How do you melodyne vocals that are pretty in tune but are still not perfect?

[ddeez]

i have a song that i produced that i recorded the vox on and i autotuned the vox (in auto mode) and they sound good but they still dont sound perfect. So when i'm in Melodyne it's not like i need to change the note to an entirely different pitch but each note isn't perfect the whole way thru...so how do i get each note perfectly in tune? thanks a lot in advance! much appreciated.

[studiostuff]

I don't use any "auto" (automatically tune) mode.

I LISTEN to the original vocal and only tune the areas that are out-of-tune. (After first getting enough vocal takes to comp a nice vocal using pieces of actual vocal takes instead of tuned or repaired pieces.)

Then I cut the tuned/repaired pieces into the original vocal comp and do tiny cross-fades between the repair and real vocal... until I can listen to the vocal "soloed" and not hear the repairs come and go.

This method lets the song keep the areas where the real vocal works and only uses the repairs as needed. Cuts way down on folks detecting the repairs.

In my opinion, it's pretty easy to hear a vocal that has been tuned all the way. And, I don't like that sound.

Having said all this, nothing beats a one-pass vocal take that works as it was sung. (Work with better singers...)

[s.d.finley]

If you produced the track, you should know what notes the vocalist should be singing. Drag the wrong notes to the right note spot.

[eascholz]

studiostuff has a great point. It's really important you only use correction in areas that need it, and sparingly. I have noticed that melodyne can take a crap ton of the tone away from a vocal (no high end!).

[RockManDan]

if your tuned notes are not sounding quite right with the track could it be that your instruments/backing are out of tune slightly. I had this problem once dealing with a vocal that i couldn't seem to get in tune even with autotune and turns out it was the gutiar that was in tune with itself just a little flat.

[ddeez]

thanks for the responses. right now i'm trying to learn how to use melodyne to perfect vocals out of good but not perfect takes. i understand it's ideal to get perfect takes but thats not the situation at hand. keep the responses coming! thanks!!

Rock man dan....the instruments are in key..

[peeweedrummer]

if there are notes that dip down gradually i don't just level out the whole note, i cut that note up with the splice tool into little sections and auto fix all the sections. this keeps some vibrato in there. also just isolating the middle of a note and not treating the intro and exit of each note keeps it a bit more real.

[ddeez]

great idea peewee! i gotta try that. when i see the squiggly line inside of waveform what does that mean? is my note not staying perfectly in key?

[AnthonyRochester]

my annoying answer to the question is: don't

[FeatheredSerpent]

Can you post up a short clip so we can hear what your idea of 'a note that is perfectly in key' sounds like?
And then a clip with a phrase that you need to correct also?
If people can see what you're aiming for, you might get more suggestions.

When you say you produced the track, you mean you recorded it and the vocals are your own, right?

[12ax7]

The best thing you can do before you try artificial tuning of any sort is to listen to something like "Every Picture Tells a Story" by Rod Stewart (or some other example of the triumph of the "right" pitch over the "perfect" pitch).



Melodyne or AutoTune would RUIN this track!

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by ddeez

thanks for the responses. right now i'm trying to learn how to use melodyne to perfect vocals out of good but not perfect takes. i understand it's ideal to get perfect takes but thats not the situation at hand. keep the responses coming! thanks!!

Rock man dan....the instruments are in key..

I would never run a vocal through 2 types of pitch correction, except in extreme cases. I know people do...and although you can get away with it in a busy arrangement or in robot pop, it sounds pretty dire.

I would go back to the original untuned vocal and either use autotune in graphic mode (and just fix the notes that need fixing, although if you're doing tight pop/rnb that could be all of them!) or use melodyne and start again either fix the notes that need it or tune the lot by a percentage (and then fix the dodgy bits).

I'm also of the opinion that Melodyne f**ks the top end, but I'm gradually coming round to the idea that the speed of it for BVs means that's a sacrifice that has to be made.

Either that, or pay someone else to get good results for you!

[12ax7]

Originally Posted by psycho_monkey

<snip>
Either that, or pay someone else to get good results for you!

I remember a time when the person you were paying for good results was the singer!

[psycho_monkey]

Originally Posted by 12ax7

I remember a time when the person you were paying for good results was the singer!

...it's the style though isn't it? no one's ever been able to sing in the current pop/rnb style - hence the reason everyone doing this sounds awful live.

[RoyJeeBiv]

what peewee offered is great advice -- chopping up the 'blob' into smaller pieces so Melodyne can detect the pitch (or percentage of pitch) better.

the wavy line indicates pitch modulation. if you have a really worbly (sp?? word??) singer, or a particular passage has a bit too much vibrato, you can use the Pitch Modulation tool to 'flatten' it a bit. (i'd caution you to use it sparingly...just try taking all the vibrato out of a pitch so that line is flat, and you'll see what i mean!!)

putting it into practice, if you have one really large 'blob' that you know contains more than one pitch, try chopping at the peaks of the modulation line (where those other pitches are) and Melodyne should recognize that there should be separate notes and will adjust accordingly. the more you do it, the better you get at finding where the right spots are to chop. hopefully that made sense...

the other thing you'll really want to master with Melodyne is the Pitch Drift (the 'slope' transition between notes) -- you want to find the right drift at either end of each note, otherwise you might end up with a slow dip up/down or Cher effect. the Formant stuff can be helpful also, especially with singers who have a tendency to get nasaly with certain vowels, or giving BGVs a different tone.

it's a slick program, but it won't work magic -- it can really suck the life out of a performance if you aren't careful, and you need a decent vocalist in the first place. in moderation, with a good/great singer, it can be extremely useful.

