Simple quality drum set for studio?

[infiniteposse]

Hi all-

So I've got enough space around my house to tuck a small drum set downstairs. Now, I can't play drums, but I've always wanted to learn and I do OK on most other instruments...so I'd like to take a shot at it. I'd also like to have a set around to track in the living room with real drummers playing on tunes that call for a kit.

My question would be if anyone could recommend a good quality starter set and what I should expect to pay. Is used a good idea? I'm a believer in not buying crap to start with so I'd like to spend what should be spent on a decent but simple kit. I was thinking snare, kick, floor tom, hat, ride and 1 cymbal and good hardware would be more than sufficient and would add a lot of options for my recordings even if I just dragged in a ride and brushes to track over something.

I hope this is the right place to post this... I'd love to advice from fellow gearslutz.

Many thanks-

Lee

[Roland]

If you want to buy new, you can't go wrong with basic Pearl or Yamaha. IMHO they sound good even a professional drummer won't have much problem with either of those. Cymbals you will need to select carefully but Zildjan, Paiste etc are makes you should look at.

regards


Roland

[chrisso]

Ditto.
You can find kits in pretty good condition secondhand.

(Add DW, but I think they might run a little more expensive than Pearl and Yammy).

[Wiggy Neve Slut]

This one should fit the bill!

Terry bozio... what a ******!lol
Peace
Wiggy

[Stizz]

I was in the same boat here - bought a used Pearl Export set and some new cymbals and kik pedal, and have a blast! They sound better than nothing for recording, and actually quite passable with a good player...

[smoothmoniker]

do you know a drummer who's been in your studio and delivered a sound you like? Buy him lunch, and take him shopping. Within any budget, an actual player is going to know a lot more about picking out a kit than any gear head.

ditto and double for anyone wanting to pick out a piano/rhodes/B3 ... please have a player do it!

-sm

[heinz]

Originally posted by Wiggy Neve Slut
Terry bozio... what a ******!lol

I always wondered what the word '******' meant... now I know. It means amazing, powerful, creative drummer!

[JKL]

If I were you I would stay away from the Pearl (export type) sets. I've bougth a few for my school when there was really nothing else available in the price range, and although they do the job, they're nothing special. I own a Pearl Master Studio set, which of course is a totally differnt ball game. I bought a Yamaha stage set for my high school band, and even they don't compare to what's available now.

I bought a Pacific set (made by DW) for my son last Christmas, and I gotta tell you, I wish they were in existance when I was growing up. They sound fantastic, and have a great amount of quality for such an inexpensive set (around $500). The bass drum is absolutly killer. We also checked out the entry Sonars and Premiers, and they seem to be happening also. All of these kits come standard with suspension mounted toms to boot.

Just my $.02

Jon

[Roland]

Originally posted by JKL
If I were you I would stay away from the Pearl (export type) sets. I've bougth a few for my school when there was really nothing else available in the price range, and although they do the job, they're nothing special. I own a Pearl Master Studio set, which of course is a totally differnt ball game. I bought a Yamaha stage set for my high school band, and even they don't compare to what's available now.

I bought a Pacific set (made by DW) for my son last Christmas, and I gotta tell you, I wish they were in existance when I was growing up. They sound fantastic, and have a great amount of quality for such an inexpensive set (around $500). The bass drum is absolutly killer. We also checked out the entry Sonars and Premiers, and they seem to be happening also. All of these kits come standard with suspension mounted toms to boot.

Just my $.02

Jon

Premier kit might be a good buy, but there is nothing wrong with Pearl exports or Yamaha stage kits. Resonable drums with fair hardware. Well tuned with a good player they can sound great. Of course the Pearl Master is better, so is my Yammy Custom Maple, but the BD costs over twice what a whole export kit costs!

Unless anything major has changed in the last 3-5 years I wouldn't touch DW. Great drums with lousy fittings. They used to make the best BD pedals, but they tended to break easily. Sonar, can be great kits, but they are pricey. If its a general cheap kit to play around on the big boys can do loads more for a budget. Don't forget about Tama too.

Regards


Roland

[JKL]

Well, I'm just saying I've had hands (and $$) on experience with these sets. I've already given my opinion, and it is just an opinion, just wanted to help. I didn't say the Yamaha or Pearl sucked, I just feel they haven't kept up in the entry level drumset market compared to what others are offering. If I was hung up on brands, then I'd be pushing the Pearl. That's what I play, and they're fantastic. But if I were looking for an entry level kit...



