Yamaha HS80 : horrible harshness??? - Page 2

apadua · 12th May 2011

I had mine for about 4 years now. Run them flat in a well treated (DEAD) room..

I can absolutely hear reverb tails on my mixes... I personally don't find them bright or harsh... They are very detailed... I like them alot better then other monitors in that price range (RP8, Mackies MR, M-Audio).. When I audtioning speakers it was between the 80M's and the Adam A7's... I was looking for more low end response so I ended with the Yammies....

The DynaAudio's were my first choice but did not have the $$ at that time./.......

I am happy with my HS80's...... The more time you spend mixing on them the more you will appreciate them... at least I do..

Mind-Over-Midi · 13th May 2011

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roswell

Does your friend use them flat? I'm not sure if there's switches in the back of the 50's though...

Sorry for taking so long to answer your question, things have been really busy for me this week. My friend uses them flat. My experience with the HS series is that they translate well once you get the mix happening on them, they just sound really bad, and are not all that fun to work on, for me at least. I'm not getting rid of them (unless I trade with my friend) there just not my primary reference source.

a4a4a0 · 20th January 2012

I've bought new Yamaha HS80M and also found terrible harshness. Do I need to burn them? Could it help?

I've listened to them in the shop before (comparing with Adam A5X and M-Audio BX8a) and found it very nice, detailed, bright but not harsh. And now at home it sounds also very detailed, but far too agressive. Especially peaking high end (looks like I can EQ several db down easily without making sound dull).

I have tinnitus in high frequency area and this sound makes impossible to work for a long time. I worked a lot in the studios with Genelecs and Adams and never had any ear fatigue (since I try not to mix loud for a long time) and now after around 4 hours of testing I found huge ear fatigue. Strange. It looks like completely different speakers from these found in the shop.

Roswell · 20th January 2012

Well, no it's the way they sound... You either love or hate it.

I've been using a pair for 3 years now in a well treated room and never got used to their harshness... I've never felt comfortable mixing on them so I use them to check mixes and never rely on the Yamaha for critical listening. I think they can't reproduce depth correctly, they sound very 2D, and it's hard to balance reverbs.

Compared to my other system, the midrange seems scooped. When I switch to other speakers, you can clearly hear that they're absolutely not detailed in the midrange, especially with electric guitars. They sound very "plastic" I would say.

There's much love for the Yam's over the internet, so maybe it's only a matter of taste. You can obviously work with them.

TripleXbeatz · 20th January 2012

I actually own both the HS50m and HS80m monitors and use both (Long story as to why I have both). I agree with what apadua said about wanting the Dynaudio's (Or the KRK VST8's) but did'nt have the $$$ at the time for either.

In any case most everyone is correct. Monitors ARE very personal. And the points made about the specific characteristics of them are pretty dead on as well. We gotta consider not everyone hears the same, and we also use words that are kind of interchangable.. Like "detailed" vs "bright" vs "Harsh" all of which say "high range" to my brain.

My setup is in a temporary spot at the moment, and the room is only very mildly treated, and I am forced for the time being to have my monitors closer to the wall that I would like. Having said that however I'm really not having much trouble with translation on those points.

As for the sound of both sets.. I've had to do less to get what I want out of the 50's than I did with the 80's. With the 50's I just bumped the Mid up +2, and the response at that point is very near to that of the NS10Ms(my room mate has some NS10's and the comparison between the two is truly amazing). I use my 50's with a sub and absolutely love them.
Much more now after bumping the mids +2 and adding the sub, than before.

Prior to that the 80's were my mains. At first like most of you, I also noticed them being bright and more hifi sounding when they were new. I've had mine since 2007. I dont wanna go as far as to say "that had I known then what I know now" that I wouldn't have bought them. That's not the case as I still really like them. But it certainly took some breaking in to reduce the harshness that we all notice. But after they were broken in, I began to play with the settings on the back, and moving them around a bit on my Desk. The 80's can DEFINITELY be fatiguing.

So on the HS80m's I dropped the High trim to -2, The Room Control to -2 (Since I'm close to the walls more so that I want to be) and bumped the Mid EQ to +2, while leaving the Low Cut Flat. The Difference wasn't instantly remarkable.. But I definitely found them to sound a bit flatter, with less of that harshness. The bigger difference was how much less fatiguing they are now. Thinking about it now, the difference seemed to be felt more than heard I guess.

Roswell, Don't hesitate to use the Switches on the back. That's why they're there. We all know that no monitor will perform the same way in ten different spaces, so use the switches to fine tune the monitors to your room and your personal preference.

I will say that after owning both for several years now, I love them Both.
It would be much easier for me to part with the 80's than the 50's now however(and to think 2-3 years ago I felt opposite and was ready to sell the 50's, lol).

