substitute sub

joeq · 2nd September 2003

I have been mixing on my Genelec 1030's and I have been pretty happy with the results until recently when I listened to some of my mixes on The Bigs. There were a number of surprises in the really low end and it's making me think I need a subwoofer. The recommended sub for these speakers is kind of pricey, and of course their cheaper one is only recommended for the 1029s.

Can I get away with a substitute subwoofer? Does anybody do this? Can I mix brands? even a consumer sub?

Would something be better than nothing in this area?

Any tips on other methods to get control of the very low end without a sub?

Nutmeg II. · 2nd September 2003

Why bother with a sub when you have The Bigs?!?
Mix on the Nearfield and switche to The Bigs to check lowend.

Rick Sutton · 2nd September 2003

joeq,
I use Genelec 1031's with a Tannoy powered 15" sub. Don't really care for the sound or the price on the genelec subs. I've tried several combinations and for me the best was running the 1031's full range and bringing the sub up just enough to reinforce the deep bottom that the 1031's lack. The Tannoy has a good set of active controls to tailor its volume and low pass to suit the job at hand. I still check the mixes on larger and smaller monitors in my control room and walk around the room to get a different feel of the bottom. I have fewer low end surpises than I used to. best regards, Rick

De chromium cob · 2nd September 2003

Those Tannoy subs leave alot to be desired as far as I'm concerned...I use Pro-Ac Studio 100s and recently upgraded my sub from the Tannoy to a Velodyne HGS-18II...Its like going from a Yugo to a Ferrari. Flat down to 15Hz and comes with a remote control that allows you to switch just the sub in and out. I dont know how I mixed 'low end blind' for so long, but I'm much happier now! I'd highly recommend the servo-driven Velodynes (like the HGS) but theyre not cheap(worth every penny though).

thethrillfactor · 2nd September 2003

Setting up a sub to work with a pair of near fields is a science itself. Personally i've never heard a system done right. Location in the room and crossover points are crucial. I mostly advise people against it and suggest to get a bigger speaker setup to work as one.

If you want to buy a sub anyway go with a REL. Velodynes are also nice as well.

Nutmeg II. · 2nd September 2003

Double check the low end when you use subs! Most people tend to get shy with bass wile mixing with subs!

joeq · 2nd September 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by Nutmeg II.
Why bother with a sub when you have The Bigs?!?
Mix on the Nearfield and switche to The Bigs to check lowend.

sorry I wasn't clear-

all I have is the Genelecs- I brought my mixes to a place that had some big speakers and listened to them there. That's when I heard variations in my low end that I previously was unaware of.

What I need is a way to check my mixes without driving to another studio.

thethrillfactor · 2nd September 2003

Quote:

Originally posted by joeq
sorry I wasn't clear-
What I need is a way to check my mixes without driving to another studio.

Sounds like problems with the acoustics more than a sub issue.

lucey · 2nd September 2003

Sorry to say it... but I'd sell the Genelecs and get a pair of Adam S3A's.

I used to have BM6A's with their sub, which was full of great tweaking features blah, blah .. and the S3A's have such better low end. Tight and deep. Plus they're better in the mids, highs and imaging than any Genelecs under $40,000.

The S3A's are taking some time to get used to but they do indeed rule ... and the lows are comparatively non-interacitve with the room due to the tightness.

box · 12th October 2004

Setting up a sub to work with a pair of near fields is a science itself. Personally i've never heard a system done right. Location in the room and crossover points are crucial. I mostly advise people against it and suggest to get a bigger speaker setup to work as one.

If you want to buy a sub anyway go with a REL. Velodynes are also nice as well.

what about doing 5.1? dont you need a .1

LumenStudio · 12th October 2004

I have a REL Strata III, it helped me produce much more accurate mixes. I can't believe more people don't rave about these subs (REL).

Also, It seems these subs are made to work as good as you can get in a small room.

Cheers,
Lumen

Prickstein · 12th October 2004

Bought a "Welling" consumer sub at a second hand bargain store to complement my NS-10's and Bryston 2b.
My mixes have improved tenfold!

lamp · 12th October 2004

I have a Velodyne CHT 10 in my room, which is about 22x16 and it works very well. The mains are Polk Monitor 10's and a Haffler P3000. I do the final bass check in my car most of the time.

Some of you guys are gonna think Im nuts, but the above setup is really very nice. A friend has the adams S3A's which are great, but Im happy with my budjet setup.

