Best way to spend $10,000 ?

[oulablank]

I never thought that I would be posting a thread like this ( not that I have a problem with posts like this ) I just always thought I was pretty good at determining priority. Turns out I'm not. It's just easier when you don't have much of a budget to work with and you buy piece by piece . I have an extra $10,000 I can devote to my home studio aside from my weekly / monthly $200 here- $500 there...ect. This is the first time that I've had this much money at one time to spend completely on pro audio so I'm a bit inundated with lists / price guides / reviews / recommendations / you get the idea.
What is my goal for this $10,000 ?

First off , I'm running PT LE. I know , I know. I've thought about it a while and I'm happy with all of my manual delay comp tips . One day I will go HD but for now , I'm looking to max out my LE system to the fullest. That's why I'm not posting in LOW END. Even though LE is low end I'm looking to buy high end converters / pres.
Even though $10,000 will only roughly cover 70% or so of my goal , my goal is tackling the pre amp / converter / few mic / and filling all my expanded I/O. I know that a good chunk of money needs to go into acoustics but I'm moving soon so I want to maximize my PT / 002 first. Here it goes

( Before you comment on why I have this over that , understand that it's been a long and bumpy low end road and an old partner has some pieces and I have some )

This is what I'm currently working with

20'' intel based imac / 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo / 4 GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM / running OS 10.4.11

Digidesign 002 console running PT LE 7.4 cs10
Music production toolkit

8 CH Presonus Digimax LT via lightpipe

2 CH S/PDIF - Currently unused

5-8 on the 002
5. Universal audio 6176 ( 610 side )
6. Empty
7. Behringer T1953 Ch 1
8. Behringer T1953 Ch 2

1 Neumann U87ai
2 Shure Beta 52a
1 Shure sm58 / 1 Shure beta58a
4 Shure sm57 / 1 Shure beta 57a
2 CAD GXL pencil condensers
1 MXL 990 condenser

Behringer Truth B2030A monitors

A whole bunch of other misc. outboard effects and headphone amps that's not needed for this topic. I mentioned the monitors b/c these are pretty cheap and I know how important that is. I was wondering if someone would stress monitors over what I'm thinking......which is

OH ! I have ZERO power conditioning !
Start with the 002. Send it off to Black Lion Audio. Get the full mod which is $1300. ( or do I get a 003 with no BLA mod ? )
Next , since I want to max out INS for LE ( mainly for my own band which is a five piece / 8 on drums / 1 di bass / 1 mic bass / 2 grt 1 / 2 grt 2 / 1 vox / 2 backup / 1 room ) plus it's also good to have IMO , I was think of the Apogee 200 for $1700 for my s/pdif on the 002. ( or do I sell the digimax lt and get a rosetta 800 ? )

For my empty channel on the 002 , since I already have a 6176 and would love stereo 1176 action ( or as close to 1176 as it gets anyway ) get another 6176. $2200

About $600 - $800 on a decent new / used mic pre to go into rosetta 200

That would be about $6000 so far . Am I on the right track ?

Say another $1000 on power conditioning ?
$7000
B/c I record a lot of screamers , a Shure Sm7b - $300 - $ 350
A better pair of small diaphragm condensers Rode nt5 $200-$400 or Shure sm81 $400-$600
A decent pair or large diaphragm condensers for drum overhead around $600 ( if you could recommend )
D 112 - $150
Pretty much $2000 on mics.
$9000
Then a tossup between a new desk ( which I desperately need ) or monitors . To anyone who takes there time to actually read all of this and respond with suggestions , Thank you. THANK YOU VERY MUCH !

[te-problematique]

Invest it in oil ETF's

[te-problematique]

Oh on a more serious note...you're looking to drop 10 g's on gear and are only going to buy shitty behringer truth monitors? Re-think your priorities and remember gear can be hired.

[Dean Roddey]

Used 6176's can be gotten for a good bit less than that, and seem to be available on a fairly regular basis here on this forum, so you could save some bucks there.

[peeweedrummer]

Firstly how does your room sound? the first thing id do is treat my room with some diy bass traps. then id upgrade my monitors. if you cant hear whats going on properly even with the greatest gear you mixes still will be average.

next id look into at least 1 golden channel-
you already have a u87ai and a 6176 get a rosetta 200 and your done. most things you will record through that 1 great channel by overdubbing.
maybe get a decent dual/quad ch pre from jlm audio so you have more decent ch of pre's when doin drums.
one of my fav mic combos for elec guitar is sm57/cacade fatthead 2. nice and cheap and a great tone.

get some other decent mics and pre's with the rest of the money.dont waste it on power conditioning you have other greater priorities.

oh and an sm7 is awesome.get one.

[willerichey]

hookers and blow?