The 80's and 50's together on the other hand, very much compliment one another. But where I used to listen to mostly the 80's, Now I'm on the hs50m's pretty much 70% of the time, and use the hs80m's kind of like Big studios use their In walls. My setup allows me to A/B Both sets, and/or mix them together to hear both at once, although I don't mix like that. Its also worth mentioning that I rarely ever use the sub in conjunction with HS80m's either.

But yeah, I would say to adjust those settings and move them around a little like I did, turning them on their sides tweets out, and upright, and play with their placement in addition to the tinkering with the switches. Also try to keep them as long as you can prior to having to return them if you make that decision. That way You have some time to get used to them a bit and mix on them and see how it translates versus your previous Blue Sky setup.
Hope this helps a bit. Good Luck

EDIT: saw this thread and neglected to look at the original date lol my bad. But oh well, my reply stands.

Roswell · 21st January 2012

Thank you for your input. You are right when you say that words matter. As far as I'm concerned, I've really tried to use them. The switches on the back are too drastic for my tastes so I leave them flat. Also, as they are at least one meter away from the back wall and I have bass traps in my room, low end is not a problem. It's pretty accurate actually. But still it lacks details but not bad at all for the price!

I won't say that they are really bad monitors but sometimes I wonder if people would love them as much as they do if they weren't Yamaha's with white cones :-)

I think I'll sell them at some point. If I were to buy monitors in this price range again, I'd like to try the Mackie MR8 mk2. I spend most of my time on the Blue Sky's.

StringBean · 21st January 2012

They are super flat and uncolored. That's why they say if you can make a good mix on those it will translate anywhere. Yes they are harsh--you must mix at lower volumes on them if you will be mixing for long periods. They aren't designed for listening, but I'll be damned if they don't churn out excellent mixes.

a4a4a0 · 21st January 2012

Perhaps I need to wait until they soften a little (I bought them three day ago). Since I love everything about HS80M except these too bright highs. Funny that I compared it with Adam A5X and it seemed they had even more highs in 10-15kHz range so Yamahas sounded better to me (I have tinnitus in very high frequency range so perhaps I'm more sensitive than others and prefer softer sound).

knightonabicycle · 21st January 2012

i also used the hs80 for quite a long time and i also think they are harsh. but don´t forget the price you payed for them! i think it´s the best speaker to work with in this price range, but not for long sessions. after 4 houres they sturted to be a little hard for my ears. but again, you can make really good mixdowns on them, just check them out for a couple of weeks and you will notice that you can achieve good results on them.

macmurphy · 21st January 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by britdick

Hardly. Those monitors are no good. PERIOD. How many pro's do u see using them? How many people prosthelytizing about how amazing they are? None. Not like the Mackies when they first came out. How many pro studio shots have them on the monitor bridge? None. There's a reason for that.

i had them. They suck. i now have S3A's and a pair of 1031's. Weirdly my mixes still sound terrible. Huh, maybe it wasn't the HS80's.

Riiiiiiiight.

lets hear these mixes then...

souldeep · 21st January 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by macmurphy

lets hear these mixes then...

lets....

Roswell · 21st January 2012

Again, they are OK for the price and you can have decent mixes out of them. But in comparison to other speakers like the Blue Sky (which are more or less in the same price range) they lack details and definition. They can sound metallic to me.

I think they are easier to work with when you only use them as a single set of speakers. They are fine to balance levels because they tend to sound like the average hi fi speakers in terms of tonal balance.

I don't know if they can be used as NS10's because there must be a reason why most pros still rely on them and they don't exhibit the mid range as clearly.

Also I'd like to know, am I the only one who hear that subtle V shape on the HS80 even if they are relatively flat on the paper?

timlloyd · 21st January 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roswell

I don't know if they can be used as NS10's because there must be a reason why most pros still rely on them and they don't exhibit the mid range as clearly.

Nope, they don't have the atributes that makes NS10s useful.

Bullseye · 21st January 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by britdick

Hardly. Those monitors are no good. PERIOD. How many pro's do u see using them? How many people prosthelytizing about how amazing they are? None. Not like the Mackies when they first came out. How many pro studio shots have them on the monitor bridge? None. There's a reason for that.

i had them. They suck. i now have S3A's and a pair of 1031's. Weirdly my mixes still sound terrible. Huh, maybe it wasn't the HS80's.

Riiiiiiiight.

Okay, lets hear it. Maybe your right, maybe not. Maybe - let objective ears be the deciding factor. Frankly, you seem to protest a bit too much. A simple I don't care for them would be fine. But let me guess, Rap? (just a guess you see). The anonymity on the web plays both ways which is why its such a great resource.

cavern · 21st January 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by StringBean

They are super flat and uncolored. That's why they say if you can make a good mix on those it will translate anywhere. Yes they are harsh--you must mix at lower volumes on them if you will be mixing for long periods. They aren't designed for listening, but I'll be damned if they don't churn out excellent mixes.

