Typical Neve Sound

[galli]

When you think on a typical “Neve sound”, which song comes to your mind?
And about a typical API sound?...

Need help on finding the right “sonic” patch to choose my first good preamp.
Bear in mind that where I live I cannot find this equipment to test (which would be the right way to do it).

So… If you can exemplify would be great (the lead vocal of such song, or the guitar tone of this song are typical Neve record sound).
I will listen to those songs and better understand what I’m looking for.

Thanks a lot.

[galli]

On the Neve, I was relating to the 1073 (the 1073dpa is on my list).

Any help on driving me to a song which would help me identify the “Neve sound”?

[ScumBum]

I don't know if Nirvana's Nevermind album was on a Neve 1073 , but it was an old Neve board and that album is the Neve sound .

[denial]

Originally Posted by galli

When you think on a typical “Neve sound”, which song comes to your mind?

Something recent:
Foo Fighters - In Your Honor
Here you can really hear the signature slow and sluggy drum sound that only a Neve can produce. A little muddy/mushy but it sounds great for rock. API's are punchier and don't produce such a slow transient.

You need both for different purposes.

[galli]

Humm, I was looking for a preamp with a signature more to the smooth side. Clean.
Such as Alan Parsons stuff… or even the sonority David Foster gets on Michael Buble’s albums…

Is Neve applied for that as well?

Btw, my main mic (which is on the way) is a Pearlman.

[galli]

Any other examples, to get me familiar with the Neve sound?
Maybe on a cleaner/smoother side?

Thanks.

[84K]

Neve Sound.... Temple Of The Dog. One of my favorite sounding albums ever, and done completely on the Neve at London Bridge.

[Matt Hepworth]

Muse - Absolution

[galli]

Originally Posted by glitch

Muse - Absolution

Didn't know this band. Quite interesting! thanks.

Anything else with a typical Neve sound?

[Fletcher]

Originally Posted by galli

When you think on a typical “Neve sound”, which song comes to your mind?

"Suicide is Painless" ... not because it "sounds like a Neve" it's just that I want to blow my fukking brains out everytime someone asks this dumbass question.

Yeah, I know... there are no "stupid questions"... but there seems to be a shitload of inquisitive idiots.

What color should I paint my living room?

How will "Burnt Orange" look with my couch?

What do you think is the best use of "Sunset Mauve" on an interior wall?

Lookit, I'm not calling you an idiot for asking the question [OK, I probably am, but I sincerely mean no disrespect when I'm doing it]... it's just that I so wish that the people that inhabit this [and a bunch of other forums] would get the fukk over that anything with the "N word" is going to be some kind of magic bullet that will make them a better engineer, cause them to write better music, score them a Ferrari... all while making their teeth whiter and their girlfriend more attractive.

It's a fukking tool. No more. No less.

I can't imagine people on "Carslutz" going "when you think of a Craftsman 9/16th open end wrench... what nut comes to mind?"

I know it's hard to try things... but the only way you're ever going to have any idea of the capabilities of this stuff is to try it yourself. You need to have personal experience with the tools.

No MP-3 that's posted on a website is going to help you [unless you're the guy that posted it]... no written description with black letters on white background is going to help you get the sense of the feeling that is created with these tools. No listening to a record that you weren't involved in the production is going to give you an idea of what the console sounds like... it'll give you the idea of what a specific engineer working with a specific set of artsists can accomplish on any particular set of tools but it won't showcase the hardware.

Ain't no motherfukker on the face of this earth ever walked down the street humming the fukking mic pre.

It's just never happened.

Some of these tools can be used to help reinforce the artist's musical/emotional statement... some tools can get in the way. On the very rare occasion some tool might actually inspire an artist to perform a little bit better than they're capable of performing because of the audio they're hearing back in their headphones... but that's about the extent of it.

I sincerely wish you the best of luck with your search and quest... but please [pretty please... pretty please with sugar on top], let's try to elevate this forum past the "I've heard Unicorns are cool... what's it feel like to ride one?" level? Maybe a little?

Shit.

OK... I'll shut up now and go back to my hole...

Peace.

[doorknocker]

Fletcher's theme song: 'I'm drinking TNT, I'm smoking dynamite, I hope some scho...eh...GEARSLUT will start a fight'

[De chromium cob]

I think Ben Harper's "Fight for your mind" and "Burn to Shine" are good examples of the sound of a 80 series Neve board. Nice and big with no harshness.....