[Dean Roddey]

Originally Posted by peeweedrummer

Firstly how does your room sound? the first thing id do is treat my room with some diy bass traps. then id upgrade my monitors. if you cant hear whats going on properly even with the greatest gear you mixes still will be average.

I'd have said the same, but he indicated that he's moving soon and doesn't want to spend anything in this location on treatements.

[oulablank]

thanks for replies. I'm actually shopping monitors online as we speak. Any slutz recommendations ? Around $500 each ?

[Dean Roddey]

Originally Posted by willerichey

hookers and blow?

I'd have said the same thing, but I hate to give away my most important audio production secrets like that.

[peeweedrummer]

Originally Posted by oulablank

thanks for replies. I'm actually shopping monitors online as we speak. Any slutz recommendations ? Around $500 each ?

im fairly happy with my yamaha hs80's.I use them alongside some genelec 8050's

in terms of room treatment you can make some traps that are free standing and simply take them to your next place when you move.

dont rush into anything. buy things as you need them not as you think you might need them.

you can already do great recordings with the gear you have, work out what are you weak links and fix them.

[oulablank]

I'm not rushing to burn a hole in the pocket . I will need most of these things for some up coming project. My room sounds pretty good and is treated , but my new place will be tailored around recording , not the other way around. Anyone have anything to say about KRK monitors ?

[rumimusic]

with $10k you could get alot of cool 500 pres and comps.

The api 512 pre is great for punchy drums
The Great River is awesome for smashed room mics and anything you want creamy or neve flavored.

the 6 slot lunchboxes are pretty cheap

and you can find some fun comps and eqs to go with your pres like the
a designs pultec copy... or the famous api 550a or 550b

Get a pair of the new Jbl Lsr Monitors. They're more than you mentioned but so worth it. Or Adams P22's if you wanna spill more loot... but seriously, quality monitoring changed alot for me.

definitely go with that SM7 but maybe also consider a Peluso Tube for another higher end vocal mic. I've heard the P12 and it sounds great to my ears. i also noticed you could pick up beyer m160's as a great and inexpensive ribbon.

if you don't already have an outboard clock maybe pick up a big ben. I have a bla modded 002 and also think that is a nice step up and makes the pres much more usable.

also if you really wanna add something to your collection you'll use for everything buy a neve 10 series clone like a 1081 or a 1084 from vintech or brent averill.

[carllock]

a UAD Duo Quad Neve card and rest on little VSTi extras

Yes I'm in the OL Cult!....Drink the Koolaid, it's not bitter.

[oulablank]

I'll look into those monitor suggestions , thanks !

[husky band]

Definitely go for a new computer desk. I bought one from MF about 5 years ago. It was the biggest one they stocked. It has 2 8 space and 2 4 space racks built in and it makes everything much easier. I don't think you can have too many mics. I look at them like crayons so I'd throw in an AT 4050 and an AKG 414 and any other mic you might fancy. When it comes to monitors, you've got to listen and compare. If you can find a place that will let you try them out first, it's worth the extra money you might have to pay over "sound unheard".

[imaginaryday]

Originally Posted by oulablank

I never thought that I would be posting a thread like this ( not that I have a problem with posts like this ) I just always thought I was pretty good at determining priority. Turns out I'm not. It's just easier when you don't have much of a budget to work with and you buy piece by piece . I have an extra $10,000 I can devote to my home studio aside from my weekly / monthly $200 here- $500 there...ect. This is the first time that I've had this much money at one time to spend completely on pro audio so I'm a bit inundated with lists / price guides / reviews / recommendations / you get the idea.
What is my goal for this $10,000 ?

First off , I'm running PT LE. I know , I know. I've thought about it a while and I'm happy with all of my manual delay comp tips . One day I will go HD but for now , I'm looking to max out my LE system to the fullest. That's why I'm not posting in LOW END. Even though LE is low end I'm looking to buy high end converters / pres.
Even though $10,000 will only roughly cover 70% or so of my goal , my goal is tackling the pre amp / converter / few mic / and filling all my expanded I/O. I know that a good chunk of money needs to go into acoustics but I'm moving soon so I want to maximize my PT / 002 first. Here it goes

( Before you comment on why I have this over that , understand that it's been a long and bumpy low end road and an old partner has some pieces and I have some )

This is what I'm currently working with

20'' intel based imac / 2.4 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo / 4 GB 667 MHz DDR2 SDRAM / running OS 10.4.11

Digidesign 002 console running PT LE 7.4 cs10
Music production toolkit

8 CH Presonus Digimax LT via lightpipe

2 CH S/PDIF - Currently unused

5-8 on the 002
5. Universal audio 6176 ( 610 side )
6. Empty
7. Behringer T1953 Ch 1
8. Behringer T1953 Ch 2

