Wunder PAFOUR - Who tried it?

[Marjan]

Here's the baby.
Thoughts from users please...

[Marjan]

Ok... too new to get opinions...
Let me throw the other contenders from my research then:

API 3124(+)
Great River MP-4M
Daking Mic Pre IV

Anyone have used/compared these...? Any other suggestions?
Your help will be much appreciated.
Thanks...

[natpub]

allow me to be the first to say:

--what budget?
--what expected application?
--what kind of music?
---etc.

[McPhaul]

I was looking at it last night on Vintage King. It's only a couple hundred more than the single channel channel strip. No EQ but from what I've heard about the Pre's I am thinking I may want one. It's around the same money as a 3124+, so not out of line money-wise. The link is below.

http://www.vintageking.com/s.nl/sc.13/id.5240/.f


Will

[Marjan]

Originally Posted by natpub

allow me to be the first to say:

--what budget?
--what expected application?
--what kind of music?
---etc.

I beg your pardon, I should have posted during day time...

Price: up to $3500 / €2800

Applications: Acoustic Guitar, Miced Electric Guitar Amps and Drums

Style: Pop and Rock 80% of the time; the other 20% will be Jazz, Fusion and Classical

Thanks...

[indie]

I used the peq1r's on kick and snare --- I'm sold. The wunder is definitely my next pre/eq purchase. The sound was big...different tone than the 1073's I used on the rest of the kit, but same quality of sound. I actually liked it better that day than the neves.
Good luck!
Micah

[Marjan]

I'm actually more inclined to the PAFOUR... having the PEQ as my point of reference... very much the sound I like to deal with.

But by the way, is the 3124 the same as 4 x 312, 4 x 512, or neither?
Anyone knows that?
I know the 512, and I find it fairly open. But I don't know the 312...

[natpub]

Originally Posted by Marjan

I'm actually more inclined to the PAFOUR... having the PEQ as my point of reference... very much the sound I like to deal with.

But by the way, is the 3124 the same as 4 x 312, 4 x 512, or neither?
Anyone knows that?
I know the 312, and I find it quite open and just a tad bright. But I don't know the 512...

3124=312x4

[RoundBadge]

I have a pair of PEQ-1r's alongside a bunch of other cool pre's
[neve 1073's/84's,Daking,chandler,etc,etc,etc]

Never track drums without em. thumbsup thumbsup thumbsup

[Wunderkap]

I was PM'ed asking if the PAFOUR pres were the same as the PEQ1/PEQ1R. If you look at the PEQ1 Circuit board, the PREamp is on one side and the EQ is the other side. We took the exact PREamp side PCB artwork, right from the CAD file, copied and pasted it four times in a row on one very large board, 17"x 6.6". We took the exact circuit board parts from the Building Materials List from the PEQ1R and ordered the PAFOUR parts. We used the same Vintage Allotrope transformers, custom wound from England, probably the most unique and expensive trafos for this application hands down. We even used the same British hookup wire used in the PEQ1R. You even get the very costly Elma, 22 position mic/line rotary knob which is custom made for us in Switzerland. Everything is identical down to the C&K toggle switches and Neutrik XLR's & 1/4" jack. The Black Box PSU is the same one that runs the PEQ1R's.
It made sense not to screw with anything in the PEQ1R because it is a proven design and who wants to re-tool or resource any parts, it took years finding the best parts for the PEQ1R. Most importantly it is Calss-A and discrete (without IC's). Be very careful, I just read some stuff on another manufacturers website where it said "Class A is not important to sound quality and IC's are OK to save space). It's not true, I heard the difference, its night and day. Try changing the Class-A Fender Tweed or Marshall to A/B and make the same circuit with IC's.
But, we did add a couple of changes as we are always full of mischief when we have time on our hands.
1) We designed a Clip LED for each channel, you don't really need it but some people asked to add it.
2) Ultra importantly, we decided to go with the full "Line Input" Circuitry used in the PEQ1R which gives you the full 60dB of line input gain which actually goes into the "Mic" level so you can plug instruments into it or even use it as a 2nd micpre on for each of the 4 channels. This gain stage is well known on the PEQ1R as a way of recording direct-in instruments with a shocking amount of power, detail and warmth (this is talked about in most of the reviews of the PEQ1R which you can read on our website). Originally we going to make a little DI circuit going into the mic pre and delete the "Line In" stage but in after-thought I decided I wanted the full Line-In which is unprecedented in any mic-pre on the market. (I can be wrong here because I do not know all the new stuff out there. Please reply if you can share your knowledge of other micpre's w/ a full "Line Input" signal path, I'd like to know.)
This "Line In" switch has 11 positions and like on the PEQ1R the first seven positions are for coming back from tape and the last four positions are for instruments. So you can come back from multitrack or DAW to warm up your sounds with discrete Class-A sounds with huge output transformers.
Here's the real DOOGIE...We added an extra boost when going out into 600 ohms by adding a Wunderlike gain stage at the very end of the output circuitry just before the transformer by adding a pair of very cool 2N3053 transistors (same transistors used in the output of the LANG PEQ2). The way we did this was transparent sonically but it senses the 600 ohm load like drives it like Godzilla.
I CANT beleive how wordy I am for just waking up...I'll probably read this when I fully wake up and cringe. AAHH!!

http://www.wunderaudio.com/

[Marjan]

Originally Posted by Wunderkap

It made sense not to screw with anything in the PEQ1R because it is a proven design and who wants to re-tool or resource any parts, it took years finding the best parts for the PEQ1R. Most importantly it is Calss-A and discrete (without IC's).

Thanks for the details Mike...

Now, let me take it to another level:
Would you be able to distinguish the PAFOUR from the PEQ-1 in a blind test? I mean, does the man himself hear a difference?
The PAFOUR could sound even 'better', but that's not my point.
The PEQ-1 is great, even without EQ, and I just want to figure out whether I can have four of them in a single 1U rack mountable box.

Cheers everyone for your thoughts...

[Wunderkap]

Phil Spector would even say they were the same even before he was suffering withdrawal symptoms from seven prescription drugs.

[Paul David]

Nice rack!

[aardvark]

Originally Posted by Wunderkap

...Here's the real DOOGIE...We added an extra boost when going out into 600 ohms by adding a Wunderlike gain stage ...drives it like Godzilla.

So...in lay terms...this thing goes211???


Cheers,
Aardvark

[Marjan]

Originally Posted by Wunderkap

Phil Spector would even say they were the same even before he was suffering withdrawal symptoms from seven prescription drugs.

Ok... thumbsup