monitoring quiet... HOW quiet?

[u b k]

i'm working on getting my threshold of sensitivity lower, but there seems to be a floor for making critical decisions.

right now, i can't do any critical adjustments if the mix is quieter than 70db, especially eq. i expect i could push that lower with practice, but i'm curious how quiet ye of the quiet ilk like to listen?

i'm still a sucker for 80-85db, though i recognize the benefits of getting the mix to sing at lower volumes. i find that as i get further and further along into the mix i can continue to drop the volume and fine tune, but in the beginning i need things to HIT me.

and you?


gregoire
del ubik

[AlexLakis]

I usually monitor at a decent level. I'll also test the mix out at a very low volume, and also at a moderate volume from across the room, and an adjacent room. Sometimes, when I'm trying to find a good balance for my bass drum and bass guitar, I'll turn the volume up and put my hand on the woofer and try to feel the balance. That's really the only time my monitors get very loud. Well, that, and when there are hip hop clients in the studio.

I agree, tho, there does seem to be a threshold for monitoring level for me, mostly pertaining to bass. Whether this has to do more with my hearing or the monitors themselves, I'm not sure. I'm curious now, perhaps I'll figure out the db level where I like to mix at...

[bobby yarrow]

I tend to the final drum/vox/other balance at a very low level, probably under 45db. Vocal in particular tends to be hard for me to get right at my normal monitoring level, which is up around 85db. And I start most mixing sessions by opening it up, turning off my DAW monitor, and listening to the whole song at thumping volume from across the room.

[zetterstroem]

http://www.allchurchsound.com/ACS/edart/fmelc.html

[u b k]

Originally Posted by bobby yarrow

I tend to the final drum/vox/other balance at a very low level, probably under 45db.

good lord, my meter doesn't go below 50.

that's QUIET!


gregoire
del ubik

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by AlexLakis

I agree, tho, there does seem to be a threshold for monitoring level for me, mostly pertaining to bass. Whether this has to do more with my hearing or the monitors themselves, I'm not sure. I'm curious now, perhaps I'll figure out the db level where I like to mix at...

Its called the Fletcher Munson curve.

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by u b i k

and you?


gregoire
del ubik

79db here.

Have been doing it for years.

It doesn't come naturally though.

I have to literally force myself into it.

Once i am there and my ears adjust i don't notice it anymore.

[juicemaster1500]

I like to go up and down in volume, from really loud to really really low and eveything in between.

[absrec]

I heard Andy Wallace mixes at some pretty low levels. That's what made me want to see what it was all about. For the longest time, I thought that if I mixed at low volumes, my mixes would be too bright and abrasive and at high volumes, I could get nice punchy, warm mixes. Quite the opposite, IME.

I forced myself to do a mix start to finish at a below normal listening level and found the results stunning. Things were a little brighter and more in your face but still smooth. Think about it... If you can hear everything at a low level, then you'll definitely be able to hear everything at a higher one. And the other thing I found was that not only were the levels of each instrument more consistent and even, the frequency ranges were as well. Sure, the vocals and guitars were brighter, but the low mids and bass were right there to balance all of that out. This method of monitoring changed my life.

The other thing that helped significantly was getting an acoustician to get my mix room straightened out. Once I did that and found the correct monitor placement, I could hear the lowest of lows without having to crack the monitors. Now the only time I crank it up is when I'm tracking and at the end of a mix when the band comes in to hear the final product.

[the1Hub]

it did take a while but ive got really comfortable at 80-83db. i bought a spl meter and would set my monitor at 80 db. it made a huge diffrence in how well i could actualy use eq and make other proper sonic desicions.

whoever said they mix at 45db thats crazy. at that level your getting really close to the ambient noise floor of a normal room. are you working at home or in a studio. even at a studio that barely audible enough to make any sonic deciesions. i had a friend that use to set his vocal level by turning everything down till it was just noise and then bring the vocals up in the mix so that he could just begin to make out the words. i tried it but the mix never translated well as far as the balance was concerned.

[7rojo7]

Originally Posted by the1Hub

i had a friend that use to set his vocal level by turning everything down till it was just noise and then bring the vocals up in the mix so that he could just begin to make out the words. i tried it but the mix never translated well as far as the balance was concerned.

I do this, it works for me 100%.
I do it before I start the automation.
I tend to start the mix with the vocals and bass, as those are 2 elements that have to be smack on. Once I have the power set, I balance these at the lowest level possible. I'll check from time to time as the mix progresses.
Inversely occasionally I blast it to see if there's something that sticks out too much when it's loud and treat that like I should.
I also check Headphones for the dark side of the moon factor and the 3D factor (Panning seems like it's in front of you and not over your head)

[Anderson]

this worked fine IMHO:

Mixing @ 80dB" (My RTA reading 80dB in the sweet spot with uncorrelated pink noise in both speakers)

Listening to CDs @ 71dB (same stuff, to listen to mastered CD & somehow compare a bit my mixes at more or less the same spl)

Tracking @ 83dB (...)

Works for me...

[Bob Ross]

I'm a big proponent of listening moderately quietly, and occasionally *REALLY* quietly, but rather than making changes or committing to mix moves when I'm monitoring down that low, I simply make a mental note of what I want to do. Then I bring it back up to 80 or 85dB SPL before making the actual move. IOW, if I think "kick drum needs to come down" when I'm monitoring quietly I'll bring the monitor level up before taking the kick drum down. That way the aesthetic choices are gut-driven, but the *amount* by which changes are made are all referenced to a more-or-less standard.

"more-or-less" being the operative phrase there...

[Drumsound]

I spend most of the mix around 70-75 db. At a certain point, right near the end I move to 80-85 which is the "Fletcher-Munson sweet spot." I do a couple tweaks there and I'm pretty close to done at that point.

During the process I'll vary the volume some, but not a lot. Maybe one listen her nad one listen there. I always do a relly doft listen and a really loud listen from outside the control room.

[bobby yarrow]

Originally Posted by the1Hub

whoever said they mix at 45db thats crazy. at that level your getting really close to the ambient noise floor of a normal room. are you working at home or in a studio. even at a studio that barely audible enough to make any sonic deciesions. i had a friend that use to set his vocal level by turning everything down till it was just noise and then bring the vocals up in the mix so that he could just begin to make out the words. i tried it but the mix never translated well as far as the balance was concerned.

Well, that was me, so here goes. First off, my meter doesn't go below 50, so I'm guessing. My understanding is that a whisper at 5 meters is 30 db, and normal conversation can range from 40 to 60 db.

There is no difference to my ears monitoring at 80 or 83 db. The balance sounds the same, the later is just a little louder. And, hell, I move around the room, or lean back, and that changes the balance much more than 3db on the volume knob. What's interesting is the balance at very low levels and very high levels. And my point is, I set the vocal level at very low playback volume.

[7rojo7]

reverbs sound different. at high levels you might not notice the drowning factor.
I have a different set of speaker or cans for each of my levels, I even listen to cans from far away.