1 Neumann U87ai
2 Shure Beta 52a
1 Shure sm58 / 1 Shure beta58a
4 Shure sm57 / 1 Shure beta 57a
2 CAD GXL pencil condensers
1 MXL 990 condenser

Behringer Truth B2030A monitors

A whole bunch of other misc. outboard effects and headphone amps that's not needed for this topic. I mentioned the monitors b/c these are pretty cheap and I know how important that is. I was wondering if someone would stress monitors over what I'm thinking......which is

OH ! I have ZERO power conditioning !
Start with the 002. Send it off to Black Lion Audio. Get the full mod which is $1300. ( or do I get a 003 with no BLA mod ? )
Next , since I want to max out INS for LE ( mainly for my own band which is a five piece / 8 on drums / 1 di bass / 1 mic bass / 2 grt 1 / 2 grt 2 / 1 vox / 2 backup / 1 room ) plus it's also good to have IMO , I was think of the Apogee 200 for $1700 for my s/pdif on the 002. ( or do I sell the digimax lt and get a rosetta 800 ? )

For my empty channel on the 002 , since I already have a 6176 and would love stereo 1176 action ( or as close to 1176 as it gets anyway ) get another 6176. $2200

About $600 - $800 on a decent new / used mic pre to go into rosetta 200

That would be about $6000 so far . Am I on the right track ?

Say another $1000 on power conditioning ?
$7000
B/c I record a lot of screamers , a Shure Sm7b - $300 - $ 350
A better pair of small diaphragm condensers Rode nt5 $200-$400 or Shure sm81 $400-$600
A decent pair or large diaphragm condensers for drum overhead around $600 ( if you could recommend )
D 112 - $150
Pretty much $2000 on mics.
$9000
Then a tossup between a new desk ( which I desperately need ) or monitors . To anyone who takes there time to actually read all of this and respond with suggestions , Thank you. THANK YOU VERY MUCH !

i would start with:
room treatment
good monitors

[Donpepperoni]

I know what you mean about wanting another 6176, I have one and would like another for stereo missions! On the desk tip, what about Midas Venice, I like mine alot, it's really good for the money!

[digitrax]

Originally Posted by imaginaryday

i would start with:
room treatment
good monitors

+1

Originally Posted by willerichey

hookers and blow?

+1 again

Originally Posted by oulablank

I'm not rushing to burn a hole in the pocket . I will need most of these things for some up coming project. My room sounds pretty good and is treated , but my new place will be tailored around recording , not the other way around. Anyone have anything to say about KRK monitors ?

KRK's are highly decent "up front" sounding monitors, and while I prefer a midrange-forward monitor to something that makes everything "real smooth", you may not - especially if you monitor loudly.

With the kind of money you have at your disposal, it ought to be possible to go into someplace like Guitar Center, buy a pair of KRK's, a pair of Dynaudio's, a pair of Yamaha's, and maybe one or two other flavors and actually compare them in your own room.

Better yet, do some mixes on each and see how they translate to other systems.

You may even want a pair of really revealing "reference" monitors and a pair of semi-crappy "check" monitors to make sure your mixes translate well.

In any event, determine what works for you, then return the ones you don't want (I think GC and others have a 30-day return policy). I know it's a pain, but believe me, it's worth the time invested.

[Hammer Mark]

Don't waste your $ on the BLA mod. Eventually you'll upgrade the 002 anyway and the mod won't make it worth a dime more. Think long term and consider resale value. Plan where you want to be in five or ten years and make a list of priorities. Add one piece at a time and know it well before adding the next.

The SM7B is a great piece that you'll never regret. If you want a pair of nice condensers (for OH, ac gtr, gtr cabs, etc.), you can occasionally find KSM32s for $300 each. Since you've already got a beta52, you don't need a D112.

The focusrite 828 with ADAT would be a nice step up from the Digimax -- worth considering. If you also have a digital stereo in on the 002, the API A2D would drive that nicely and add some colour.

You definitely need to look into good monitors. I'm using NS-10s and don't have experience with anything else, so all I can recommend is to listen to as many as you can with music you know well. Monitors are rarely set-up properly in stores so to minimize the problems that causes (esp. with the stereo image), listen close-up to just one speaker of the pair.

Good luck.

[digitrax]

Originally Posted by Hammer Mark

Don't waste your $ on the BLA mod. Eventually you'll upgrade the 002 anyway and the mod won't make it worth a dime more. Think long term and consider resale value. Plan where you want to be in five or ten years and make a list of priorities. Add one piece at a time and know it well before adding the next.

