Clicky Hi-Hat in Overheads

[tensensi]

I'm having a problem with some overheads I recorded.

Everything sounds great except for the hi-hats. When the hats come in, sometimes they are very "clicky" when they attack. Almost sounds like a clip, but I don't think they are as I have them peaking at -14 in Logic. And, everything else sounds good in the OH, even parts that are way louder.

I was using a pair of ATM450s in ORTF over the drummer's right shoulder angled down into the kit.

So, 2 questions for you slutz:

1. Any ideas as to why this happened and any suggestions so I can avoid it in the future? Did I place the OH too close to the kit? They were about 4 feet from the hi-hat. Is it a phase issue? Although the click is still there when I solo one OH.

2. Any recommendations on how I can fix this now? I've been trying to notch out the offending frequencies, but can't seem to remedy it. Any other techniques?

Besos.

[RCM - Ronan]

That is a tough one. It very likely could be that clicky is the sound of the performance.

If EQ is not fixing it, one other trick to try is to use a 3 band multi-band compressor, but bypass the high and low and try to narrow the middle band in to just the bad clicky part and compress only that part of the frequency spectrum. It will not make it go away but might make it less annoying.

[ears2thesky]

Sounds like the hats themselves.
Recording loud rock sometimes reveals issues that were less noticeable live. I have a pair of Meinl Amun 13" hats that I will occasionally substitute for the heavy, clangy, models that some drummers bring in.
Sometimes repositioning (or eliminating) the hat-side overhead can help. You might be getting enough hat in the other mics (especially snare) to use just one or none at all ( maybe close-mic the ride).

Also: if the sticks being used are nylon-tipped, try wood-tipped instead.

[Yummerz]

i've run into this and luckily had a dedicated hat mic, where i could just notch out the offender.

[tensensi]

Thanks for all the suggestions. I'll try some of the techniques mentioned, and file some of the "drummer-related" stuff in my mind for next time. Much appreciated.

And Ronan - you are my hero, dude! Thx for all the great stuff you post.

[dkelley]

Originally Posted by Yummerz

i've run into this and luckily had a dedicated hat mic, where i could just notch out the offender.

but that doesn't remove it from the overheads.... or do you notch it from there also (which ought to negatively impact the remaining cymbals)?

[joeq]

Originally Posted by tensensi

Everything sounds great except for the hi-hats.

I am having a hard time sonically 'visualizing' what exactly you mean by your description of the sound. 'Clicky' makes me think the drummer is pressing the hats really tight with his foot or something? ... would it be possible to post a clip?

If everything sounds great "except", I would have to assume that's how the hi-hats actually sound in the room. Notching out certain frequencies, even if that "gets it" will probably adversely effect the rest of your overhead sound which currently stands at 'great'.

if you have a dedicated hat mic, you could try some phase/nudging tricks with it to see if you can cancel something out

Sometimes, when weird things happen in tracking, and you are stuck with them, the best thing you can do is 'go with it' and use the sound to your advantage by approaching the mix in a different way. Make the weird sound a feature rather than a bug.

I think the expression is "make a virtue out of necessity"

[fantomas]

Multiband compression only in the offending area to tame the attack like Ronan said.

If that doesnt work i have used the waves trans x sometimes wideband, sometimes multiband or the sonnox transmod, to attenuate the clicky attack.
You just automate the plug in when the offending part is being played to not mess with the sound in the parts where there is no hihat.

[travisbrown]

I get this a lot with live recordings where the drummer feels like he should be wailing on the hats.

1. First I try notching out the ugly sound. The type of sound you are describing it probably pretty narrow in its peak.
2. Then I try RCM's suggestion of a MB comp, which is really just dynamic notching.
3. Sometimes I'll try ducking it keyed to a heavily filtered track that focusses on the hat.

Not much help after the fact, but I bought a set of the Sabian HH EQ hats a while ago, and they are a dream to record. First off, they are very dry with no bell. Second is they have four slots cut out of the bottom cymbal. This allows them to close much faster and without that whhhoooop of air that sometimes happens with harder pedalling on fully open hats. They never sound tubby.

I used to usually discard the hat track and leave it to OH and snare bleed unless the HH was a feature element because they to me always sounded so doggy. Now I'm back to specifically mixing them with these hats.

[BillSimpkins]

Was the drummer using nylon tips?

[Ernest Buckley]

Originally Posted by tensensi

1. Any ideas as to why this happened and any suggestions so I can avoid it in the future? Did I place the OH too close to the kit? They were about 4 feet from the hi-hat. Is it a phase issue? Although the click is still there when I solo one OH.

Its the drummer.

Originally Posted by tensensi

2. Any recommendations on how I can fix this now? I've been trying to notch out the offending frequencies, but can't seem to remedy it. Any other techniques?

Use another drummer.

[fastlanestoner]

I like a carefully dialed-in deesser in that situation. I've come across a few drummers that produce a result like this.

Usually because of medium-large HH cymbal size

[robstercraw]

If i get something to mix that has a really bad part or something i just cant fix, i make it stand out. So it sounds like it was on purpose. Ive found that trying to hide some things only makes it more obvious something was screwed up. Just find a way to make it part of the song and convince everyone thats what you were going for and that it sounds kick ace!!