Best 2bus Compressor for Dance or Hiphop Music

[Reptil]

Originally Posted by syra

Can't believe the blue monster hasn't been mentioned yet...SMC-2B.

Not only compress (or not) your low end independently but simultaneously decide how much of it you want. Add also a great tube sound, the power to easily glue things and you have one of the most flexible pieces out there,

Btw, when I do "House" I usually run it almost like a limiter (10:1 very fast attack, release)

Hi Syra,
do you have one? that is a nice piece of kit! thumbsup
I have to make due with a lowly focusrite mixmaster, but it still does the trick though..

Originally Posted by Reptil

....spectral compressors, where you can balance stuff

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by passionmax

My expereience with some compressors is they take away from the lowend.
thanks

If the low end is being taken away it means that there isn't enough to begin with or the bass energy is focused in the wrong region.

1/4" tape doesn't go down as low as 1/2" but so many hit dance records were mixed on it(70's and 80's)and i would dare to put any records up against the crap you hear in clubs today in terms of bottomn.

People always bitch about the SSL Quad compressor stealing bass, but i've heard many a great record with lots of bottomn that was mixed through the thing.

Same goes for the Vari-Mu.

It all comes down to the quality and balance of the arrangement and the skills of the mixer.

If it ain't there no compressor will be able to fix it.

[syra]

Originally Posted by Reptil

Hi Syra,
do you have one? that is a nice piece of kit! thumbsup
I have to make due with a lowly focusrite mixmaster, but it still does the trick though..

Yeah, I got one 3 1/2 years ago when it won a shoot out against a manley vari-mu. If you had to have only one compressor you can't find a more flexible unit IMO.
Super fast to super slow attack and release and completely variable ratio from 1.5:1 to 10:1

[Sensenel]

Originally Posted by syra

Can't believe the blue monster hasn't been mentioned yet...SMC-2B.

Not only compress (or not) your low end independently but simultaneously decide how much of it you want. Add also a great tube sound, the power to easily glue things and you have one of the most flexible pieces out there,

Btw, when I do "House" I usually run it almost like a limiter (10:1 very fast attack, release)

Hi
... hmm , i have the pre Modell in my Studio , the Tube Tech SMC-2A ... mostly i make Sounddesign and nice settings on seperate Tracks with it... i dont like it for Mastering or the Sum ...
i think the Low Band cuts the base to quick even with very low Threhold setting and low Ratio ... sure u can crank the Low Band up, but it Sounds always that Kind a compressed which i dont like then...

what do you think on the SMC-2B, similar behaviour ?

I still stuck and recommend the API 2500 Bus Compressor an then thru a L2 or something ... the API adds the Charakter and has the Options to make the Subject Job ... give it a shot !

very Interesting in front of an L2 is the NEVE 33609 as well ... brings everything in Front ! but maybe the fixed setting of 3ms for Attack ( in the Compressor Section )
could be a problem for Dance Sound ...




cheers

[Sensenel]

Originally Posted by thethrillfactor

If the low end is being taken away it means that there isn't enough to begin with or the bass energy is focused in the wrong region.

1/4" tape doesn't go down as low as 1/2" but so many hit dance records were mixed on it(70's and 80's)and i would dare to put any records up against the crap you hear in clubs today in terms of bottomn.

People always bitch about the SSL Quad compressor stealing bass, but i've heard many a great record with lots of bottomn that was mixed through the thing.

Same goes for the Vari-Mu.

It all comes down to the quality and balance of the arrangement and the skills of the mixer.

If it ain't there no compressor will be able to fix it.

Yeah ! damn right ! im down with it ! the Disco Sound of the end of 70's and 80's ... nobody gaves 'em Respect in that Time, Electronic Drumsounds New Recording Methods etc. ... and its so funny, today almost nothing compares to that Sound ! lol

I have just a few Heroes today, who brought the Sound where it should be : Timo Maas ( Martin Buttrich-producer ) , Cassius ( i love the Sound of the Last Album -xxx-plus rec Studio France ! ) and Underworld ( Beacup Fish Album )

The Cassius " au'reve" Album is highly recommended to everyone how does Dance or House Music ! listen and learn Baby-wow !

But Low Budgets and the Illusion thru the Equipment Industrie and Marketing letz every Home DJ Producer Think thats (he is) the shit ...