Originally Posted by Fletcher

I can't imagine people on "Carslutz" going "when you think of a Craftsman 9/16th open end wrench... what nut comes to mind?"

I think a better analogy would be a site called "Bakingslutz" talking about the best type and brand of flour for pizza dough as opposed to muffins.... The customer eating the pizza wont say "This King Arthur Flour tastes great!", but the baker sure as hell would and should know the difference between different types and brands of flour and the gluten levels of each if they want to turn out a exceptional product.....

Obviously, the other ingredients you use when baking will have a large effect on the product just like the other things you use besides the Neve will have a large effect on the quality of the sound, but that doesn't negate using a certain type and quality of flour....

[Sqye]

[QUOTE=Fletcher]

I can't imagine people on "Carslutz" going "when you think of a Craftsman 9/16th open end wrench... what nut comes to mind?"

QUOTE]

I think a better analogy would be, "when you think of a Ferrari Enzo ... what nut comes to mind?"

"Information is not knowledge. Knowledge is not wisdom. Wisdom is not truth. Truth is not beauty. Beauty is not love. Love is not music. Music is THE BEST..." Frank Zappa

Other Great Zappaisms:

"Jazz is not dead, it just smells funny."

"Remember there's a big difference between kneeling down and bending over."

"The biggest threat to America is not communism it is moving America towards a fascist theocracy and everything the Reagan administration has been doing is steering us right down that path. When you have a government that prefers a certain moral code derived from a certain religion and that moral code turns into legislation to suit one certain religious point of view."

"A composer is a guy who goes around forcing his will on unsuspecting air molecules, often with the assistance of unsuspecting musicians."

"There is more stupidity than hydrogen in the universe, and it has a longer shelf life."

"Gail has said in interviews that one of the things that makes our relationship work is the fact that we hardly ever get to talk to each other."

"The creation and destruction of harmonic and 'statistical' tensions is essential to the maintenance of compositional drama. Any composition (or improvisation) which remains consonant and 'regular' throughout is, for me, equivalent to watching a movie with only 'good guys' in it, or eating cottage cheese."

The more boring a child is, the more the parents, when showing off the child, receive adulation for being good parents-- because they have a tame child-creature in their house.

Rock journalism is people who can't write, interviewing people who can't talk, in order to provide articles for people who can't read.

"I have an important message to deliver to all the cute people all over the world. If you're out there and you're cute, maybe you're beautiful. I just want to tell you somethin' - there's more of us UGLY MOTHER****ERS than you are, hey-y, so watch out."

[galli]

1. No, cannot try things. Not where I live. Must be based on opinions.

2. Fletcher, you're right. This is absolutely unimportant. I don’t really care what “tool brand” I’m going to use. However, I’m looking for a kind of sound. I’d like to pursue a sonority that I find in Alan Parsons’ recordings (for instance). Putting aside personal skills for achieving it (since it only depends of my efforts to improve), gear-wise isn’t it true that some tools are more suitable to the results I want?
A Neve style or an API style preamp will lead me to the same results? (this is really a question as I don’t know)

Fletcher, I like your sincerity (although, I must tell you that it’s not that sweet when it comes to our direction…). Would you mind help me, though?

I don’t know much about equipment, and cannot test them, I’m counting on answers and recommendations to help me on that.


Thanks,
Galli.

[Sqye]

If you like Alan Parsons, use his favorite mic - a 4033. No joke.

http://mixonline.com/mag/audio_audiotechnica/index.html

Sorry for the oT - I know we're not discussing mics, but I always find it amusing, since it's one of my favs, as well, and has won out over so many way higher end mics in our sessions and shootouts over the years.

[galli]

Originally Posted by Sqye

If you like Alan Parsons, use his favorite mic - a 4033. No joke.

Thanks man. I had read it on some of your old posts. Pretty amazing info (regarding the price of the 4033).
Following this same line (Alan Parsons patch), would you match this mic with which preamp? And compressor?

Thanks for the help.

[Lawrence]

Originally Posted by galli

Following this same line (Alan Parsons patch), would you match this mic with which preamp? And compressor?.

I think this is the kind of question that Fletcher was ranting about. Matching a mic with a pre and a comp is totally dependent on the talent, the song, the source, the room, the distance from the source, what sound you're going after on a particular day and last but not least what's available to use.

