Rigid fiberglass ala Ethan...

[AlexLakis]

I've been trying to buy some rigid fiberglass, but all the places I've tried that say they carry Owens-Corning stuff don't. Where have other slutz gotten their 703/705-FRK? Also, Ethan sites in his article that there are cheaper alternatives from companies like Knauf, Armstrong, and Delta. Does anybody have experience with these? If so, what model numbers would correspond with the 703/705-FRK? Been on the phone all day with insulators/lumber stores...gettin frusterated here...

[Matt Reckinger]

I've used the 703 and the thicker one , I guess it was 705, and found it at an insulation supplier or wholesaler . They didn't have any problem selling to end user as long as I drove down to the warehouse. always had to buy by the case but the case was 2ft by 4 ft by 2 foot high.
Usually glued it on soundboard backing from a home store, and covered it with white burlap from a fabric store. Atttaching the burlap to the backing can be a trick but a staple gun combined with some strong tape has held up well.
I made about 25 4x4 s for a church one time and it really improved the sound. Blind musicians even commented on the sound of the church --sight unseen.

[smk]

Same situation here in Hawaii. Hard to find. Might just end up buying some Auralex bass traps instead...

[kenny_popper]

Just spent the last couple of months researching this subject, and my studio is totally "reborn". I built several acoustical panels using 703 and 705 FRK, 2 and 4 inch. What a difference...!!!

Try calling 1-800-GET-PINK...(Owens-Corning). and they wii direct you to the nearest dealer in your locale. I found a dealer in Hamden,Ct. and the prices are very resonable.

I also remember that Ethan has a thread on his Acoustical Design page addressing this subject.

Best,


Kenny

[john caldwell]

These folks are in Pittsburgh so I deal with them:

General Insulation Services
(412) 771-8860
23 Furnace Street Ext
MC Kees Rocks, PA 15136

[r0ck1r0ck2]

i have 1-800-GET-PINK on speed dial

here's the link to the thread on Ethans page

Right Here

[Glenn Kuras]

"Usually glued it on soundboard backing from a home store, and covered it with white burlap from a fabric store. Atttaching the burlap to the backing can be a trick but a staple gun combined with some strong tape has held up well."


You really do not want to cover the back of the panel.. It might be ok if it is a first reflection panel but if you cover the back and not space it off the wall it is not going to reach the low end. So those panels you made are not really bass traps. sorry to tell you that.. :(
Actually the best thing is to straddle corners..


Glenn

[MJGreene Audio]

The Knauf and Johns-Manville equals work great. They may be just a bit cheaper than the Owens Corning and might be easier to find. Make sure to look in the phone book under insulation and find a commercial supplier. I imagine there should be one in every big or bigger city. If I can find multiple suppliers in Salt Lake City then you should be able to in bigger city near you.

Good luck,
Michael Greene

[AlexLakis]

Yeah, I'm familiar with Ethan's site, and have called 1-800-Get-Pink, and called all the locations they listed and NONE of them had Owens-Corning stuff, or any of their equivalents. Guess they need to update their database...

Michael, do you have product numbers/names for the Knauf and/or Johns-Manville rigid fiberglass? What would be equivalent to the 703 and 705-FRK specifically? I'm interested in alternatives, especially if they're cheaper and do just as good a job.

[r0ck1r0ck2]

i usually don't get that far...i just dial 800-GET-PINK and start panting like a dog...

[AlexLakis]

I think you've been panting in too much fiberglass fibers...

[Musiclab]

Originally Posted by AlexLakis

Yeah, I'm familiar with Ethan's site, and have called 1-800-Get-Pink, and called all the locations they listed and NONE of them had Owens-Corning stuff, or any of their equivalents. Guess they need to update their database...

Michael, do you have product numbers/names for the Knauf and/or Johns-Manville rigid fiberglass? What would be equivalent to the 703 and 705-FRK specifically? I'm interested in alternatives, especially if they're cheaper and do just as good a job.