I do a lot of Pre Mastering for certain Labels some Years ago , and myself doin Dance and House music for like 7 Years since '93 in Germany/Europe

i can remember well, always it cames out on a Mastering job , that i dont have to do " mastering" they want me to rescue the mix ...

always the same , when i load up the File , when u zoom it just a bit away , and then there is that Monster black thick Stripe ... even on Breaks where no Basdrum goes ( the typical Hands up Parts ) are total Black lol

and then they Wonder that there is no flow in the Track ...


thrillfactor says it , actualy no compressor rescues your mix if you are in such Situation, buy new Gear if u want to add Charakter on your Stuff you are sadisfied with

Bassdrums gives the Peak-has to in Dance ... compress other Sounds earlyier in the Mixdwon Prozess-use the Parameters of compressor for Space and Postion setting, dont use EQ that much-expect u want add some special charakter of an realy Nice Eq u have , and u have a plan about how to use your Baby , dont use High-shelf Eq's too much on every Sound-i was using the Highshelf Curve on Avalon 2055 @ 25 KHZ (!)or 27khz from the massiv passiv , just a bit ! very quick u have the feeling that u dont need gain highs somewhere, it gets that nice breath and AIr-i call it heaven
u can gain these highshelf as much as u want, cause u cant bring to smash the highs in that Frequ range-but its like with an exciter -less is more !
then use Sidechain in compressors to pump the Track ...

with all these techniques, u see on you Peakmeter that it wont bounce that much anymore, and u have Headroom and the Dynamic which goes with the Track !and u got no compressor on the Sum so far !
even the " hands up parts " work better ! the Moment when Basedrums comes in or again , are so so important for the feeling ! the Ass-Kickin Impacts ! no Chance when everything is loud and impressiv like the bassdrum

but u gotta trust your Ears with the Bounce Peakmeter Thing first ! )
Like Brian Eno says : u gotta make a Spot on just a few Things in a Track , to create no Compatition between them
he was talking bout Ambient Albums actualy, but that doesnt matter i think

just some ideas ... no equipment can bring a bad Track further , but in some pretty cheesy commerc Dnace stuff thats the reason why the tracks work lol

pretty Hard to learn when to listen to some Rules , and the Moments where not ! ,)

cheers

[inlinenl]

On hip-hop/ Rap / Dance I got real great results using the tubetech smc-2b ( big blue bastard ) .. the low-end is great ... now I combine it with the the manley-vari-mu ... which give's the snare the right treat ... nice combo ....

don't forget you need a great analoq EQ ..... to get it right ....

and some great speakers which really go LOW .... to hear the sub ...

greetings wim

www.inlinemastering.com

[passionmax]

How about the avalon 747. The EQ section is supposed to be very good and I know the compressor is finichy but i assume it can't be that bad for 2bus compression. this would kill 2 birds with one stone

[inlinenl]

Don't know about the avalon, I don't have any expierience with that unit .... the only exp. I have is the 737 and the EQ is pretty nice ....

All depends on how you work .. do you want to make a finished track or are you planning to get it mastered somewhere ...

I would invest in a A class compressor unit and not of in a B unit ... a compressor which will be ok in 20 years .... and get it mastered somewhere decent ...

greetings

wim

www.inlinemastering.com

[passionmax]

Stuff Produce and mix for albums gets mastered by the an outside mastering house. Music I write for TV I master my self. I have the wave plugins. They are very good but stuff kind of sounds brittle or harsh. It might be the way I am mastering but I bet it is the plugins. The Avalon seemed like a good choice for the price and what you get

[mattssons]

As i come from the other side of the fence, a dj turned into recording /mix engineer and still play 3 nights a week to pay the bills my advice would be as follows.

Yes, you need level, but dynamics are more important, paralell compression is the solution. On a dance track, it´s important to have a clear, defined bass because we run some powerful systems and you don´t need as much bass as you would think.

My problem nowdays is not so much that cd´s clip but that they are limited to death.
They just not move any air, i see cones stand still no matter how "loud" These releases sound great on 5" speakers and on the radio but on a club system, no way.

A lot can be saved through dynamic arrangements but if the track doesn´t move enough air, i don´t play it!

Quality comes with price and i would advice to use mastering houses familiar with your style or at least be careful with your master limiters!!

Toby

[DBarbarulo]

another point to the api2500, great character on dance mixes.

