Play back of mixed CD not same as when mixing?

[woods]

I got16 tracks coming off HD24. Mixing on Mackie.

Got 1176 on vocal ch insert. 1176 on kick ch insert. LA4 on bass ch insert. 160x on snare ch insert. 1178 on stereo over heads ch inserts. Got 6 gtr channels subbed to two. Got the 4 drum channels subbed to two. Mixing like that.

Mix everything nice with monitors - sounds pretty good. Got the main outs from Mackie running into HEDD and then iinto Masterlink.

Record the mix into Masterlink then burn a CD.

The CD sounds nothing like the mix on the monitors before recording on the MAsterlink. The bass is much mich louder, the vocals are much much louder. The piano hardly comes thru at all.

Wonder what's going on?

Thanks

Woods

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by woods

I got16 tracks coming off HD24. Mixing on Mackie.

Got 1176 on vocal ch insert. 1176 on kick ch insert. LA4 on bass ch insert. 160x on snare ch insert. 1178 on stereo over heads ch inserts. Got 6 gtr channels subbed to two. Got the 4 drum channels subbed to two. Mixing like that.

Mix everything nice with monitors - sounds pretty good. Got the main outs from Mackie running into HEDD and then iinto Masterlink.

Record the mix into Masterlink then burn a CD.

The CD sounds nothing like the mix on the monitors before recording on the MAsterlink. The bass is much mich louder, the vocals are much much louder. The piano hardly comes thru at all.

Wonder what's going on?

Thanks

Woods

Are you monitoring off the MAsterlink as you are laying the mix down on it?

Or are you monitoring straight off the board?

[woods]

Straight off the board. But would this make that much difference in levels?

How can you monitor directly off the Masterlink when mixing? I do have the Masterlink going to the stereo tape ins on the Mackie for playback of the masterlink.

[5down1up]

set the masterlink to record mode and monitor the tape in instead of the main mix on your board .

[3rd world order]

mackie 32/8? get rid of it ASAP... that board will not pass signal without doing irreparable damage to it.

been there, done that, got the scars to prove it.

swap out the 32/8 for a speck xtramix and you'll experience audio again.

and monitor thru the masterlink, like those above said.

[Mastering101]

thats last thing you want to do is monitor from the masterlink even if its going to the board..maybe if your summing its on the board somewhere ..how many db louder would you say these trouble tracks?

[3rd world order]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

thats last thing you want to do is monitor from the masterlink even if its going to the board..maybe if your summing its on the board somewhere ..how many db louder would you say these trouble tracks?

this sounds nutty to me... why wouldn't you wanna monitor off your final destination?

i could see using a better D/A for the masterlink.. but dont expect it to be transparent. geez.

[wwittman]

IF the mix sounds good coming out of the Mackie, then obviously the Mackie is not at fault.

If the mix sounds bad after the HEDD and Masterlink, then either the HEDD or Masterlink IS at fault.

this is basic troubleshooting.

Are you certain that the HEDD and Masterlink are working properly?

It's possible you just don't like the sound of the Masterlink or of the HEDD.

Have you tried the Masterlink without HEDD?
or
Can you try mixing to something else as an experiment?
Can you borrow a CD recorder?

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

this sounds nutty to me... why wouldn't you wanna monitor off your final destination?

i could see using a better D/A for the masterlink.. but dont expect it to be transparent. geez.

because i don't fine it accurate at all.

[Bat Head Sound]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

because i don't fine it accurate at all.

Whether or not it's accurate doesn't amount to a hill of beans . The fact of the matter is that you're mixing TO it. If you don't know how it is affecting your mix, then you're mixing in vain. However, if you are monitoring from your 2-track recording device, you have a better idea of how your mix will sound coming off it.

On a side note, does the mix only sound bad coming off the Masterlink? Have you tried playing a cd on other players? It might be the D/A converters that are causing your mixes to be off.

[5down1up]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

mackie 32/8? get rid of it ASAP... that board will not pass signal without doing irreparable damage to it

[woods]

The tones or sounds are not bad - it's the levels - the mix is changed. As I said before some channels are much louder after two track.

These are just rough mixes done on the Mackie 1604 - which really is just being used as a monitor mixer during tracking. The final mixes will be done on a Ghost32.

On the Mackie what button do you press to monitor from the tape deck (masterlink)? In the Control Room Source section there are 4 buttons - (Tape. Sub 1-2. Sub 3-4. and Main Mix). Maybe I should just have the tape button pressed. But when this is pressed I can't hear the fades I do with the master fader.