Totally agree.

Roswell · 22nd January 2012

If you were to replace the Yam's, which model would you guys choose? Have you tried the Mackie MR8?

Heartfelt · 10th February 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by StringBean

They are super flat and uncolored. That's why they say if you can make a good mix on those it will translate anywhere. Yes they are harsh--you must mix at lower volumes on them if you will be mixing for long periods. They aren't designed for listening, but I'll be damned if they don't churn out excellent mixes.

Nope, far from flat, I'm afraid. The have a dip in the low mids and an upper mid rise that makes vocals stand out. Sometimes, that is just the ticket.

Knowing them, like with any box, is the answer and I have been very happy with great feedback both here and in real life on my mixes done on them.

Roswell · 10th February 2012

Quote:

Originally Posted by Heartfelt

Nope, far from flat, I'm afraid. The have a dip in the low mids and an upper mid rise that makes vocals stand out. Sometimes, that is just the ticket.

Exactly, the mids aren't very well defined. Yes, when you know them you can have good results but you're missing a lot of details that other systems will reveal. I don't trust them for EQ decisions. I think they are fine for balancing levels.

Cody · 11th February 2012

I found they were a lot better on their side with the tweeter on the outside. I have them oriented this way on monitor stands, and enjoy mixing on them at present. I'm saving away for Focals, but would never get rid of these monitors.

Heartfelt · 11th February 2012

I did ok mixing on them with the exception of delays and verbs which I had to double check elsewhere. Despite that, when I had them, they seemed revealing. The set I have now are more revealing but don't extend on the bottom like the yams do so... Every pair has +\-

You can certainly mix on the yams.

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12th May 2011	#31
apadua Gear addict Joined: Jul 2007 Posts: 350	I had mine for about 4 years now. Run them flat in a well treated (DEAD) room.. I can absolutely hear reverb tails on my mixes... I personally don't find them bright or harsh... They are very detailed... I like them alot better then other monitors in that price range (RP8, Mackies MR, M-Audio).. When I audtioning speakers it was between the 80M's and the Adam A7's... I was looking for more low end response so I ended with the Yammies.... The DynaAudio's were my first choice but did not have the $$ at that time./....... I am happy with my HS80's...... The more time you spend mixing on them the more you will appreciate them... at least I do..

20th January 2012	#33
a4a4a0 Gear interested Joined: Jan 2012 Posts: 2	I've bought new Yamaha HS80M and also found terrible harshness. Do I need to burn them? Could it help? I've listened to them in the shop before (comparing with Adam A5X and M-Audio BX8a) and found it very nice, detailed, bright but not harsh. And now at home it sounds also very detailed, but far too agressive. Especially peaking high end (looks like I can EQ several db down easily without making sound dull). I have tinnitus in high frequency area and this sound makes impossible to work for a long time. I worked a lot in the studios with Genelecs and Adams and never had any ear fatigue (since I try not to mix loud for a long time) and now after around 4 hours of testing I found huge ear fatigue. Strange. It looks like completely different speakers from these found in the shop.

20th January 2012	#34
Roswell Gear Head Joined: Nov 2010 Location: Zeta Reticuli Posts: 57 Thread Starter	Well, no it's the way they sound... You either love or hate it. I've been using a pair for 3 years now in a well treated room and never got used to their harshness... I've never felt comfortable mixing on them so I use them to check mixes and never rely on the Yamaha for critical listening. I think they can't reproduce depth correctly, they sound very 2D, and it's hard to balance reverbs. Compared to my other system, the midrange seems scooped. When I switch to other speakers, you can clearly hear that they're absolutely not detailed in the midrange, especially with electric guitars. They sound very "plastic" I would say. There's much love for the Yam's over the internet, so maybe it's only a matter of taste. You can obviously work with them.

