bang for the buck, master buss compressor

[rack gear]

been checkin' in on this thread over in the High End Section - but given the TK BC 1 is only $1,250 I though I might solicit some feedback from a broader audience:

TK AUDIO BC1 Stereo Buss compressor?

I'm so close to pulling the trigger on this...
thanks for the great feedback so far, tell me more!

$1,250 for an SSL Clone master buss hardware compressor puts it just outside the cost of a year or two ownership of the Wave SSL bundle (of which I only use the compressor).

I'm just so sick of getting stuck in upgrade paths... so where I can, I'm trying to go hardware - reserving plugins only for things that are best suited for ITB - specialty plugins, unique stuff.

Anyway... yeah, if I had the $3,500 I'd get the SSL, but for the price the TK BC-1 seems like it could do a really nice job on the master buss - I also like that it has the wet/dry blend.

[Dean Roddey]

You can get a Chameleon SSL clone for more like $600. It's based on the usual well known SSL designs out there in the DIY community, plus some of the nice additions that would make it hard to even DIY it for this price. It's purely stereo or mono, no dual mono modes. But for bus duties probably that's generally what you'd want anyway.

I have one and it's quite nice. I can't compare it to the originals since it would be hard to fit an SSL console in my apartment and whatnot, but it sounds quite nice to me and makes a really nice glue compressor for the master bus and great for drum squishies where you don't want lots of character, or other bus duties.

[larry b]

I'm so dang close to buying a BC-1 as well! The word is that they are great, im not sure how close it comes to the SSL G-series, but im not sure i care either. If i wanted an SSL i'd buy the SSL.

I love the wet/dry blend thing, and that will be my main reason for getting this thing. I plan to use it on the drum buss, as i already have a killer stereo buss compressor (Calrec RQD6400 ), and i think this TK Audio unit would be the perfect compliment with it's ability to blend in the dry signal. That's exactly what i need for drums! No more printing my drum compression and then sliding it one sample at a time until i get the phase relationship correct with the dry tracks. I hate doing that. It messes up my workflow.

Also, i have an addiction to any piece of gear with a Sifam VU/PPM meter on it.

[sahiaman]

If you can swing your funds for a portico 5043 it's a hell of a master buss compressor. Great buy, and something which you'll never feel you'll have to 'upgrade' down the line.

[larry b]

Originally Posted by sahiaman

If you can swing your funds for a portico 5043 it's a hell of a master buss compressor. Great buy, and something which you'll never feel you'll have to 'upgrade' down the line.

True, the Portico is kick-butt, but the BC-1, with its unique setup of wet-dry blend control, is also something that would never need to be sold. The OP could simply move it to the drum buss or another stem-type buss if he gets a more expensive master buss compressor in the future.

[Slikjmuzik]

Originally Posted by Dean Roddey

You can get a Chameleon SSL clone for more like $600. It's based on the usual well known SSL designs out there in the DIY community, plus some of the nice additions that would make it hard to even DIY it for this price. It's purely stereo or mono, no dual mono modes. But for bus duties probably that's generally what you'd want anyway.

I have one and it's quite nice. I can't compare it to the originals since it would be hard to fit an SSL console in my apartment and whatnot, but it sounds quite nice to me and makes a really nice glue compressor for the master bus and great for drum squishies where you don't want lots of character, or other bus duties.

So you really like this compressor that much? Just from the price, I wouldn't have thought to go much below the BC-1. I know the ART VLA PRO is good, but for punchy rock it would probably rob the transients I'd think. Have you heard any of the Smart Units or a real SSL unit in the outboard 1u version at all? Can you compare? I know they're good, but I'm wondering if the Chameleon holds its own and has the punch. Or even better, if Warren can mod it into a big boy like he does with the 7602 pres!!

[rack gear]

dean - is it based on SSL or DBX ?

The Model 7720 Stereo Compressor is based on a trusted design and is electronically balanced, utilizing "THAT Corporation" (formerly DBX) VCA circuitry.

It features a low component count in order to provide the cleanest signal path possible. In accordance with Chameleon Labs' ongoing dedication to end users, unique features have been implemented (direct from consumer suggestions) to make the 7720 more versatile than your average mix bus compressor.

I like the HPF on it, for sure - and the price is right too... oh good lord now I'm trying to justify both...

Originally Posted by Dean Roddey

You can get a Chameleon SSL clone for more like $600. It's based on the usual well known SSL designs out there in the DIY community, plus some of the nice additions that would make it hard to even DIY it for this price. It's purely stereo or mono, no dual mono modes. But for bus duties probably that's generally what you'd want anyway.

I have one and it's quite nice. I can't compare it to the originals since it would be hard to fit an SSL console in my apartment and whatnot, but it sounds quite nice to me and makes a really nice glue compressor for the master bus and great for drum squishies where you don't want lots of character, or other bus duties.

[Dean Roddey]

Originally Posted by redvelvetstudios

dean - is it based on SSL or DBX ?