[cap217]

The settings on the HEDD can have a lot to do with the sound... I usually make 3 mixes running through the HEDD after an SSL. Then pick the next day, the HEDD can do so many great things and so much damage to a mix... louder, fuzzy, tape-ish, lots of stuff.... Next is the masterlink. I run back into PT but the masterlink has a lot of internal processing.... make sure thats all clear. But I find it odd that your Converter cost more than your mixer..... look into that!!!!

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by Bat Head Sound

Whether or not it's accurate doesn't amount to a hill of beans . The fact of the matter is that you're mixing TO it. If you don't know how it is affecting your mix, then you're mixing in vain. However, if you are monitoring from your 2-track recording device, you have a better idea of how your mix will sound coming off it.

On a side note, does the mix only sound bad coming off the Masterlink? Have you tried playing a cd on other players? It might be the D/A converters that are causing your mixes to be off.

i think the converters on the masterlink suck ..i use it digital and even the mix that comes out of the masterlink digital to my rosetta 800 is not accurate mix. how can this not amount to a hill of beans? i monitor from my board and record to the masterlink and its 100% accurate mix and it will burn that mix fine but to monitor from it no way

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

because i don't fine it accurate at all.

The point is to monitor after the conversion.


That way you can really hear what is going down.


I do agree the Masterlink D/A's are less than stellar.


What Woods should do is with the Hedd use the A/D and D/A simultaneously.


A/D into the Masterlink.


The HEDD D/A after to monitor the mix(if its the same sample rate).


When i had one i was pretty sure you could do it.

[Bat Head Sound]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

i think the converters on the masterlink suck ..i use it digital and even the mix that comes out of the masterlink digital to my rosetta 800 is not accurate mix. how can this not amount to a hill of beans? i monitor from my board and record to the masterlink and its 100% accurate mix and it will burn that mix fine but to monitor from it no way

Does the mix sound fine on other systems?

[Winey]

Originally Posted by 3rd world order

mackie 32/8? get rid of it ASAP... that board will not pass signal without doing irreparable damage to it.

Total BS. I've heard mixes on Mackies that sound great.
It's all about the engineer my friend.

[Dave Peck]

..... wait a minute.... from the way you describe the symptom, some specific tracks getting lots louder or quieter somewhere between listening to your mix at the board and listening to the playback after recording..... is there a chance that, in addition to routing all faders to L/R mix, you also have some of these signals routed to some of the subgroups or some of the returns, that may be getting sent to your speaker outs on the board but NOT to the L/R recording outs?? This would cause a huge difference between the mix you hear at the board and the mix that is getting sent to the recorder.

DP

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by Bat Head Sound

Does the mix sound fine on other systems?

yes, but if theres a problem its usually something i did..lol....

[joelpatterson]

I always monitor out of the back of the CD burner I am burning the master CD to, an HHB 830 Plus since you asked. That seems like the most basic, primitive common sense: you need to hear how the CD burner hears it. That's what it "sounds" like.

[Bat Head Sound]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

yes, but if theres a problem its usually something i did..lol....

Gotcha In your case, it does amount to a hill of beans Maybe you should look into getting a different set of D/A converters. However, your A/D converters are still going to affect the mix. Normally it is a good idea to monitor after that so that you can see just how much your mix has been affected.

[Mastering101]

Originally Posted by Bat Head Sound

Gotcha In your case, it does amount to a hill of beans Maybe you should look into getting a different set of D/A converters. However, your A/D converters are still going to affect the mix. Normally it is a good idea to monitor after that so that you can see just how much your mix has been affected.

well no kidding , i'll trust my apogee's before i trust a masterlink.

[woods]

Don't laugh - the problem was the main mix button, the sub1-2, the sub 3-4, and the tape button were all down simultaneously.

Thrill - how can I use the HEDD for DA cinversion at the same time as AD conversion into the Masterlink?

Thanks
to all

Woods

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by woods

Don't laugh - the problem was the main mix button, the sub1-2, the sub 3-4, and the tape button were all down simultaneously.

Thrill - how can I use the HEDD for DA cinversion at the same time as AD conversion into the Masterlink?

Thanks
to all

Woods

Woods its been a while(2 years i think) since i've used one but its one of the process modes that permits it as both the A/D and D/A for the masterlink.

[3rd world order]

Originally Posted by woods

how can I use the HEDD for DA cinversion at the same time as AD conversion into the Masterlink?

it's easy...

2mix out of mackie > HEDD A/D (process in) > s/pdif into masterlink

masterlink s/pdif out > HEDD D/A > monitors

you can also switch the HEDD into "analog" mode and hear directly from it.. which should do essentially the same thing as going thru the masterlink...

[Bat Head Sound]

Originally Posted by effectsnut

well no kidding , i'll trust my apogee's before i trust a masterlink.

So you don't find the apogees to be accurate either?