The Kings New Clothes......

[tune_smith]

I love reading these various *pro-audio* fora......
It's all Kings new Clothes and that is a fact.

NS10s?

Come on all ready...

"Translate well"?

What does that mean?

Translate well to other studios using pile of shit NS10s?
Shit sound is still shit sound....

Dynaudios?

Tell me where the bass response is on a BM6a below 50hz...
None.....
NS10?
Lucky if you get anything below 80hz...
So come on why not admit the fraud.

Stop the "translates well" bullshit and start mixing with some real monitors.
PMC, high end JBL, EVENT, and others...

Why propagate a total lie, like NS10's mean anything other than a white woofer on top of a console.

My god, you might as well be mixing on a pair of Raedio Shack speakers and in fact maybe that's not a bad idea.

You people are tone deaf if you think NS10 and Dynaudio translate well...
Translate to what?

Another system run by yet another tone deaf person?

THanks but no thanks...

[warhead]

Do you mean the Emperor's new clothes? Anyhow, the hype isn't so bad considering I sold a pair of NS10 on eBay recently for $700 but since those are gone yeah, talk shit all ya want now.

Why are you ducking into GS and talking all crazy like everybody's an idiot here? Two posts in a row about how everyone here is a fraud and a loser and can't hear?

War

[Gregg Sartiano]

I'm not even gonna gratify that with a response. Oops -- just did.

[Fredrik]

[krs]

tune_smith is walters. Pay the man the respect he has rightfully earned

[toolskid]

Originally Posted by tune_smith

I love reading these various *pro-audio* fora......
It's all Kings new Clothes and that is a fact.

NS10s?

Come on all ready...

"Translate well"?

What does that mean?

Translate well to other studios using pile of shit NS10s?
Shit sound is still shit sound....

Dynaudios?

Tell me where the bass response is on a BM6a below 50hz...
None.....
NS10?
Lucky if you get anything below 80hz...
So come on why not admit the fraud.

Stop the "translates well" bullshit and start mixing with some real monitors.
PMC, high end JBL, EVENT, and others...

Why propagate a total lie, like NS10's mean anything other than a white woofer on top of a console.

My god, you might as well be mixing on a pair of Raedio Shack speakers and in fact maybe that's not a bad idea.

You people are tone deaf if you think NS10 and Dynaudio translate well...
Translate to what?

Another system run by yet another tone deaf person?

THanks but no thanks...

hmmm another bile filled crazy, loose on the boards - perfect - if you keep going you might steal my position

ns10s are extremely useful speakers - if you know how to use them - they are also VERY revealing when dealing with the bottom-end of mixes.


oh and yes... I'm 'tone-deaf'.....definitely....fo sho..werd

[djui5]

tune_smith,
Did you change your GS name or do I know you from another forum? I don't remember you being this anal retentive...

[doorknocker]

I think that if you manage to get past the original poster's tone (and so what, it's only A POST, don't get so sensitive about it!) well, then I would totally agree with him.

He talks about 'translation' and in that sense he's right IMO, NS-10s are crap speakers that you have to learn to 'read'. For some reason, they also became a 'studio standard' and so everybody was able to 'translate' in a similar vein.

Django Reinhardt played some of the most amazing music ever with few functional fingers of his fretting hand. Does that mean that it's AN ADVANTAGE for a guitar player to be handicapped?


My belief is that you have to learn to 'read' ANY speaker, or rather any speaker as performing in your room. For me it's a sub-less Genelec 1029A setup, for a lot of folks it's NS-10s.

Anyway, I think it's time to move on. Obviously people that always used NS-10 want to continue to use them. Big deal. I know that a bazillion great albums were mixed on them.

But to PAY BIG BUCKS for NS-10s in a 'vintage rarity' sense, now THAT'S totally ridiculous and in that sense I have to agree with the original poster, may he be cynically-minded or not....

A happy sunday to y'all

[Jorg]

First of all:

The Ns-10s are not mastering speakers!! So they dont have to be 100% flat and they dont have to have a frequency range from 20Hz to 20kHz.

I personally dont like them either. But talking about monitors for mixing can be like talking about colours!

"Blue is great but yellow is shit!" "No you're wrong! Green is far better than blue!"
and so on and on

Its a lot about taste. Even though I dont like the NS-10s personally, I bet there are many songs out there that I love (the sound of) and they have been mixed with NS-10s

Phillip Newell (Famous acoutician and studio designer) wrote once an article in the resolution mag about the NS-10. He tried to find their "secret". Strange outcome was: Their frequency response was flatter when they were on top of a console than in the freefield.....I thought that was interesting!

[7 Hz]

Originally Posted by Jorg

Phillip Newell (Famous acoutician and studio designer) wrote once an article in the resolution mag about the NS-10. He tried to find their "secret". Strange outcome was: Their frequency response was flatter when they were on top of a console than in the freefield.....I thought that was interesting!

Well - they were designed as BOOKSHELF speakers, so no wonder they sound so light on top of a console, and lighter still free field.

The colour analogy is interesting, yet your reasoning is flawed. If we use light as the analogy, then white light is 'flat'. What NS10's do is cut out a lot of the deep red's and a lot of the violets, so we concentrate more on the yellow, green, and blue's. This is the point that the analogy breaks down and doesn't really mean anything... it's like saying you like looking at paintings in monocrome green light.