20th January 2012	#35
TripleXbeatz Gear interested Joined: Jan 2012 Location: ATL, GA Posts: 24 1 Review written	I actually own both the HS50m and HS80m monitors and use both (Long story as to why I have both). I agree with what apadua said about wanting the Dynaudio's (Or the KRK VST8's) but did'nt have the $$$ at the time for either. In any case most everyone is correct. Monitors ARE very personal. And the points made about the specific characteristics of them are pretty dead on as well. We gotta consider not everyone hears the same, and we also use words that are kind of interchangable.. Like "detailed" vs "bright" vs "Harsh" all of which say "high range" to my brain. My setup is in a temporary spot at the moment, and the room is only very mildly treated, and I am forced for the time being to have my monitors closer to the wall that I would like. Having said that however I'm really not having much trouble with translation on those points. As for the sound of both sets.. I've had to do less to get what I want out of the 50's than I did with the 80's. With the 50's I just bumped the Mid up +2, and the response at that point is very near to that of the NS10Ms(my room mate has some NS10's and the comparison between the two is truly amazing). I use my 50's with a sub and absolutely love them. Much more now after bumping the mids +2 and adding the sub, than before. Prior to that the 80's were my mains. At first like most of you, I also noticed them being bright and more hifi sounding when they were new. I've had mine since 2007. I dont wanna go as far as to say "that had I known then what I know now" that I wouldn't have bought them. That's not the case as I still really like them. But it certainly took some breaking in to reduce the harshness that we all notice. But after they were broken in, I began to play with the settings on the back, and moving them around a bit on my Desk. The 80's can DEFINITELY be fatiguing. So on the HS80m's I dropped the High trim to -2, The Room Control to -2 (Since I'm close to the walls more so that I want to be) and bumped the Mid EQ to +2, while leaving the Low Cut Flat. The Difference wasn't instantly remarkable.. But I definitely found them to sound a bit flatter, with less of that harshness. The bigger difference was how much less fatiguing they are now. Thinking about it now, the difference seemed to be felt more than heard I guess. Roswell, Don't hesitate to use the Switches on the back. That's why they're there. We all know that no monitor will perform the same way in ten different spaces, so use the switches to fine tune the monitors to your room and your personal preference. I will say that after owning both for several years now, I love them Both. It would be much easier for me to part with the 80's than the 50's now however(and to think 2-3 years ago I felt opposite and was ready to sell the 50's, lol). The 80's and 50's together on the other hand, very much compliment one another. But where I used to listen to mostly the 80's, Now I'm on the hs50m's pretty much 70% of the time, and use the hs80m's kind of like Big studios use their In walls. My setup allows me to A/B Both sets, and/or mix them together to hear both at once, although I don't mix like that. Its also worth mentioning that I rarely ever use the sub in conjunction with HS80m's either. But yeah, I would say to adjust those settings and move them around a little like I did, turning them on their sides tweets out, and upright, and play with their placement in addition to the tinkering with the switches. Also try to keep them as long as you can prior to having to return them if you make that decision. That way You have some time to get used to them a bit and mix on them and see how it translates versus your previous Blue Sky setup. Hope this helps a bit. Good Luck EDIT: saw this thread and neglected to look at the original date lol my bad. But oh well, my reply stands.

21st January 2012	#36
Roswell Gear Head Joined: Nov 2010 Location: Zeta Reticuli Posts: 57 Thread Starter	Thank you for your input. You are right when you say that words matter. As far as I'm concerned, I've really tried to use them. The switches on the back are too drastic for my tastes so I leave them flat. Also, as they are at least one meter away from the back wall and I have bass traps in my room, low end is not a problem. It's pretty accurate actually. But still it lacks details but not bad at all for the price! I won't say that they are really bad monitors but sometimes I wonder if people would love them as much as they do if they weren't Yamaha's with white cones :-) I think I'll sell them at some point. If I were to buy monitors in this price range again, I'd like to try the Mackie MR8 mk2. I spend most of my time on the Blue Sky's.

21st January 2012	#37
StringBean Lives for gear Joined: Aug 2011 Posts: 561	They are super flat and uncolored. That's why they say if you can make a good mix on those it will translate anywhere. Yes they are harsh--you must mix at lower volumes on them if you will be mixing for long periods. They aren't designed for listening, but I'll be damned if they don't churn out excellent mixes.

21st January 2012	#39
knightonabicycle Gear interested Joined: Nov 2010 Posts: 9	i also used the hs80 for quite a long time and i also think they are harsh. but don´t forget the price you payed for them! i think it´s the best speaker to work with in this price range, but not for long sessions. after 4 houres they sturted to be a little hard for my ears. but again, you can make really good mixdowns on them, just check them out for a couple of weeks and you will notice that you can achieve good results on them.

22nd January 2012	#46
Roswell Gear Head Joined: Nov 2010 Location: Zeta Reticuli Posts: 57 Thread Starter	If you were to replace the Yam's, which model would you guys choose? Have you tried the Mackie MR8?

11th February 2012	#49
Cody Gear addict Joined: Oct 2007 Location: Calgary Posts: 449 1 Review written	I found they were a lot better on their side with the tweeter on the outside. I have them oriented this way on monitor stands, and enjoy mixing on them at present. I'm saving away for Focals, but would never get rid of these monitors.

11th February 2012	#50
Heartfelt Lives for gear Joined: Jan 2008 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 2,443	I did ok mixing on them with the exception of delays and verbs which I had to double check elsewhere. Despite that, when I had them, they seemed revealing. The set I have now are more revealing but don't extend on the bottom like the yams do so... Every pair has +\- You can certainly mix on the yams.