True or False? In the future, Artists will record themselves.

[Ben B]

In the future?

I think to a large extent, that is happening in the present.

-Ben B

[mobius.media]

True.

In the future, most 'bands' will be happy enough with triggered drum kits, DI guitars/bass, and softsynths, so the only 'recording' will be vox. One good usb/firewire mic for that and that's it. Plugin presets and automix features should take care of most of the rest.

Some bands will still do it the old fashioned way. Pro engineers/mixers/musicians will survive or disappear contingent on whether music sales stabilize or become profitable again.

[NathanEldred]

Are you talking strictly about tracking? I don't things will be any different than now. Some people wear all the hats, some do the tracking and have a professional mix and master, some still rely on a team for everything. Some will own a bedroom studio, some will have a midsize facility, and some might have big $$ invested if they have investors or actually make enough from selling their music. Again, same as now.

I think it is too much for one person to do everything and have a commercially viable product. A musician/artist needs to work on songwriting and performance. Learning and mastering engineering and production takes a long time, just IME it took me 6 years of consistently recording whatever came through the door to feel my chops were starting to come into their own.

And the skill developing never stops after that (15 years for me this year), but things definitely plateu with a much slower tilt upwards (which I suppose is a big part of being excellent at something). I don't think songwriting takes as much work (or the same type of work), mostly only talent, which is either there or not. Look at all the great songs that were written by people in their late teens or early 20's (Bob Dylan, Plant/Page, etc, etc, etc).

Playing an instrument is a technical proficiency, but great playing doesn't gaurantee great songwriting. I think a good modern engineer can learn by trial and error or from another skilled engineer to achieve proficiency. Talent plays into it, but engineering isn't nearly as much of an art IMO (especially tracking, mixing more so). Hope I'm not too off topic....

[hewhorocks]

Ummm the future is now

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Ben B

In the future?

I think to a large extent, that is happening in the present.

-Ben B

It is. But is it the standard?

A guitar player should know how to tune their guitar and get a sound from their amp but in the future knowing how to record it may be par for the course too.

I'm just wondering if it will one day become odd for a band who doesn't know how to record themselves.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by NathanEldred

Are you talking strictly about tracking? I don't things will be any different than now. Some people wear all the hats, some do the tracking and have a professional mix and master, some still rely on a team for everything. Some will own a bedroom studio, some will have a midsize facility, and some might have big $$ invested if they have investors or actually make enough from selling their music. Again, same as now.

I think it is too much for one person to do everything and have a commercially viable product. A musician/artist needs to work on songwriting and performance. Learning and mastering engineering and production takes a long time, just IME it took me 6 years of consistently recording whatever came through the door to feel my chops were starting to come into their own.

And the skill developing never stops after that (15 years for me this year), but things definitely plateu with a much slower tilt upwards (which I suppose is a big part of being excellent at something).

But as it all gets easier it may be feasible for one person to handle. Or the bar just drops and we deal with what people can do by themselves.

I agree that it's not optimum but it may become necessary and eventually seem to be a required skill set of being a musician.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by hewhorocks

Ummm the future is now

For demos, yes.

But imagine a future where Bono and Daniel Lanois are one person.

[Dean Roddey]

You have to kind of consider that it used to be accepted that musicians couldn't write their own songs. But that changed, and I don't think that, looking at the big picture, most of us would think that was a step in the wrong direction necessarily. Obviously you got more bad, but you got more good as well, and more personal.

Before that was even allowed, I guess probably not so many musicians got the opportunity to practice that craft and that would tend to create a self-fulfilling prophecy. Now everyone knows it's kind of expected of them, though obviously professional writers still do contribute.

Before recently few musicians would have had the opportunity to learn the craft of recording themselves (with a hope of being professional sounding I mean), but that has changed and the belief that it's something that few musicians can really master is likely to prove as unfounded as on the song writing front. But there will still be plenty of them who are artistically gifted but technically lacking I'm sure, and therefore professional assists will still be needed.

How positive that is for the professional assister, I dunno. It doesn't matter that not everyone will do their own, if the exceptions are very small in number, because the number of jobs available to work at a good professional level would still be seriously affected it would seem.

