Lugo

See to me on the vocals it was the opposite, the old one sounded brighter and a hair spitty but again with a touch of eq they could be shaped the same. IMO this whole demo really proves that it's a matter of taste because so many people actually preferred the new ai over the "Vintage" one. Honestly to me if you're a remotely skilled engineer and you can't get an old 87 or new ai 87 to work on most application you may wanna rethink things. With all the bashing and BS you read on here I bet 87s are on more records then 47s and 67s combined. I've been mixing a metal record this week that I tracked using my ai through my 1073 and a touch of 1176, the vocal sounds perfect in the mix to me. Punchy and clear yet sunken in just right.

Firstly, thanks for doing the shootout! Great job!


Secondly (to James), I usually agree with you on most things, but we disagree here. It's ok, we're just hearing things differently.

This is one of the first obvious shootouts I've heard on gearslutz where you can listen to the files and understand what the arguments have been about (for years) regarding these two particular microphones.

Keep in mind that this is not coming from a "they both work" objection. Yes, they both do sound good. The question here is preference and why we prefer what we do.

I think the consensus is that the Ai does not sound as even in the high end (compared to the older microphone). In fact, the microphone is doing something in the high end that does not flatter the source (although it may be intended to). To this, I agree.

I would even go as far as to say that what is going on in the high end of the Ai (that "quality") is what most recordists do not enjoy about lower cost Chinese microphones.

I do not understand at all when you say that the older mic sounds "brighter." I'm assuming that you mean that the high end is more pronounced.
I'm just not hearing that (hence, the disagreement).
However, like I said, it's ok. We all hear things differently.

[guitarmax_99]

Originally Posted by gideon352

Firstly, thanks for doing the shootout! Great job!

You're welcome! :-)

Originally Posted by gideon352

This is one of the first obvious shootouts I've heard on gearslutz where you can listen to the files and understand what the arguments have been about (for years) regarding these two particular microphones.

I know you didn't intend this comment for me, but I take it as high praise (for the methodology used). I'm really glad this test has proven to be of value.

Originally Posted by gideon352

Keep in mind that this is not coming from a "they both work" objection. Yes, they both do sound good. The question here is preference and why we prefer what we do.

I think the consensus is that the Ai does not sound as even in the high end (compared to the older microphone). In fact, the microphone is doing something in the high end that does not flatter the source (although it may be intended to). To this, I agree.

I would even go as far as to say that what is going on in the high end of the Ai (that "quality") is what most recordists do not enjoy about lower cost Chinese microphones.

I do not understand at all when you say that the older mic sounds "brighter." I'm assuming that you mean that the high end is more pronounced.
I'm just not hearing that (hence, the disagreement).
However, like I said, it's ok. We all hear things differently.

"Brightness" seems to be a bit of a broad/sweeping term - and it may not be very helpful in terms of fully describing what folks are hearing. It would be interesting to see a graphical representation of where the actual high end peaks are in these samples (and thus, between these two microphones). Is there anyone out there who has the software and would care to contribute? Anyway, I think some of the disagreement about what people are hearing comes from not really being able to adequately put a finger on exactly what it is we are trying to describe.

[guitarmax_99]

Below is a frequency graph of two of the three shootout clips (vocal and strummed guitar). Thanks to my buddy for whipping this up for me (he's the guy who actually owns the U87 in this test). This might shed some light on things.