Another sample rate question

Einstein · 28th January 2006, 10:31 AM

Okay, here goes...I have noticed that if I'm working in 48k, that if I mix down to 96 before processing any type of compression or limiting to the final mix, that it's much cleaner and gives me more headroom. I know that this is not due to the audio file sounding any better since it was recorded in 48, but that the plugs will process smoother with higher sample rates.

My actual question is this, if a whole project is recorded in 48k, is it benifitial to upsample the entire thing to say 96 or higher if the mix is going to be plug-in intensive?

Again, I understand that the file itself would have to be recorded at the higher sample rate to benifit on the original audio itself, but I'm talking about processing here. What are the technical theories behind this if any?

lawrence_o · 28th January 2006, 11:42 AM

The difference you're hearing is probably a bit more crispy top-end right? It's due to the filters in the ADDA it's like that. Normally, when going from 48k to 96, you can't add newer frequencies since there is nothing present above 24khz so the difference is purely your ADDA that filters differently.

I'd say, who cares?

Regards

Einstein · 28th January 2006, 11:48 AM

Oh, no, that's not what I mean........at least I don't think thats it.

Say you want to add some heavy limiting on the 2bus going out on the final mix. I've found that if I mixdown to 96, open the new stereo file, add my limiting, then go to CD, the results are soooo much cleaner. So I was wondering if this would be benificial. The results I'm judging by are once it's on CD, which means it's gone back down to 44.1.

Paul David · 28th January 2006, 12:00 PM

What are you mixing down to? I'm just trying to get a picture of your digital signal chain. Also, please list the actual software that you are using and any other variables that you think might be important i.e. which limiter.

Einstein · 28th January 2006, 12:08 PM

I'm using Nuendo, mixing in the box, and it seems to make a difference on just about anything I've tried. The L2 or L3 or the TL which is my favorite right now. It seems to make a pretty nocitable difference on compression as well. Seems like I actually read it in a magazing the first time I tried it. Some big name dude suggested it, but for the life of me, i can't remember who it was.

lawrence_o · 28th January 2006, 12:26 PM

I'd say, if it sounds better to you then just do it bro ;-) Who cares what the reason is :-)

Regards
Lawrence

mogWai · 28th January 2006, 12:32 PM

Do you mean, when selecting an internal Mixdown you mix to 96k? or are you running the mix live and recording it at 96k (impossible that

)?

It sounds an interesting experiment to try..

oneartist · 28th January 2006, 01:22 PM

Is there a reason you are not recording originally at 96K? I've noticed my best mics show their stuff at 96K whereas, at 44.1 it is harder to tell a difference.

Chuck

Einstein · 28th January 2006, 08:15 PM

If we record at 96k, the Apogees cut our inputs in half. We're looking to upgrade this eventually. I hope it's soon.

Einstein · 28th January 2006, 08:16 PM

And I meant internal mixdown.

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28th January 2006, 10:31 AM	#1
Einstein Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 504	Another sample rate question Okay, here goes...I have noticed that if I'm working in 48k, that if I mix down to 96 before processing any type of compression or limiting to the final mix, that it's much cleaner and gives me more headroom. I know that this is not due to the audio file sounding any better since it was recorded in 48, but that the plugs will process smoother with higher sample rates. My actual question is this, if a whole project is recorded in 48k, is it benifitial to upsample the entire thing to say 96 or higher if the mix is going to be plug-in intensive? Again, I understand that the file itself would have to be recorded at the higher sample rate to benifit on the original audio itself, but I'm talking about processing here. What are the technical theories behind this if any?

28th January 2006, 11:42 AM	#2
lawrence_o Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Belgium Posts: 598	The difference you're hearing is probably a bit more crispy top-end right? It's due to the filters in the ADDA it's like that. Normally, when going from 48k to 96, you can't add newer frequencies since there is nothing present above 24khz so the difference is purely your ADDA that filters differently. I'd say, who cares? Regards __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Grooveyard Productions: http://top-producers.blogspot.com/ SSL6048E/G 32Ch Prismsound ADA-8 out G5 Quad, PTHD3 Acell, Waves Platinum, SoundToys, DUY and then some... Some outboard: AMS-NEVE, Eve H8000FW, Lexicon300L etc. WANTED, Neve1073, 1083,1084!

28th January 2006, 12:00 PM	#4
Paul David Lives for gear Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Nashville Posts: 597	What are you mixing down to? I'm just trying to get a picture of your digital signal chain. Also, please list the actual software that you are using and any other variables that you think might be important i.e. which limiter. __________________ http://www.myspace.com/pauldaviddotus

28th January 2006, 12:26 PM	#6
lawrence_o Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Belgium Posts: 598	I'd say, if it sounds better to you then just do it bro ;-) Who cares what the reason is :-) Regards Lawrence __________________ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Grooveyard Productions: http://top-producers.blogspot.com/ SSL6048E/G 32Ch Prismsound ADA-8 out G5 Quad, PTHD3 Acell, Waves Platinum, SoundToys, DUY and then some... Some outboard: AMS-NEVE, Eve H8000FW, Lexicon300L etc. WANTED, Neve1073, 1083,1084!

28th January 2006, 11:48 AM	#3
Einstein Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 504	Oh, no, that's not what I mean........at least I don't think thats it. Say you want to add some heavy limiting on the 2bus going out on the final mix. I've found that if I mixdown to 96, open the new stereo file, add my limiting, then go to CD, the results are soooo much cleaner. So I was wondering if this would be benificial. The results I'm judging by are once it's on CD, which means it's gone back down to 44.1.

28th January 2006, 12:08 PM	#5
Einstein Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 504	I'm using Nuendo, mixing in the box, and it seems to make a difference on just about anything I've tried. The L2 or L3 or the TL which is my favorite right now. It seems to make a pretty nocitable difference on compression as well. Seems like I actually read it in a magazing the first time I tried it. Some big name dude suggested it, but for the life of me, i can't remember who it was.

28th January 2006, 12:32 PM	#7
mogWai Lives for gear Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 729	Do you mean, when selecting an internal Mixdown you mix to 96k? or are you running the mix live and recording it at 96k (impossible that )? It sounds an interesting experiment to try..

28th January 2006, 01:22 PM	#8
oneartist Gear Head Join Date: Dec 2003 Location: Central CA Posts: 64	Is there a reason you are not recording originally at 96K? I've noticed my best mics show their stuff at 96K whereas, at 44.1 it is harder to tell a difference. Chuck

28th January 2006, 08:15 PM	#9
Einstein Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 504	If we record at 96k, the Apogees cut our inputs in half. We're looking to upgrade this eventually. I hope it's soon.

28th January 2006, 08:16 PM	#10
Einstein Lives for gear Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Asheville, NC Posts: 504	And I meant internal mixdown.

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