Jon

[archtop]

Old Gretsch
old ludwig
tried and true

[JKL]

That's a great suggestion.

Jon

[De chromium cob]

I have a set of Pearl Masters Studio for a more modern sound, and a set of old 70's Gretsch for the more classic sound- While the Pearls are wonderful drums and sound great, the Gretsch are more fun to play and have way more 'vibe' when recorded.

[Fat Cat]

Tama Starclassic birch, 10, 12, 14, 22x18. And the snare that comes with the kit is very good. Set goes for about $1500 and sounds as good as if not better than kits costing $5000. Don't skimp on the hats or the cymbals.

[davemc]

I had a Pearl BLX (Birch) kit I just sold. Buy secondhand you can get a better kit for cheaper then a new entry level kit...

[jeronimo]

I don't know how do you guys would buy something like this from overseas... but you should check our Brazilian drum kits made by Odery. They sound pretty good... and they're cheap (in US$ funds )

[Jay Kahrs]

I bought a set of Premier's for the studio, 20" kick with 10, 12 and 14" toms. The 16" floor is a Pearl that I got from GC on closeout. Premier is in a state of flux right now, I think Remo bought them...

I'm not a huge fan of the Export drums, the Tama Rockstar kits are consistantly better sounding and easier to tune. Same thing with the Yomama kits. Another company that I've heard nothing but great things about is Taye. They're kinda new but are run by the people who were behind Ayote in the early years. http://www.taye.com/

Still, I'd look for a second hand kit and get the best cymbals you can. I've yet to find a bunch of drummers that can pick out a high dollar maple kit from a set of Rockstars, but cheap cymbals are really easy to pick out.

[Dave Martin]

Originally posted by Jay Kahrs


I'm not a huge fan of the Export drums...

I replaced a high end Pearl kit (essentially one of the prototype Master Customs) with a set of Exports; the old kit was too big (power toms and a 24" kick). The Exports sound far better. The trick is to take the kit to a good drum tech and have the bearing edges tweaked.

And of course, hire great musicians to play the kit...

[Stizz]

ok, not trying to get defensive or anything, but I thought he wanted a set to bang around on, and occasionally record - I got my Export set used for $250 US, and while they are not really all that great, for the pirce it was unbeatable. (I won't tell you how much I spent on cymbals...)

When I need to record seriously and the drummer really does not want to bring his kit, I insist on him bringing his snare and kick pedal - I have gotten some great sounds, but only because the player was AMAZING. And as everyone else said, get them set up by a professional tech.

[Chae Ham]

The Pearl Session Customs are pretty nice at around 1400 for a basic 5 piece kit--if you want REAL cymbals it'll cost you though around $200/+ per cymbal. Please go with Zildjians. Cymbals are a long-term investment, and the sound of Zildjian cymbals age very gracefully (I personally like the original Avedis series the best).

The session customs are one step down from the Masters.
I think they're just about the best sounding drums in that price range.

If you can, definitely ask a knowledgeable drummer to go shopping with you.

Things to look out for:
-Consistency in the shell
-Consistency in the bearing edge
-Shell(wood) type: and matching for country of manufacturing--although this is MUCH harder to find nowadays of cheap labor manufacturing. This may sound strange to most non-drummers but consistency between shells(what region of the world the wood is from, and where it was manufactured) are a big factor in sound consistency between drums...but I think the only way you'll be able to get this these days is by custom ordering a Pearl MasterWorks set, which isn't cheap to say the least--so don't worry about it too much!

Hope that Helps!

[chrisso]

I have to say I've never been impressed with Pearl Exports although I take Dave Martin's point that you could improve them with some tech work.
Best value for money is in the used market IMO.
Yesterday I was playing a studio owned kit, a beat up old Ludwig.
It truly sounded awesome and I'm used to hiring the best or using my own Noble & Cooley's.
I'm looking for a Ludwig to add to my collection now.

[Curious G]

Drums really aren't that expensive so do yourself a favor and buy a nice set once. There's plenty on the used market but also a lot of junk, stripped-out/lightweight hardware etc... so be careful.

If you compare the cost to a great mic pre, drums are cheap cheap cheap!