Yes, it does take a long time to get good at the technical side of things. But if you know it's expected of you from day one, and you start down that path at the same time that you start down the path of being a musician (which is doable today), then by the time you become a viable musican you may already be a viable engineer/mixer. That doesn't mean you will necessarily be at the very top of the game, just as it doesn't mean you are at the very top of the musicianship game just because you are becoming recognized for your songs. But if you continue to progress down both paths, you can become very good at both.

And I think we have to consider the informaiton that is out there now for someone to learn from, which probably was not remotely the case in the 70s or 80s, or even the 90s. Now that there's a potential market of people who do expect to take this route, there's a market for people to help them do so, as apposed to getting one of the limited number of jobs as an intern in a studio somewhere.

[Empire Prod]

Whatever the future version of the iphone is, I think that will be the future recording format. Recording will be done from your phone/device, and people will learn how to record before they are even competent at playing an instrument. As a result recordings will continue to get worse and so to compensate for that, software applications that "fix" and/or "replace" audio will become more and more necessary. Records will sonically sound more and more alike. One of the greatest influences on the future sound of records will be the guys who are writing code. There will be higher end traditional studios, but they will be very rare. The "expensive" sound will be obtained through software innovation. Guys like myself will be old men by then who will complain about the lack of talent, creativity, and art. The kids will laugh at me and hop on their hover boards.

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by Dean Roddey

You have to kind of consider that it used to be accepted that musicians couldn't write their own songs. But that changed, and I don't think that, looking at the big picture, most of us would think that was a step in the wrong direction necessarily. Obviously you got more bad, but you got more good as well, and more personal.

Before that was even allowed, I guess probably not so many musicians got the opportunity to practice that craft and that would tend to create a self-fulfilling prophecy. Now everyone knows it's kind of expected of them, though obviously professional writers still do contribute.

Before recently few musicians would have had the opportunity to learn the craft of recording themselves (with a hope of being professional sounding I mean), but that has changed and the belief that it's something that few musicians can really master is likely to prove as unfounded as on the song writing front. But there will still be plenty of them who are artistically gifted but technically lacking I'm sure, and therefore professional assists will still be needed.

How positive that is for the professional assister, I dunno. It doesn't matter that not everyone will do their own, if the exceptions are very small in number, because the number of jobs available to work at a good professional level would still be seriously affected it would seem.

Yes, it does take a long time to get good at the technical side of things. But if you know it's expected of you from day one, and you start down that path at the same time that you start down the path of being a musician (which is doable today), then by the time you become a viable musican you may already be a viable engineer/mixer. That doesn't mean you will necessarily be at the very top of the game, just as it doesn't mean you are at the very top of the musicianship game just because you are becoming recognized for your songs. But if you continue to progress down both paths, you can become very good at both.

And I think we have to consider the informaiton that is out there now for someone to learn from, which probably was not remotely the case in the 70s or 80s, or even the 90s. Now that there's a potential market of people who do expect to take this route, there's a market for people to help them do so, as apposed to getting one of the limited number of jobs as an intern in a studio somewhere.

Great post!!!!!

Another great example is the studio drummer. Years ago drummers didn't have a clue how to record their kit. Nowadays, most of the greats have a designated room and do just that. Record it for you. You pay for both. Maybe he's a better engineer than he is a drummer.

Thx

[NathanEldred]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

But imagine a future where Bono and Daniel Lanois are one person.

I don't think human evolution is at a point that this will happen, maybe a couple of artists capable of this in a decade, if that many. Even someone who is great at a combination of things like songwriting, production, and some engineering still needs a team of other engineers, co-songwriters, and musicians. I see Jimmy Page as a good example of this. Even if someone doesn't like what he's done, who can deny that he was very productive and versatile within the context of his professional artistry? I'm not sure that something like this will become the common denominator, or maybe I'm wrong.

[audibleobsession]

Two words:

Trent Reznor

[Kenny Gioia]

Originally Posted by NathanEldred

I don't think human evolution is at a point that this will happen, maybe a couple of artists capable of this in a decade, if that many. Even someone who is great at a combination of things like songwriting, production, and some engineering still needs a team of other engineers, co-songwriters, and musicians. I see Jimmy Page as a good example of this. Even if someone doesn't like what he's done, who can deny that he was very productive and versatile within the context of his professional artistry? I'm not sure that something like this will become the common denominator, or maybe I'm wrong.