(or you could just pay me to do it, like pscyho_monkey suggested...)

[hipass]

Just because it's in tune does not mean it will not suck

[12ax7]

Originally Posted by hipass

Just because it's in tune does not mean it will not suck

...So to put it mathematically, the inverse of the suck-factor is non-relative to the "tuning" prescribed by the program.

[FeatheredSerpent]

This whole thread and the motive behind the OP just makes me want to scream! (In an organic, not perfectly in tune kind of way).

[eascholz]

Originally Posted by 12ax7

The best thing you can do before you try artificial tuning of any sort is to listen to something like "Every Picture Tells a Story" by Rod Stewart (or some other example of the triumph of the "right" pitch over the "perfect" pitch).

Melodyne or AutoTune would RUIN this track!

I'm sorry, but it hurts to listen to that song... Something has gone terribly wrong with the tuning of everything, plus the dynamics are whacked out...

[quantumpsych]

How do you melodyne vocals that are pretty in tune but are still not perfect?

you don't.

[12ax7]

Originally Posted by eascholz

I'm sorry, but it hurts to listen to that song... Something has gone terribly wrong with the tuning of everything, plus the dynamics are whacked out...

Yep. I'll admit its a pretty extreme example.

But I think the tuning went WONDERFULLY "wrong." ...And yeah, the dynamics ARE pretty wacky (but I like it)!

I just hope the next "go-to" tuning plugin gets a more descriptive name: I kinda like 'Pitch****'!

[quantumpsych]

Originally Posted by 12ax7

Yep. I'll admit its a pretty extreme example.

But I think the tuning went WONDERFULLY "wrong." ...And yeah, the dynamics ARE pretty wacky (but I like it)!

I just hope the next "go-to" tuning plugin gets a more descriptive name: I kinda like 'Pitch****'!

PITCH****! that has a seriously great ring to it... HA, get it.?. ring? all i'm saying is that engineers in EVERY genre, aside from ultra pop, need ought not to tune because a competant live performance is absolutely crucial.

as far as i know, auto tuning a live performance with recalled parameters developed durring the tracking therof, is not practical enough to be widely implemented. the cost of doing this would be insurmountable for most bands, but certainly not for top-tier major acts.

the only way the time domain automation could work is if the ENTIRE band is slaved to a click, after that, it seems like a nightmare to implement. is this where we are moving towards?

this is obviously better than dubed lipsync but is it THAT much better that it should be acceptable among the performers? if they say no to their managers and producers, are they really that susceptable to being dropped? am i really that naive?

[Musiclab]

To the OP, are you hearing the vocal as being out of tune? Or are you looking at it on a grid? A few observations of mine have been this, when I used to use AT if I was in a hurry and I used the auto mode I would find that there would be notes sharp.
But more importantly there is no perfectly in tune vocal that sounds like a human being sang it, sliding into a note, vibrato, they're used for interpretation, take away all of the modulation and really you're better off getting vocoder.

[GeorgeHayduke]

Originally Posted by FeatheredSerpent

This whole thread and the motive behind the OP just makes me want to scream! (In an organic, not perfectly in tune kind of way).

Yep I don't give a shit if its a bit out of tune, because neither does the listener. The listener wants human emotion, not perfection.

[detritusdave]

Big problem with recording/producing your vocals is that you are hypersensitive to anything which you could construe as being a 'flaw' in the performance. What have other people said about the performance?

[ddeez]

hey thanks very much for all the responses!! These aren't my vox these are a singers...i just wrote the song.

Here's the quality of vox i want...i hear these as being pretty much perfect.


YouTube - Chris Brown ft. Ester Dean - I Love You [No Tags]


RoyJeeBiv thanks for the great response much appreciated!

[The MPCist]

What's wrong with 'pretty in tune'? I think that would be okay enough to mix, no?

[FeatheredSerpent]

Originally Posted by ddeez

Here's the quality of vox i want...i hear these as being pretty much perfect.


YouTube - Chris Brown ft. Ester Dean - I Love You [No Tags]

I just don't get it. Maybe I missed the memo.

[Elk]

Originally Posted by ddeez

YouTube - Chris Brown ft. Ester Dean - I Love You [No Tags]

The vocals here (both main and backing) are deliberately processed and auto-tuned.

Do you want "in-tune" or do you want the sound of the vocals?

Perhaps post a bit of the vocal you have and let people listen to it and provide suggestions.

[ddeez]

ok here's a snippet....thanks in advance!


zSHARE - DA_Now Or Never-unmixed DA.mp3