condenser mics for electric guitar

[Unknown soldier]

I'm using the good ol' AT4050, which I like a lot on electric guitar. What are some other condensers that work well with both clean and distored guitar? Looking aroung the $500 range.

thanks.

[Jay Kahrs]

Here are some of the things I reach for. In order of most to least use...

Blue Baby Bottle (always 1st pick over SM57)
Oktava MC012 with cardiod capsule
TLM 103
414 B/ULS
KSM 32
AT4031 (not the 4041)

[Marshall Simmons]

i second the ksm32---- great on guitar and bass


but nowadays i either reach for my AEA r84 or my schoeps. I like the sound of the ksm32's, but i ended up trading them for a 4ch benchmark pre.

but the ksm's are great for guitar and vocals (i used it for bkgrounds and the r84 for leads)

marsh

[mdbeh]

For around $500, AT4047 can work nicely. (It's different than the 4050, by the way.)

[musicalhair]

I like the dragonfly a lot, at least for clean sounds. I've not tried it on distorted guitar yet (soon).

Hey Jay-- which of those do you perfer for distorted and which for clean? Thanks.

[jspartz]

mdbeh,

Just wondering how is the 4047 sound different from the 4050? Have you tried the 4047 next to a Lawson 47? I am looking at microphones in the U47 vein (but on a budget) and I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on this.

Thanks,

jason

[Jax]

When I need a clear, edgy, bright, cutting electric rhythm or lead track, I'll actually use a KM184.

When I need a somewhat hard, accurate, but non-offensive sound, I'll put up a 4050 (works well in a mix with the KM184 playing the 'lead rhythm' track, since nobody solos anymore).

For something a little smokier and dense, like a bluesy 'lead', I like my 4060.

For huge chunky stuff, I totally love my CAD VX-2. Actually it can do just about anything well, but excels at chunka chunka riffs.

But my R121's kick all their asses for the first choice mic. All of the above usually make up overdub/2nd rhythm or layered tracks.

[HEDDcase]

Originally posted by Unknown soldier
I'm using the good ol' AT4050, which I like a lot on electric guitar. What are some other condensers that work well with both clean and distored guitar? Looking aroung the $500 range.

thanks.

Go the extra bucks and buy a Royer R-121. Nothing does electric guitar as well, except maybe another good ribbon mic.

[mdbeh]

Originally posted by jspartz
mdbeh,

Just wondering how is the 4047 sound different from the 4050? Have you tried the 4047 next to a Lawson 47? I am looking at microphones in the U47 vein (but on a budget) and I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on this.

Thanks,

jason

The 4047 is kind of a poor man's fet U47. Compared to the 4050, it's a little darker--the 4050's got a little peak at 10k that the 4047 doesn't have.

I've had it work well on (distant) kick, floor toms, bass amps, and (per this thread) some electric guitars.

Lately, I've been using a Soundelux iFet7 for a lot of the same stuff. The Soundelux frankly kills the 4047 most of the time, but it's $2000 vs $500, so that's no big surprise. The 4047's still a useful piece for me though, and certainly a good deal.

I haven't heard the Lawson, but given that it's a copy of a tube (not FET) 47, I'd be pretty sure that it's a different sort of sound than the 4047.

[Drumsound]

After using AT Pro37Rs for years I put one on a guitar cabinet last week. It sounded fantastic! I was shocked. I thought it would overload or sound peaky, which it didn't.

I also have used the 4047 on guitar (and just about everything else). I find it either works or it don't! I usually move it once, if it's still not floating my boat it goes away. I use 4047 on overheads a lot and on the record I started yesterday I'm using them on toms.

[PlugHead]

FWIW,

Not the most useful of mics for everything, but CAD E-100's can handle deafening SPL's (150+Db) and has a fairly neutral (but rolled off above 10k) but often useful sound as a cab mic: not always the 1st choice, but is a sleeper IMNSHO...

YMMV,

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

U-87 (purple badge) and a 57.. but have also had suyrpisingly good results with a KM-84 on bass and gtr cabs.

PEACE
Wiggy

[Jay Kahrs]

I've tried the 4047 a few times and it doesn't work for me if it's the only mic. Way too dark and murky sounding but it sounds good on bass cabs.

[Don]

I like the Baby Bottle alot
The AT 4060 quite a bit
The AT 4033 is cool
I've liked a Marshall V69 the one time I've used it
And for bass guitar I like the KSM44 alot

[Dot]

To add to Don's post, the MXL V69ME is a great tube mic for recording amps. Warm, colored and sort of vintage-sounding. If you're going for a classic sound, the V69's pretty hard to beat.

The Beyer 160 is a cool ribbon mic for about $360 and killer on amps.

You can listen to some mics on an amp here.

[Steve Smith]

Te AT 4050 is probablly my favorite " utility " amp mic. if you have a 4050 and a 57, get the Royer, in my experience its tone is the only thing you cant get with the other 2.