I would refer to Dean Roddey's post. He says it better than I can.

But I'll try anyway. LOL.

Many people on this forum are just audio engineers. I happen to be a songwriter, producer and an audio engineer. Am I three times as talented as them? Probably not. But in my life, I kept adding skills as I needed or wanted them.

What I'm not is a great singer. I'm not even a decent singer. Had I been a great singer in my generation, I probably would have skipped the engineering and production skills and just been a great singer and songwriter. I would have been able to find others to do that for me. But in this new generation, I may have still learned those other skills as it wouldn't have been any harder for me and nowadays it's a bigger asset. Many singers are born with great voices so I could have done all 4 just as easily.

Now fast forward and some guys are also making their own videos of them singing and putting them on youtube.

Check this guy out.

YouTube - Airto's Channel

This is the new model.

[AllAboutTone]

False, bands are not gonna spend the bucks that it takes to make a song retail ready. Demo maybe.
Example: I HATE recording my band with a passion and I have all the gear, engineering and being a artist is a pain in the ass, I have thought seriously about paying for studio time for tracking somewhere else. If it was not for re-amping guitars I would.

[henryrobinett]

I don't know. I find myself on the other side of the argument regarding musicians and musicianship ALL THE TIME because I'm just talking different stuff. This is a rock and roll forum. I don't see jazz or classical musicians spending the time, as part of their general musical experience, learning how to record themselves. High musicianship level takes a lifetime of work. Adding that composition AND the ridiculous amount of time it takes to record, mix and master is just too much. There are many exceptions, me being one of them and various others of us on these boards. But I think those that are interested in recording, will. For most musicians it's incredibly boring. They'd rather spend their time practicing. I know I would.

That said, there'll always be a member who does it for the band. The drummer or the guitarist. Or they'll adopt someone to engineer on their own gear. Someone who likes to hang out with the band. Then most, who know what they're doing, will give the recorded tracks to a real mixing engineer while they provide direction.

But I'm still holding out that musicians will be remain a vibrant part of the future landscape, as opposed to all virtual shit.

[mobius.media]

Originally Posted by henryrobinett

But I'm still holding out that musicians will be remain a vibrant part of the future landscape, as opposed to all virtual shit.

No shit, huh?

[emkay]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

True or False? In the future, Artists will record themselves.

Thoughts?

Not meant to sound mean spirited or insulting, but isn't that a bit like asking if politicians answer to big biz before thinking about"we the people". True or False?
The word rhetorical comes to mind.

[emkay]

Originally Posted by NathanEldred

I don't think human evolution is at a point that this will happen, maybe a couple of artists capable of this in a decade, if that many. Even someone who is great at a combination of things like songwriting, production, and some engineering still needs a team of other engineers, co-songwriters, and musicians. I see Jimmy Page as a good example of this. Even if someone doesn't like what he's done, who can deny that he was very productive and versatile within the context of his professional artistry? I'm not sure that something like this will become the common denominator, or maybe I'm wrong.

There've been many more than you think. Without putting too much thought into it, Prince, Todd Rundgren,Trent Reznor, Danny Lanois, come to mind. I'm sure there are many,many more out there, known and unkown. I guess if an "autonomous" artist calls in a sideman or two, you could arguably call that a team. I think that the industry as a whole at all levels is in such a state of hyper transition,we're all trying to get our minds around a paradigm that shifts as quickly as I'm writing this post. There are those that tenaciously hang on to their comfort zones of old school thinking and those that blindly accept all that is happening! As you said, "maybe I'm wrong", and if you truly believe that,then that is a good start. Because, I am certain that there is a good possibility that I may be wrong. As artists, engineers,musicians,biz folks, we are definitely living in exciting,challenging times. One thing I am certain about,and I am not referring to your comments, is that generally in today's quickly changing industry,closed minded thinking,and tenaciously holding on to outdated concepts is not the way to deal with nor understand this paradigm shift. Then again, the old "whatever it takes",might also help. It will be interesting to see what comes of all of this in the next decade...........peace

[DynaForte]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

True or False? In the future, Artists will record themselves.

Thoughts?

False.

Contrary to what most people will pretend is true...evidence shows that NO LESS MUSICIANS RECORD IN STUDIOS THAN ANY OTHER TIME. PERIOD. FACE THE FACTS.