The SM7B is a great piece that you'll never regret...
...
The focusrite 828 with ADAT would be a nice step up from the Digimax -- worth considering. If you also have a digital stereo in on the 002, the API A2D would drive that nicely and add some colour...
...
You definitely need to look into good monitors...

All of this is good advice. Try clocking the 002 (which has a notoriously bad clock) off the A2D (or the 828 or whatever you end up getting) - you may find this makes close to the same (/exactly the same? /more?) improvement than the BLA mod would.

I'd only add that, as I've said, take some monitors home if you can and mix on 'em. Checking them in the store will only tell you half the story. It's unlikely you'll listen to them long enough to cause ear fatigue, which might occur if you actually mix for a few hours.

But yeah, I'm right with Mark on the API and the Focusrite. SM7 as you've noted is a great mic for screamers (and guitar cabs among other things). The condensors are a matter of taste but if I were to buy a pair of one model, I guess I'd get some small diaphragms from Oktava, Neumann or AKG (or DPA or Schoeps if your budget allows). Maybe (at least) one high-quality large diaphragm as well, and a couple of ribbons. A second 6176 couldn't hurt - it's always nice to have good pieces in pairs for buss/pgm work if necessary.

I also agree with PeeWee - if everything else in your system is where you want it to be, power conditioning can make a noticeable difference. Unless and until that's the case, you have bigger fish to fry.

But as we've all been saying, start w/the monitors - it'll make comparing the other stuff that much easier.

[gurubuzz]

Originally Posted by oulablank

I'll look into those monitor suggestions , thanks !

Also try Fostex PM2s.

[Hammer Mark]

Addressing a couple of digi's points...

I don't think the 002 has wordclock in, so he might be stuck clocking the other pieces with that notoriously bad clock.

He listed a U87 among his current mic collection, so he's got the nice vocal LDC covered.

[michj]

with 10000 get a neve 1073 dpa, api3124, lynnx aurora converters,adam monitors, akg 414 and spent whats left twiking ur room an on the strip club

[oulablank]

Hammer Mark , are you saying that unless I use wordclock , I'm not bypassing the 002 converters ? I thought adat / lightpipe and spdif use there own clock ?

[digitrax]

Originally Posted by Hammer Mark

I don't think the 002 has wordclock in, so he might be stuck clocking the other pieces with that notoriously bad clock.

Originally Posted by oulablank

Hammer Mark , are you saying that unless I use wordclock , I'm not bypassing the 002 converters ? I thought adat / lightpipe and spdif use there own clock ?

They do, but also could be clocked, through a wordclock (BNC) connection, to the clock in the interface (which you wouldn't want to do in this case anyway).

But no, you wouldn't be stuck clocking off the 002, as the 002 can clock off the S/PDIF or ADAT (hence no WC in - they added that as another clocking option in the 003) of whichever piece you decide sounds best clocking the system and the other converter can also lock to that piece through WC (which both have).
You do, however have to have all 3 locked to the same clock to avoid timing glitches (clicks and pops) but it's easily done in this case.

[mikethedrummer]

treatment is pretty key. make moveable walls (gobos) out of roxul rockwool 60 from ats acoustics. for $500 you can treat a whoooolllleee lot. i mean vocal booth, cab iso, drum iso and some to spare.
i only present this option because it is very easy to transport in the future and will be usable in any studio environment youll ever enter. at least thats my plan!

adam a7's are known for translating extremely well. i would have saved and purchased them if rockit 8s werent $300 at gc for a while =o

the api a2d would be another awesome stereo pre to add + it has really really nice built in converters.

the rosetta would be a nice purchase as well

for outboard compression a pair of distressors would be absolutely lethal for vocals and overheads, especially screamers. those are next on my to buy list =]

+1 sm7b
+1 pair of akg c414
-1 for sm81s. turns cymbals into tin imo
+1 yamaha subkick. d112 aint got shit

check out an online ups for power conditioning. get it done right

also not a bad idea to get a high quality cable snake, high quality cables, and somer nice stands. not sure of your current situation but with 10gs you can easily cover that.

[harry_seldon]

Originally Posted by willerichey

hookers and blow?

That was my first thought, too. Depending on your tastes, 10 grand is not going to get you very far into the night.

[digitrax]

Originally Posted by Hammer Mark

He listed a U87 among his current mic collection, so he's got the nice vocal LDC covered.

Oops. My bad.

[michj]

i just bought a neve 1073 dpa, for 2400 at g center on an open box special, and its the best money ive ever spent in my life. Nothing i have comes close to it, and i have a universal 6176, avalon, ssls,portico and apis that still shine for any percusion duty where they are unbeatable.Go for it man u wont regret it

[chrisdee]

I would go for the 24" imac. You will regret buying only 20".

Why 002 when you can buy 003 ?