Need serious help and advice from experienced engineers

[cannibalbritney]

ok im losing my mind and I keep changing it every day.

alot of things fell through this last week and I'm starting to rethink what i should do to maximize myself for the least amount of buck.

here's the dilema.

a friend of mine has a serious HD3 studio with... NEUMANN U87

(MICS) ---- NEUMANN TLM103, (2) vintage SENNHEISER 421MD,(5) SENNHEISER 421MDII, SENNHEISER E835, (2) AKG 414, (2) AKG D112, (2) AKG C1000S, OKTAVA ML52 RIBBON, vintage SHURE SM33 RIBBON, SHURE BETA52, (2) SHURE SM81, (3) SHURE BETA56, (2) SHURE BETA57, (4) SHURE SM57, (3) SHURE SM58, CAD E200, PEAVEY PVM38, EV RE15

(EQ'S)---vintage API 550 EQ,vintage API 550A EQ, vintage NEVE 1066 EQ, vintage NEVE 1073 EQ, (2) vintage NEVE 33122a EQ, (2) vintage ADM 1540 EQ, vintage ASHLEY SC-66 EQ, vintage ORBAN 672a EQ, vintage ORBAN 622b EQ, FOCUSRITE GREEN EQ,AVALON VT 747 EQ

(MIC PRE'S + DYNAMICS)-----
vintage NEVE 1066 MIC PREvintage NEVE 1073 MIC PRE(2) vintage NEVE 33122a MIC PRE(6) vintage ADM 780 MIC PREFOCUSRITE RED 7 MIC PRE2) FOCUSRITE PLATINUM 8 CHANNEL MIC PREDT VTP1 MIC PREvintage DBX 160 COMPRESSOR
vintage DBX 162 COMPRESSOR(2) DBX 160X COMPRESSORDBX 160XT COMPRESSOREMPIRICAL LABS DISTRESSOR EL8AVALON VT 747 TUBE COMPRESSORFOCUSRITE RED 7 COMPRESSORKLARK TEKNIK COMPRESSOR/LIMITERPRESONUS ACP88 COMPRESSORPRESONUS BLUE TUBE COMPRESSORART VLA COMPRESSOR/LIMITERALESIS 440 COMPRESSOR/LIMITER(5) ALESIS 3630 COMPRESSORALESIS MICRO LIMITER(2) BEHRINGER 4 CHANNEL MULTIGATESALESIS MICRO GATEBEHRINGER COMPOSER(2) BBE 262 SONIC MAXIMIZEr(2) ROCKTRON HUSH II NRSALESIS MICRO ENHANCER
EXR EXCITER


long story short thats not even a 1/3 of what he has. mulit-effects vocal processors etc etc.

now I have a 002 and a crappy mac laptop, behringer truth active monitors, and a monster avs2000 power conditioner. a soldano slo100, and some standard basic mics...

now I plan to write all my scratch tracks ideas etc at home on my 002 and re-record them in his studio (for a small fee ofcourse) with all his gear using my amp and my drumkit/cymbals.

now, i have 5000 dollars to upgrade my setup... what would maximize it the best that will completely benefit me in my situation. in other words what the hell should i do, I have had so many newbies and 18 year olds who went to school for 3 -5 months telling me a million things to do, but truth is, they have NO EXPERIENCE so i cant take any of it to heart.

PLEASE HELP ME

Sorry for the long post, but I appreciate the time you took to read it.

[Matti]

At Your home studio maybe invest for the best
monitoring (incl. acoustics) You think is reasonable for
Your purposes and then a good pair/set of decent mics and pres´
for some tracking or vocals.
So You could edit and pre-mix at Your home with time
and confidence.
Matti

[Rick Sutton]

I've read your post twice trying to figure out what your question/situation is. Are you putting down ideas at home but all the actual recording will take place at your friends place? That is how I read it. If that is the case don't put any more money into your recording setup. Concentrate on the songs and if you gotta spend some money put it into the instruments that you'll use when you do the recording. Or put it toward hiring some good musicians to help you realize your songs in the final recording.
Your PT system, a couple of mics...thats enough to do prep work. It's a hell of a lot more than most people use to prep studio sessions.
If I misunderstood your question I apologize. But that's definitly my advice if I got your situation right. And in case your wondering I'm not just out of school.

[True North]

Hey Cannibal,

I am not clear on exactly what your needs are or where you are at. If you are not using any of your home studio recorded tracks than why would need to upgrade anything?

But if you are just budding SLUT and just want better gear, man have you come to the right place!

Monitoring and room conditioning are pretty important and I would start by doing some research in those areas. You may want to look at Dynaudio's , Genelecs used on Ebay. Ethan maker or Real traps roams this site, he would be great to talk about acoustics.

After that I would focus on getting a good condensor mic - Something that is fairly flexible and that you can use on many different applications. Some people around seem to like to the performance to price factor on a Soundelux U195 (Under $1000).

I would look at some decent quality, 4 channel solid state mic pres - there are obviously a ton of options; 4 x API 512 (in a lunchbox), API 3124 ($2100 to $2200) Vintech, Wunder Audio PA4, Focusrite ISA428. Check around there are lots of options here.