For what it's worth, I bought a Yamaha Birch Custom Absolute set on close-out and some used Zildjian and Paiste cymbals. (You can never have enough cymbals though... and a variety of snares is nice too, AND you can add more of these as deals become available)

[Bob Olhsson]

If you don't care about looks, you can save a bundle by buying an unmatched used bass drum, rack tom and floor tom.

Top of my list would be Gretsch. You'll need to take them apart and put felt in the lugs to damp the spring noise and then sand any rough spots on the rims with fine sand paper. After you get done, you'll have some of the finest sounding recording drums in the world.

[Meriphew]

I'm gassing for one of those Gretsch Special Edition sets in champagne sparkle.

[sonic dogg]

Gretsch or 60's era Ludwigs....I used to have a 4 piece gold sparkle 64 Ludwig set.I did all the work Bob alluded to.The rock drummers would bring in these behemoth sets and insist on using them.Sometime during every session, say on a break, I would slip in a cassette of a very good drummer friend of mine playing this little set as a 'monitor alignment' tape.......3 out of 4 would break down the behemoth and play the silly little Ludwig set....

Btw...cymbals ...I find its much easier to get great cymbal sounds out of the original Avedis..they're softer than the ones put out today and have a better tone and decay rate.Look to your pawn shops and garage sales(yard sales)...We got our set for $150.00.Included 14" hats,18" crash, 20" ping ride, and a little 12" splash.All original Avedis and all almost green from being in someones garage for 20 years.

[Bob Olhsson]

I've always noticed that small drums sound big and big drums sound small.

Another trick is using the thin Diplomat heads. They won't last through 1 song if somebody's bashing them but approached with a bit of finesse, they sound absolutely immense with tone for days.

[chrisso]

I just discovered that playing softer makes the drums bigger. You lose some of the energy but the kit sounds massive.
Yes to 60's Ludwigs.
Yes to original Avedis. They're not so easy to find though. The secrets out about vintage cymbals.

[Tim Glasgow]

Originally posted by chrisso
I just discovered that playing softer makes the drums bigger. You lose some of the energy but the kit sounds massive.
Yes to 60's Ludwigs.

My gf has a killer '54 WFL/Ludwig kit that sound amazing if i play them (note i say "sound" - not that i can play them worth a damn), and sound amazing if quite a few drummers around play them, but put a really heavy rock drummer behind them and they go to shit. if you hit them too hard or with sticks the size of baseball bats, they choke up.

Monster rock testosterone players tend to sound better on newer kits, finesse players on old Gretsch/Ludwig. In a studio you need both. You can't win.

--t
[london, canada and echo cañon, nyc]

[chrisso]

What in your opinions would be the ultimate vintage recording kit (pre 80's)?

Originally posted by Bob Olhsson

Top of my list would be Gretsch. You'll need to take them apart and put felt in the lugs to damp the spring noise and then sand any rough spots on the rims with fine sand paper.

I gave up on my Gretsch kit Bob.
I had a few nightmare sessions with rattles (other than the nut boxes which I had already filled with cotton wool). I totally lost confidence in the kit.
Plus the drums are slightly odd sizes (14.01") leading to you having to force the heads on etc...
If I had been more experienced at the time I should have got a pro tech to sort them out for me.
What about the others?
Rogers, Slingerland, Camco, 60's Ludwig?
Anyone recorded anything particularly spectacular along those lines?

[e-cue]

Originally posted by JKL
I bought a Pacific set (made by DW) for my son last Christmas, and I gotta tell you, I wish they were in existance when I was growing up. They sound fantastic, and have a great amount of quality for such an inexpensive set (around $500). The bass drum is absolutly killer. We also checked out the entry Sonars and Premiers, and they seem to be happening also. All of these kits come standard with suspension mounted toms to boot.

Just my $.02

Jon

Ditto
These kits are awesome in the studio for a rather small sum of money. I have heard a few of them that were tuned like ass that, well, sounded like ass. They don't sound good when detuned for the 70's sound, but are very powerful when cranked and tuned right. They are a much better value than the pearl exports imho, which sound more like something off an 80's hairband record (which might be what you are looking for....or not)
Every now and then, I see 5 peice Rogers for $500 (the ones with the rounded lugs are the ones I really, really like). They are very open sounding kits. When you put tape on the head to deaden them, they sound shitty. If you don't want a big, ringing kit, this ain't it.