The 4033 is a great mic, I used to own one and I own a 4050 now. It sounded great on one male singer with a DBX 576 tube pre comp and sounded like shit with another guy or girl with that same pre/comp. There is no magic mic/pre/comp combo that sounds great on everything. A Neve pre with a good quality LDC will probably sound good on most anything but we engineers want "the best". It changes. Daily. Even on acoustic guitar. 4033 is always good on AC, sometimes another mic is "great". Depends on the AC and the player.

With that said, many pro engineers have a "go to" combo (for male or female vox for example) they start with that almost always sounds good on everyone. BUT... somewhere lurking amongst the available gear is often another combo that would sound better, magical, great. Rarely does one have the time to audition every available combo on a particular talent or source. This is where your experience with your gear kicks in to suggest some "possible good choices" based on the source or what you hear through your monitors. If you have 10 great vocal mics and 15 great preamps... where to start? The talent will lead you there. A SM58 through a mid-level pre might be just the combo for a particular source that brings out the magic. You simply won't know unless you try it.

If you have a piano in your room you can test different mics/pres and find the best combo you have. For talent that walks through the door (especially singers) you go with your gut, your experience and what you hear coming from the monitors.

BTW, my default vocal combo? ... MXL V69 / Grace 101 / no compression. Works 90% of the time.

Lawrence

[galli]

Originally Posted by Lawrence

I think this is the kind of question that Fletcher was ranting about. Matching a mic with a pre and a comp is totally dependent on the talent, the song, the source, the room, the distance from the source, what sound you're going after on a particular day and last but not least what's available to use.
Lawrence

From the answers I got here, those are my conclusions:
Everything is dependable on everything. If you are not experienced, you should not buy anything until you are experienced to choose by your own. And mostly, the equipment is not really important. In fact it doesn’t matter.

I'm not an engineer (I'm musician), hence, not experienced on recording gear (although I do have some gold discs on my back, from previous rock bands I had).

It happens that I want to record my new work at my new home studio (it’s only a demo. Obviously, I’ll re-record in a professional studio with a producer later. However, I want my demo to be as challenging to the producer as possible.

I’m giving certain parameters of my tastes with the hope that someone with more knowledge could lead to a direction.
On Monday, I’m done with this research. I will be acquiring a Neve, or an API, or Great River, or whatever professional equipment, because at the end (from what I understood) it doesn’t matter much.

I really appreciate all the efforts on answering me.

Galli.


Btw, yes… I cannot test equipment where I live.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by galli

1. No, cannot try things. Not where I live. Must be based on opinions.


Thanks,
Galli.

Are there no studios in Brazil that have Neve mic pre's where you can book time and try out?

[galli]

Originally Posted by thethrillfactor

Are there no studios in Brazil that have Neve mic pre's where you can book time and try out?

Yes. It's a bit tricky to do it but yes... I'm not sure if it's worth the pain... I would have to rent one of the few majors (that are probably booked), to choose a preamp to my home studio.

For instance, I have already understood that an API is more aggressive. So, if i'm looking for a clean sound as an Alan Parsons' recordings, this would not be my choice (if I understood it right).
These little tips are very helpful and can get me in a direction (which I'm getting by reading all the hundreds of threads here - which is great).

[galli]

Ok. Maybe I'm asking it wrong.

John Hardy preamp. Very clean, right? (from what I researched).
Is this style that I listen and like in Alan Parsons? Or would it be the other way around (more to the colored side of preamps)?...

[Sqye]

http://www.neptunepinkfloyd.co.uk/wi...p/Alan_Parsons

If you want the AP "Dark Side" sound, you may have to get one of these

"A custom-built, late-generation, 16-track, EMI board." - see above link

Hardys are VERY clean. So are reference pres - like Earthworks LAB 101, or 1021. Millenia also makes very clean pres. They all sound nice and detailed. It will depend a great deal on what you're recording.

If you have one LDC tube mic and pre, and one transister LDC mic and pre, you might be off to a good start. You just have to watch it with the tube stuff, because it can give you "warm", but it can also give you "mush" and too much distortion.

I have no personal experience with the GR, but I think you can't go wrong with a Great River pre. I don't think I've found ONE negative review from all these picky slutz on this whole forum, yet. And they're not that expensive, at all. So maybe a Hardy M-1 and a GR ME-1NV would do the trick for now, if you have a few good mics. For starters, 2 good cheap mics IMO would be the 4033 and the GT67, one's clean, the other's a tube multi-pattern - and GREAT.

http://www.johnhardyco.com/M-1PersonalDetails.html
http://mercenary.com/lab101micpre.html
http://www.greatriverelectronics.com/mp1.html
http://www.groovetubes.com/product.cfm?Product_ID=1599

4033s on ebay between $100-$400.
Groove Tubes GT67 (originally, the Alesis AM62) is amazing for the money. Great on male vocals, IMHO.