It would probably help if you explained your needs a little better. What type of music do you record? What environment are you recording it in (Bathroom, Bedroom, Basement etc..)? What instruments are you recording at home? Do you plan on using your recordings for release to the public etc.. ?


Good luck in your search.

[NickNeedsWork]

That's some serious gear. I'd get a few 57's and cheap pre's for the home studio and dump every last dollar into tracking, mixing, and mastering.

[cannibalbritney]

well put it this way, even though he has all that stuff, he isnt going to do anything except engineer for me, setup mics and record it, and im going to be charged for the time i spend there... (approx 30 an hour even though he charges 65-70 an hour). so if i edit/mix there etc. im gonna have to pay him for the studio time, so im thinking what would save me the most money. should i bother with a better computer/plugins/monitors/acoustics etc, or should i just say screw it and do everything at his studio.

[YZ!]

So both you and your friend with the nice studio have Pro Tools?

Then I'd suggest you invest in better monitoring and acoustics for your room; use your friend's studio for tracking, go back home for editing, then mix in the studio.

At the end you will have gained knowledge from tracking and mixing in a good studio, and if you have invested in better monitoring and acoustics you will also have the benefit of using the raw tracks and the studio mixes as a means for further learning.

just my 2 cents.

[Rick Sutton]

I see what your up to. OK. If you decide to track some of the parts at home, assuming that you have a functioning PT system that is compatible with the studio, then concentrate on one or two channels of mic pres and one or two mics. The pres can be fairly universal, say a couple of channels of Tab Funkenwork pres or API will do the trick. Something solid, fancy isn't important. EQ is not important. Mics are more specific to what kind of stuff you'll be recording. Cut the tracks flat with no processing other than the needed low cut (if your pre has that).
I work with several regular clients exactly this way and it is a very good approach.
Monitoring is important, but in this scenario headphones are all you really need. If your room stinks, then by all means improve on that. That's my take on it. Cheers and good luck ( I still say that money into musical instruments is always a good thing too!)

[cannibalbritney]

Originally Posted by YZ!

So both you and your friend with the nice studio have Pro Tools?

Then I'd suggest you invest in better monitoring and acoustics for your room; use your friend's studio for tracking, go back home for editing, then mix in the studio.

At the end you will have gained knowledge from tracking and mixing in a good studio, and if you have invested in better monitoring and acoustics you will also have the benefit of using the raw tracks and the studio mixes as a means for further learning.

just my 2 cents.

ok so you're sayin put everything into monitoring editing and mixing... what would you say i should get to do that... plugins, hardware etc... thats also where i am lost.

[Rick Sutton]

Originally Posted by cannibalbritney

ok so you're sayin put everything into monitoring editing and mixing... what would you say i should get to do that... plugins, hardware etc... thats also where i am lost.

I think everybody is telling you to mix at the studio. As long as you are not processing the tracks at home the monitoring is really there to assist you musically and keep you from doing anything that is difficult to repair at the studio. Your money will be used up quick enough with a decent mic/pre chain or two and possibly some quick room treatment. My advice is don't over think it. Keep it simple and go with quality. That means hardware. Forget plugs and processing.

[Jose Mrochek]

Originally Posted by Rick Sutton

( I still say that money into musical instruments is always a good thing too!)

My view also. If you are mainly a musician concentrate on your side of the glass. Don´t think that you will get the same results as your experienced friend engineer just because you have API pre´s or the likes. If you are a musician focus on that, it´s complicated enough. Or save that money to have an even more experienced engineer mix the project and learn to, or go the extra mile and record a single or two in a world class facility and have fun.

If you plan to convert your home studio in a business then that´s a different story.

[cannibalbritney]

ok so rather than putting 3 grand into my own setup, you're sayin to just give it to him to do the mixing as well, as opposed to getting plugs monitors and computer to do at home and get practice on etc...

[NickNeedsWork]

If I had 5 grand to do an record I'd pay someone else to push faders and turn knobs. I get headaches when I try to do everything at once. If you plan on doing any future mixing at home and have a decent computer with PT LE I'd drop $800 on Waves Gold Bundle Native. I don't care what people say. Those plugs helped my mixes A LOT. Then the rest I would give to an engineer that was far superior to I to make my record. Just because you have 5 grand doesn't mean you have to spend 5 grand either.

[cannibalbritney]

Originally Posted by NickNeedsWork

If I had 5 grand to do an record I'd pay someone else to push faders and turn knobs. I get headaches when I try to do everything at once. If you plan on doing any future mixing at home and have a decent computer with PT LE I'd drop $800 on Waves Gold Bundle Native. I don't care what people say. Those plugs helped my mixes A LOT. Then the rest I would give to an engineer that was far superior to I to make my record. Just because you have 5 grand doesn't mean you have to spend 5 grand either.

well this 5 grand isnt for 1 record... its for this one as well as any others in the future...

[Tousana]

If I were you I would buy a couple of nice pres and a nice pair of mics do some pre pro work at home with the possibility of keeping some of that stuff. You have a 002, so the session will open on the HD system. Cut the main tracks at the studio, then return to the house, and do your vocals and additional O/D's if you can self produce without beating your head against the wall. This will save you money, for mixing at your friends place on a much more powerful system which will simplfy your life. Mixing on a 002 is fine till your laptop runs out of poop.