Knauf calls it insulation board, they make a 3lb density which is equal to 703
and a 6lb which is equal to 705. Look up insulation suppliers, you won't find it at a home depot

[MJGreene Audio]

I would try what Music Lab said. Call and tell them you want 3 pound density RIGID Fiberglass and make sure they understand its rigid. Also try calling it duct board. If they start talking about rolls or things like non stardard sizes then tell them to put down the crack pipe and start looking at their books. The most common sizes are 1" 2" 4" thickness' and they should come in 2x4 or 4x8 foot sheets. They will either have no backing or an FSK backing. If you really get someone who knows what they are talking about you might ask them about getting the edges dipped and hardened. This will make wrapping a breeze but only in a 2" or 4" thickness. It will cost a little more and the FSK might cost a little more but again it will make wrapping them much easier.

I also agree to bypass any Home Depot or Lowes. They never have and never will carry it. You will probably only find it at a wholesale insulation/construction supplier.

Its amazing that this stuff gets used every day in ductwork and buildings but it actually is so hard to track down. I had the same problems in the beginning until I got a little hip to their lingo then it was pretty easy.

Good luck and let me know how it goes.
Michael Greene

[r0ck1r0ck2]

yeah
try getting concrete dye....

they'e all kinds of industrial suppliers in this world
they're usually in creepy gravel parking lots....
one story abominations....
security glass doors/windows...
scarrey!!!
you have to wonder what they''re hiding in the back room

check the inner suburbs....

and yes i huff mad lead pain....

[john caldwell]

Slightly OT: What do you all use to tack fabric to panels of 703 when buillding gobos?

John-

[Glenn Kuras]

Spray mount should work pretty well...

[AlexLakis]

Originally Posted by r0ck1r0ck2

they'e all kinds of industrial suppliers in this world
they're usually in creepy gravel parking lots....
one story abominations....
security glass doors/windows...
scarrey!!!
you have to wonder what they''re hiding in the back room.

So true...The old Johnson Lumber place was on the corner of a busy intersection in Annapolis...scary looking building, and huge gravel parking lot with the biggest potholes I've ever seen. How you get potholes in a gravel parking lot, I have no idea, they were just there. The brave would sometimes try to cut thru the lot to avoid the light at the corner. Some were sucked into the potholes, never to return...some lived to tell the tale...Too bad Johnson lumber itself couldn't survive, and now they're putting in more condos. More friggin traffic to worry about!!

Okay, enough ranting, I'm going to try to track down some semi-local insulation places and asking about insulation/duct board. I'll call on Monday. Time to get my party on! (You say it's your birthday? I'm my birthday too, yeah!)

[20to20]

Originally Posted by r0ck1r0ck2

and yes i huff mad lead pain....

Is that an Eno anagram...?

[djui5]

I used this stuff in my room.


http://www.thermafiber.com

They make "sound insulation fire blankets" that are mineral wool, fire rated for something like 2 hrs, and are for acoustic purposes.

I paid $50 for 12 2feet by 4feet, 2inch thick panels. It's not quite as hard condensed as 703 I think, but it works for me.

Here is the PDF

http://www.thermafiber.com/pdfs/SAFB.pdf


Just ask them where a local dealer is and they'll point you in the right direction

http://www.thermafiber.com/thermContact/index2.htm

[Matt Reckinger]

Originally Posted by myfipie

"Usually glued it on soundboard backing from a home store, and covered it with white burlap from a fabric store. Atttaching the burlap to the backing can be a trick but a staple gun combined with some strong tape has held up well."


You really do not want to cover the back of the panel.. It might be ok if it is a first reflection panel but if you cover the back and not space it off the wall it is not going to reach the low end. So those panels you made are not really bass traps. sorry to tell you that.. :(
Actually the best thing is to straddle corners..


Glenn

I Know , I wasn't making bass traps. Just parallel wall absorbtion down the side walls. The stuff has absorbtion coefficients rolling off around 250 hz and with the soundboard backing it might absorb pretty flat down to 125 hz. This is when flat mounted against surface.
So no need to be sorry.
Matt

[Glenn Kuras]

Actually if you could take the back off and space the panel off the wall it will increase the high end.. Take a look at our absorption report on our site, between "A" mounting and "J" (recommended wall mounting).. You will see the high end is better with spaced off the wall. This is caused from sound being able to get behind the panel also. But the way you did it I am sure is fine, just wanted to clarify a little.

[AlexLakis]

Please see http://gearslutz.com/board/showthrea...501#post503501 for an extended discussion on options discussed here. Thank you all for your input! thumbsup