Anyhow, I'm not a techie geek like a lot of the slutz here - I'm an independent songwriter and producer - so don't trust my opinion.

I do think, however, that you might not need a "Neve" sound, as long as you have a "good" sound. I think having some detailed pres and some flexibility on your front end in terms of mic characters should make you pretty happy. And I DON'T think you need to spend a lot of money, AT ALL. Also, if you don't trust your own ears, or your own experience enough, then get someone with better experience, ears or knowledge to hlep you out - at least to listen to your work or help you test your set-up while you're doing it.

[redrue]

Wondering what a Neve preamp sounds like cost me a lot of time and
money. It's a trap. : (

I wish someone had told me this: DO NOT believe
the hype, it's WAY overblown. There ain't no magic
preamp... or secret chords.

good luck.

[Sqye]

Originally Posted by redrue

Wondering what a Neve preamp sounds like cost me a lot of time and
money. It's a trap. : (

I wish someone had told me this: DO NOT believe
the hype, it's WAY overblown. There ain't no magic
preamp... or secret chords.

good luck.

Hey Redrue. What happened to you that you're so bitter?

[galli]

Originally Posted by Sqye

[url]
If you have one LDC tube mic and pre, and one transister LDC mic and pre, you might be off to a good start. You just have to watch it with the tube stuff, because it can give you "warm", but it can also give you "mush" and too much distortion.

So maybe a Hardy M-1 and a GR ME-1NV would do the trick for now, if you have a few good mics.

Thanks for the help.
Your suggestion on the Hardy and GR seems great. On the mics, I have a Blue baby bottle and a Pearlman (on the way).

[galli]

Interesting to notice how this thread got a high number of views and replies… I guess this name (N word) still drives lot’s of attention, love and hate on those forums…
Ot but Interesting.

[Sqye]

My pleasure. You'll have to post your results here when you have your stuff set up and working.

I'm looking forward to getting a Dragonfly from Blue

I think the GR is definitely worth a shot. I'm ordering mine this weekend. I'm looking forward to what all these crazy slutz have been raving about for so long.

Good luck.

[denial]

I think the original thread starter has a fair question. He's trying to reference a sound by defining it to words and even music examples. This is possible.

Not everyone lives in America and has access to this equipment. Give the guy a break and help him with his question if you can.

On the otherhand, this question has been discussed here many times before and due to this, you'll cop some hostility.

I'll give you MY opinion (for what it's worth):

You can't go wrong buying a 1073 and if it really doesn't suit, you can sell it easily. It sounds fukkin' fantastic on everything I've recorded from jazz right through to metal. Great on vocals, great on guitars, great on drums... everything! I've never heard it sound bad on anything.

Sure there are other choices that work great too but a 1073 is special. They sound so good that they inspire a better performance and not everything I've got does that. I hate to say it but I get so much enjoyment from hearing it that it makes me feel good and I enjoy playing.

Suffice to say that many people are very passionate about this device. It's just that good.

[chymer]

It happens that I want to record my new work at my new home studio (it’s only a demo. Obviously, I’ll re-record in a professional studio with a producer later. However, I want my demo to be as challenging to the producer as possible.

Hey Galli, you know I'd sure as hell love to own a neve, but if you want to challenge your producer then capture an amazing moment (performance), not an amazing sound.
I'd rather listen to a crap sounding amazing performance than an amazing sounding crap performance.

Look, your an artist right. Great. Work on your music and record it on a damn dictaphone if you have to. A lot of the guys here can make your stuff sound amazing through neves that they know sound great and know how to use.
Dont waste your time getting a neve if you think it will challenge your producer. Im a producer and if an artist came into my studio and showed me a song and it moved me to tears then I'd be challenged to better it and I sure as hell wouldnt give a crap what it was recorded through.

Still, I'd love to own my own neve but I know it wouldnt make my recordings better, that is untill I learnt it would.

Cheers
Chymer

[stellar]

if a man can't ask this question then what is the point of this board?

The gear man sayin you dont need gear only a good song. I love it!

Anyway he never asked for your opinion on this piece of gear.

There are tons of threads asking for opinions go post there.

This person wanted references.

If that cannot be done then say that.

Why patronize this person with confuscious-says bullshit.