DB

[inlinenl]

Passionmax .. i would consider the tubetech smc-2b ... because it's multiband it's almost like an EQ ... but then different ....

try it .. rent it ....

if you balance your mix ..... you won't need a limiter like an l2 ... or just to take the last 2 dB ... to get your average level


greetings wim

www.inlinemastering.com

[mac black]

I've had quite a few big club records and I would recommend The Phoenix by thermionic culture.
It lets your mix breath and pump and it cuts well on vinyl, sometimes just going through it is enough.
To get extra loud mixes try to work at 96/24, I find that I get louder and bigger mixes at higher sample rates/bit rates.

mac

[Reptil]

Originally Posted by mattssons

As i come from the other side of the fence, a dj turned into recording /mix engineer and still play 3 nights a week to pay the bills my advice would be as follows.

Yes, you need level, but dynamics are more important, paralell compression is the solution. On a dance track, it´s important to have a clear, defined bass because we run some powerful systems and you don´t need as much bass as you would think.

My problem nowdays is not so much that cd´s clip but that they are limited to death.
They just not move any air, i see cones stand still no matter how "loud" These releases sound great on 5" speakers and on the radio but on a club system, no way.

A lot can be saved through dynamic arrangements but if the track doesn´t move enough air, i don´t play it!

Quality comes with price and i would advice to use mastering houses familiar with your style or at least be careful with your master limiters!!

Toby

Yessir, couldn't agree more. thumbsup

[passionmax]

Hi,
Why would 96k make your mixes louder. I am using the dangerous 2bus analog summing. I thought the extra headroom would help. Also I just read a mastering article saying that when you rpint to Analog 2" you can get 6db louder than digital. is this true. would 96k compensate for this or how about those analog plugins

[majool]

in regards to the 1969, don't forget about the tube bass di that comes with it. sick distortion for bass and leads. comes in handy...

[demonfuzz]

For Hip Hop, you can use just about any damn thing.

But I would lean towards older DBX comps.

You can use some pretty low end stuff with good results, even the very un-slutty 3630.

APi 2500, 1176, Distressors, etc... on the higher end.

Hell I frequently use an old pair of 163 compressor (the simple Over/Easy one, with the slider).


For todays crispy digital age plastic sounding rap / pop / dance, just use plug-ins.

[rara114]

Originally Posted by Rush909

the problem with dance music at clubs these days is not only the limiting thing... it's the doing everything ITB by an increasing array of kids with nothing but a computer... atleast it used to be that you had to have some money to buy some equipment... as you collect equipment you are getting better at mixing/making music... Now any kid with $2000 and an internet connection to download some cracked software can make Dance music... and for the most part it sounds like it!

r.

SO True....

Its al about the ear, experience, gear selection, room, monitors

you have to put your time in.... too many want "just add water" mixes...

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by superburtm

Dj's that don't understand singal flow drive me out of mind! Loud is one thing, distorted clipped and 0 headroom are another. Records are already smashed these days don't smash them again. Hang the Dj!

Yeah,I,ve found this to be true more often than not..My best friend owns a club here in LA with a great sound system..
Some of these so called DJ's guys are blowin Sh*t up left and right[especially speakers].can't tell you how many times I get a late night emergency tech call because some moron "Mixer" tried to F*ck with the amps/crossovers,limiters in the house system and fried something in the process.
I'm not saying they're all idiots..but few really do understand the gear or the concept of signal flow/gain staging.

Anyways ,if you want your track to actually resemble music as oppossed to a distorted clipping plug in mess, ..the Thermionic Rocks

also the older SSL, Smart C-2 will do.
The new Rolls music comp looks like a contender.
as well as an ME who knows what's up.

[RoundBadge]

Originally Posted by Rush909

the problem with dance music at clubs these days is not only the limiting thing... it's the doing everything ITB by an increasing array of kids with nothing but a computer... atleast it used to be that you had to have some money to buy some equipment... as you collect equipment you are getting better at mixing/making music... Now any kid with $2000 and an internet connection to download some cracked software can make Dance music... and for the most part it sounds like it!

r.

Yep ...So true stike

[mata_haze]

hi verybody...hthid topic is REALLY interesting as I am going to cut a dance track on vinyl..
to be honest I am pretty confused as I am going to master( or pre-master) the track and take it then to a cutting house ..
my question is:
as someone said about side chain the mix to compress only when need it...how does that work?how would you side chain the mix to get a proper LOUD bass sound and leave the rest untouched?
also: how would you eq and compress to adapt to vinyl?
I know is a HUGE subject but i hope someone will be able top spread some light on it..!
thank you very much!

[Reptil]

there was, and is still a number of vinyl cutters.
some good, some excellent.
now really some short advice: (just got back from a gig< g3earslutz calls@)
bass,, mono, no phase shˆtss
highs: too high is too high
mids: baby that's the game

vinyl is awesome!