[Beezoboy]

I'll have to agree that a U87i (purple badge) has worked wonders for me on guitar cab. Also I have had good luck with a Beyer M-260. What a great "middy" and clear sound it can give. I have also had good luck with a Studio Projects C-1, although the low mids and lows aren't as focused as the U87. So I normally reach for the U87. I have a Gefell UMT800 that I have also been dying to use on guitar cab.

Beez

[mitgong]

I second the CAD E-100 sleeper nomination. Also excellent live, especially in overly horn-loaded clubs. Smooth, undistorted, accurate, inexpensive. Yeah!

P.S. Perfect for those who care about midrange frequency representation.

[Han]

This may surprise you, but an AKG C1000 can sound pretty good on distorted (metal) guitar.

[moon_unit]

Originally posted by musicalhair
I like the dragonfly a lot, at least for clean sounds. I've not tried it on distorted guitar yet (soon).

Been using one for both, and I've never been happier with any single mic on guitar amp.

[kwhatx]

I've found the Groove Tubes MD1A Tube mic to be very useful on guitars. Supposedly Eddie Van Halen (on the Balanced album) and Steve Vai both love this mic. It can handle high SPLs and sounds great next to the grill. And I believe Groove Tubes has just reissued in tube and FET versions.

[jbuntz]

I second the c1000s. I've had better luck with it than a multitude of nicer condensors. It's pretty 57ish but way fatter. The key is to use it just like a 57. 30 degrees off axis and a little off center. All the larger diaphragm ones tend to have a problem with proximity effect. The c1000s actually sounds worse soloed than say my cad VX2 but sits much nicer in the mix. It also has a somewhat similar frequency response curve to a 121.

[David R.]

The 4050 always works well for me, especially in conjunction with a 57. I've tried a TLM103 and it just doesn't sit as well in the mix for me, hard to describe, but that's what I found.

I have yet to try a good ribbon on an amp, I think I am just too chicken to subject my 50 year old babies to that.

[Jay Kahrs]

The key is to put the ribbon mic a few feet from the amp where it's out of harms way and gets more of the tone of the room. I hardly ever jam a ribbon mic right on the grill, it's usually at least a foot and a half away if not 3-4 feet. Sometimes the TLM103 works for me, especially if the amp is really dark sounding. The top can get a bit fizzy if the rig has too much gain, especially on digital. Analog rounds it out and takes that edge off it.

[Jax]

Originally posted by Jay Kahrs
The key is to put the ribbon mic a few feet from the amp where it's out of harms way and gets more of the tone of the room.

I don't know Jay, I've been jamming my 121's right up to the grill, about an inch to half an inch away. I was initially afraid to do this until I saw Michael Wagener's photos of 121's on Engle cabs, just as close and probably twice as loud given the amps he has.

Maybe other older ribbons can't do this, but the Royers seem to love being used like a 57. They also sound great backed off a few feet, but they sound ultra heavy up close.

[HEDDcase]

Maybe other older ribbons can't do this, but the Royers seem to love being used like a 57.

That's because the design of the Royer places the ribbon in a different position than typical ribbon mic designs. It allows the Royer to handle the high SPLs and also accounts for the brighter sound of the Royer when you address it's backside.

Here's a quote from the Royer site.

Need to record at insane levels? No problem! The R-121's maximum SPL rating is >135dB and it can take that all day long. In practical terms, that means you can put your R-121 directly in front of a souped up mega-watts Marshall and turn it up to 11 (see what Pro Audio Review had to say about this) without microphone distortion or doing any damage to the ribbon. We don't recommend trying this with other ribbon mics, but the R-121 can take it, no sweat.

[Lyle Caldwell]

R-121 gets my vote, but for under $500, the Beyer M201 is a great choice, as is the Oktava MC012 (both closer to $200). And I still use the 421 and SM57 quite a bit, but usually to complement the R-121.

But I'd take a 57 and a good player over any other mic and a bad player.

[ozraves]

the studio projects b1 is a decent mic for clean guitar amp sounds. it's shockingly good considering it's just $79.

steve
www.mojopie.com

[Jay Kahrs]

Originally posted by Jax
I don't know Jay, I've been jamming my 121's right up to the grill, about an inch to half an inch away. I was initially afraid to do this until I saw Michael Wagener's photos of 121's on Engle cabs, just as close and probably twice as loud given the amps he has.

Like Lyle said, the Royer's are different. I've caked a few other ribbon mics by placing them too close. An M260DX, RCA 44 and an M160. If it's not a Royer it stays back and gets used as a room mic. That can be a cool thing for solos, add a little bit of compression and it's sort of like a built in verb.

[Jax]

Cool, I didn't know that about other ribbons in comparison to the Royers. The 121's are my first and only ribbons. I've been thinking about picking up a Coles pair and a couple Beyer's when budget allows.