However, it is also true that MOST OF THOSE STUDIOS ARE BUILT INTO HOUSES.


What I mean is, these days musicians who would NEVER have been recorded in the past get recorded.

But that does NOT take away from those good enough and serious enough to get money to get it DONE RIGHT.


So I would say "In the future, ALL musicians will be recorded by talented engineers would have their own personal rigs and record in homes, and some one-studio commercial rooms in some cases.

[Sky]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

Check this guy out.

YouTube - Airto's Channel

This is the new model.

That's one talented artist, thanks for sharing.

Sky

[djt4400]

In the Year 3000!!

[jono_3]

Originally Posted by kenny gioia

imagine a future where bono and daniel lanois are one person.

aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[voicegenius]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

True or False? In the future, Artists will record themselves.

Thoughts?

True, because everyone will have a chip in them....

[DynaForte]

Originally Posted by audibleobsession

Two words:

Trent Reznor

Trent Reznor has an engineer that records him, and mixes for him.

So what's your point?

[JoaT]

I think it is quite inevitable that recording as a technical process is getting easier as the technology advances. Software will evolve to make tracking and mixing as easy as it can possibly be. The biggest drag at the moment is probably the people who buy the software to track & mix. We all have a history, and if there's something people are naturally resistant, it is paradigm shifts.

We, the current users of the software, come from the background of analog devices. That is what we are accustomed to. And also what we like to use, even if it's just a representation of it's ancestor on the computer screen.

The paradigm shift is going to happen through portable devices. We may smile at iPhone's audio apps now, but the truth is that in not-so-very distant future something similar becomes good enough to deliver the quality that is sufficient for professional results.

Mobile devices have limitations in screen size and interface. As a user experience it is not very appealing idea to think VST instruments or fx plugins along with the tracking software on iPhone screen. Sure, would be cool, but a pain to use.

That's why the paradigm shift is required. The interface needs to change for these apps to be usable in that environment. And when it does, it's going to irritate the hell out of us accustomed to "the old ways".

These "built-for-mobile-devices DAWs" will probably also have a host of automated functions for a lot of things normally handled by "the guy sitting behind the desk", since these products will be built from ground up to be used by the performer.

The new users who don't have the burden of "the old ways" will learn them and form a user base which eventually becomes a market for full scale DAWs that are built from ground up using a paradigm different than these we are currently using.

This new generation of DAW users has learned to depend on the "virtual guy sitting behind the desk" from the get-go and demands to have him around on it's full size DAW as well. Then we are at a point where definition of this trade is going to change. It becomes natural to rely on "auto pilot" on a lot of things we now see as essential skills for any professional worth his salt.

We just have to accept the changes and admit the truth underneath all this technology. When all is said and done, it all comes down to the performance of the artist.

Recording it is still a human skill today only because we do not have the technology in place to handle it quite yet.

Hope this is worth .02c.. and not offending anyone. Been up for 20+ hours, and I am really tired.

[Ben B]

Originally Posted by djt4400

In the Year 3000!!

In the year 3000!!

lol

[jinksdingo]

You put a mic up or plug in a jack and press record.
Well that is how it looks for some newcomers.

There is no doubt that it'll continue to be easier for the recording artist.

More accessible it is the more musicians we'll have who want to record.

With that a studio has the "Idol" role of recording talent deserving of skilled results.

Also as more musicians get into recording the more there will be who are "studio savy"

There are of course the total green performer looking for studio tricks to up there apparent skill.

[Unclenny]

Originally Posted by henryrobinett

There are many exceptions, me being one of them and various others of us on these boards. But I think those that are interested in recording, will.

Henry is a fine example.....an excellent and dedicated musician who still enjoys recording.

There will always be artists who record themselves. But when the chips are down we will all tend to play to our strong points........and let others on the team do what they do best.

[Seb RIOU]

Originally Posted by Kenny Gioia

Now fast forward and some guys are also making their own videos of them singing and putting them on youtube.

Check this guy out.

YouTube - Airto's Channel

This is the new model.

That is so lame. Who would like to sit and watch an over sweet cover of an already syrupy song by a guy sucking on a pop filter with big headphones on ?
If that is the future, I'd probably leave it here and call it a life.
Goodbye everybody , it's been a nice trip. so far