2nd September 2003	#1
joeq Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New York Posts: 9,246 Thread Starter	substitute sub I have been mixing on my Genelec 1030's and I have been pretty happy with the results until recently when I listened to some of my mixes on The Bigs. There were a number of surprises in the really low end and it's making me think I need a subwoofer. The recommended sub for these speakers is kind of pricey, and of course their cheaper one is only recommended for the 1029s. Can I get away with a substitute subwoofer? Does anybody do this? Can I mix brands? even a consumer sub? Would something be better than nothing in this area? Any tips on other methods to get control of the very low end without a sub?

2nd September 2003	#2
Nutmeg II. Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: GEARmany Posts: 985	Why bother with a sub when you have The Bigs?!? Mix on the Nearfield and switche to The Bigs to check lowend. __________________ "Any recording engineer who uses a tube U47 is obviously not a professional" Stephan Temmer 1979

2nd September 2003	#4
De chromium cob Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Western North Carolina Posts: 3,655	Those Tannoy subs leave alot to be desired as far as I'm concerned...I use Pro-Ac Studio 100s and recently upgraded my sub from the Tannoy to a Velodyne HGS-18II...Its like going from a Yugo to a Ferrari. Flat down to 15Hz and comes with a remote control that allows you to switch just the sub in and out. I dont know how I mixed 'low end blind' for so long, but I'm much happier now! I'd highly recommend the servo-driven Velodynes (like the HGS) but theyre not cheap(worth every penny though). __________________ "I know that most men, including those at ease with problems of the greatest complexity, can seldom accept even the simplest and most obvious truth if it be such as would oblige them to admit the falsity of conclusions which they have delighted in explaining to colleagues, which they have proudly taught to others, and which they have woven, thread by thread, into the fabric of their lives." Tolstoy Scott Benson Blue Ridge Mastering

2nd September 2003	#9
lucey Gear Guru Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Columbus, Ohio Posts: 12,365	Sorry to say it... but I'd sell the Genelecs and get a pair of Adam S3A's. I used to have BM6A's with their sub, which was full of great tweaking features blah, blah .. and the S3A's have such better low end. Tight and deep. Plus they're better in the mids, highs and imaging than any Genelecs under $40,000. The S3A's are taking some time to get used to but they do indeed rule ... and the lows are comparatively non-interacitve with the room due to the tightness. __________________ brian lucey magic garden mastering The Shins, Dr. John, The Black Keys, OAR, David Lynch, Sami Yusuf, moe.

12th October 2004	#11
LumenStudio Gear addict Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Jersey Posts: 402	I have a REL Strata III, it helped me produce much more accurate mixes. I can't believe more people don't rave about these subs (REL). Also, It seems these subs are made to work as good as you can get in a small room. Cheers, Lumen __________________ My opinion may change at any time without notification.

2nd September 2003	#3
Rick Sutton Lives for gear Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Atascadero, CA Posts: 3,860	joeq, I use Genelec 1031's with a Tannoy powered 15" sub. Don't really care for the sound or the price on the genelec subs. I've tried several combinations and for me the best was running the 1031's full range and bringing the sub up just enough to reinforce the deep bottom that the 1031's lack. The Tannoy has a good set of active controls to tailor its volume and low pass to suit the job at hand. I still check the mixes on larger and smaller monitors in my control room and walk around the room to get a different feel of the bottom. I have fewer low end surpises than I used to. best regards, Rick

2nd September 2003	#5
thethrillfactor Gear Guru Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: New York City Posts: 14,176	Setting up a sub to work with a pair of near fields is a science itself. Personally i've never heard a system done right. Location in the room and crossover points are crucial. I mostly advise people against it and suggest to get a bigger speaker setup to work as one. If you want to buy a sub anyway go with a REL. Velodynes are also nice as well.

12th October 2004	#10
box Gear nut Join Date: Jan 2003 Posts: 136	Setting up a sub to work with a pair of near fields is a science itself. Personally i've never heard a system done right. Location in the room and crossover points are crucial. I mostly advise people against it and suggest to get a bigger speaker setup to work as one. If you want to buy a sub anyway go with a REL. Velodynes are also nice as well. what about doing 5.1? dont you need a .1

12th October 2004	#12
Prickstein Gear addict Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Gold Coast, Australia Posts: 462	Bought a "Welling" consumer sub at a second hand bargain store to complement my NS-10's and Bryston 2b. My mixes have improved tenfold!

12th October 2004	#13
lamp Gear nut Join Date: May 2003 Location: usa Posts: 138	I have a Velodyne CHT 10 in my room, which is about 22x16 and it works very well. The mains are Polk Monitor 10's and a Haffler P3000. I do the final bass check in my car most of the time. Some of you guys are gonna think Im nuts, but the above setup is really very nice. A friend has the adams S3A's which are great, but Im happy with my budjet setup.

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