I have just had to get 'back into' using 10's, and I have to say, time hasn't been kind to them. The best thing I can say is, they make music sound so harsh you REALLY have to work at cutting shit out with EQ's to get a smooth sound, that will then sound super smooth on other speakers. But forget trying to mix ONLY on 10's, anyone that can judge what the 40hz is doing, or the 18K, must be using some majic (or another set of speakers). I CAN see they are maybe good at getting your midrange balance right on, but that's it.

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by 7 Hz

The colour analogy is interesting, yet your reasoning is flawed. If we use light as the analogy, then white light is 'flat'. What NS10's do is cut out a lot of the deep red's and a lot of the violets, so we concentrate more on the yellow, green, and blue's. This is the point that the analogy breaks down and doesn't really mean anything... it's like saying you like looking at paintings in monocrome green light.

I didnt want to compare sound to light!

My point was that debating about mixing (not mastering) monitors is like talking about taste. In the same way as different people like different colours!!!

Some guys love em and make fabulous mixes on them. So what good does it do when you prove them (based on a spec) that they are shite?

Some hate them and couldn't mix with them!
So why showing them a list which famous mixing engineers made which platinum records on them?


I think the NS-10 debate is like saying: Your girlfriend is ugly, you shouldn't date her!

[7 Hz]

Originally Posted by Jorg

Some guys love em and make fabulous mixes on them.

Make a great mix using ONLY 10's? I think this is fallacy myself. How can you mix the bass if you can't hear it? Re-read my post.

[Jorg]

Originally Posted by 7 Hz

Make a great mix using ONLY 10's? I think this is fallacy myself

LOL! You're funny!
I read your post! I'm not in the mood right now to google and research every No1 track thats been MIXED on NS-10s.
Could anyone here on the board maybe supply us with some examples please??

Don't get me wrong: I don't like em either and would never use them, not even for comparison.

U have to consider that not every music out there is drum n bass or hip hop with important frequeny content under 60Hz.

If there is any unwanted rumble going on there, then it could have still been easily removed in the mastering stage!


Additionally: If someone uses NS-10s 98% of his time and occasionally switches to something else for comparison reasons and then says in an interview "I used the NS-10s" then this is what people in general are talking about!

Of course u could be a smart-ass and say: "You liar, you also used blablabla and bliblibli every 3 hours for checking!" But I really dont think that that's the point here!

[Slipperman]

Originally Posted by 7 Hz

Make a great mix using ONLY 10's? I think this is fallacy myself. How can you mix the bass if you can't hear it? Re-read my post.

OK then.

Yer right.

It can't be done.

We put man on the moon.

Built the Great Wall of China.

Cured Polio.

But the NS-10 thing is a bridge too far.

Mankind has it's limitations.

SM.

[7 Hz]

Originally Posted by slipperman

Mankind has it's limitations.

As do 10's!



Look, I know lots of hit shit was mixed on 10's, my only point is that I bet it wasn't ONLY 10's they were mixed on. Yes, switching to the mains for 5 minutes an hour counts.

The only reason I say this is now the fallicy is so strong round here you get cats who beleive ALL YOU NEED is 10's to mix on, even if you are mixing R&B or house! This type of heresay turned religon does my head in, where people make blind decisions.

Sure, lots of hit records were mixed on 10's, but were they hit records BECAUSE of them, or DESPITE the 10's? It's a bit like saying that lots of hit records were recorded on RCA 44-BX mic's, or Akai s900 samplers, so that's all anyone should ever use, period. It's very flawed thinking. I would prefer that people had a more progressive and open attitude.

[max cooper]

Ok, guys. Time for a commercial

http://aestheti.com/dio.php

Make sure the NS10's are turned way up!

Originally Posted by tune_smith

I love reading these various *pro-audio* fora......
It's all Kings new Clothes and that is a fact.

NS10s?

Come on all ready...

"Translate well"?

So, where have you been reading? What's the point, that there are people writing myths about audio? I'm aghast!

Just don't try and convince me that wrestling is fake.

[djwayne]

Now for some real music, keep those NS-10's cranked up and check out Ashlee Simpson's new hit single...you can watch her new video too here at.........

http://www.ashleesimpsonmusic.com/

[Bob Olhsson]

NS-10s are like a ground glass camera viewfinder. They make it easy to tell if the musical balance and perspective is in focus. The transparency of better speakers make balance and perspective more ambiguous. Different bad sounding speakers simply don't translate as well. The fact that they work well as "reference speakers" was chance and not design.

The idea of a reference speaker is that you try to make a mix sound great on BOTH full range high resolution monitors AND the reference speaker. After years of using both, some people just use the NS-10s. I wouldn't ever recommend this to beginners.

[Jules]

DON'T try this at home folks!

[djwayne]

You can do this one at home, but don't hurt yourself.......click on link and scroll down a little................

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/themaestro.html

[Fredrik]

Originally Posted by djwayne

You can do this one at home, but don't hurt yourself.......click on link and scroll down a little................

http://www.big-boys.com/articles/themaestro.html

This shit was hilarious, still smiling..


Thanks djwayne

[thethrillfactor]

Originally Posted by 7 Hz

How can you mix the bass if you can't hear it? Re-read my post.

How?

By studying the excursions of the woofers.

When the bass is right and tight the woofer cones bounce in and out.

Sorta like a piston firing.

The excursions are mostly outwards.

When its too much bass the woofers crinkle and crumble with the excursions being mostly inwards.

Its and old trick.