It's an SSL clone. They are just using DBX or That VCAs as the compression mechanism.

SSL Clone construction page

They've spiffed it up quite a bit I'm sure, and added some of the extra features that are available that would make the DIY version more complicated. Partly they save money by using an external power supply, so no certification requirements ofr the compressor itself wrt to that. And since it's based on a well known design I assume that they don't have a lot of R&D sunk into it. So the price is very good.

Having built a DIY LA-2A and 1176, and Neve and API pre-amps, I have come to realize how much of the cost of so much we buy is overhead and name and so forth. These designs are very good and sometimes more true ot the originals in some ways than bigger name clones might be. And they sound great.

So I now have an LA-2A, 1176, SSL, Neve and API, and I have about probably $2500 in the whole setup I guess. That's pretty hard to beat. If I bought originals, it would probably be more like $10K or so I would think.

The Chameleon was too close to what the DIY price would be to justify DIYing it, so I just bought it, and actually got it on an introductory deal so I think I only paid around $450 for it something like that.

[rack gear]

dean -

this is GEARSLUTZ not DIYSLUTZ... just kidding, wanted to say that...

doood - please post pictures of your builds!

I have got to see these!

[Dean Roddey]

Here are some pics. I was not concerned with appearance at all, just functionality, and keeping the price low. So for the 1176 and LA-2A they are very plain looking.

Here's the Neve board, which is SCA. API is similar just different components. I didn't get picture of it.


Here's the LA-2A:


Here's my desk. The 1176 is on the right, along with a Sansamp RPM and monitor controller. On the left is the SCA enclosure with the Neve and API pre-amps and a DI board, plus the Chameleon and the patch bay. The LA-2A is too large, so it's on a separate table to the left of the desk.




I made a mistake when laying out the front panel for the 1176, so I ended up having to flip everything around the other way. So I have a very rare left handed 1176. And of course the all important cup o' java and cookie on plate.


Here's the LA-2A board before tubes and opto-cell. It's a very heavy board with huge, thick traces. It's dead quiet with huge gain. The transformers are Sowters. The 1176 board is a tiny little guy. It's all solid state and not much to it.

[rack gear]

sweet. they look awesome dean. great job.

dean - you may have a future in specialty "left handed" 1176's - genius!

[Brad McGowan]

I keep meaning to build me an LA2A. I've heard two that Norman_nomad built and they sound awesome. One of his uses vintage UTC transformers. The other uses Sowter and Edcor. I have to say I actually prefer the less distorted more hi-fi sound of his Sowter build. Both really rock though. When I build mine I'm going super cheap and will leave out the meter. Who needs a meter on an LA2A anyway?

Anyway...the Chameleon Labs SSL clone is really nice and is a better buy than building it yourself. I built a GSSL right around the time the 7720 came out. I got to listen to it at AES and I thought it pretty much sounded exactly like what I built but with a couple extra features. It's nice and very hi-fi and an extremely good buy. I've actually found that my GSSL sounds really awesome on vocals. I never use it on mix bus anymore.

Brad

[Slikjmuzik]

Killer stuff Dean. So what's the website again where you can go and buy these parts to build yourself? I'd like a couple 1176's. Also, does the DIY 1176 offer British Mode or 4-buttons mode? That's really what I want, I love that sound on guitars. Also pretty nice on room mics.

[Sean Sullivan]

A bit more money, but the Drawmer 1968 is a nice buss compressor.

[Mr_David]

Originally Posted by Slikjmuzik

Killer stuff Dean. So what's the website again where you can go and buy these parts to build yourself? I'd like a couple 1176's. Also, does the DIY 1176 offer British Mode or 4-buttons mode? That's really what I want, I love that sound on guitars. Also pretty nice on room mics.

DIY - Index
A guy called mnats sells 3 kinds of 1176 boards. A rev. D rev. F-G rev.

Yes you can build it the same way UREI did. push buttons to do all buttons in etc. or you can use a rotary.

You can follow the UREI schematic available on the net

[Dean Roddey]

Originally Posted by Slikjmuzik

Killer stuff Dean. So what's the website again where you can go and buy these parts to build yourself? I'd like a couple 1176's. Also, does the DIY 1176 offer British Mode or 4-buttons mode? That's really what I want, I love that sound on guitars. Also pretty nice on room mics.

There's a rotary and pushbutton version. I did the rotary. It does support that 'slam' mode but requires some modifications inside one of the pots, so I didn't do it. The pushbutton version does support it.

For the LA-2A (and also some other nice tube based stuff like the 175 vari-mu) you can go to Drip Electronics . com. His stuff is far more formally defined and documented than the stuff you find on the Prodigy site. If you want to do any of those Prodigy projects, you need to be considerably more experienced with trouble shooting. I barely managed to get mine working, and only with the help of an experienced tech on the SONAR site. The Drip stuff is very well documented wtih a nice bill of materials and step by step instructions. The 175 project would be pretty killer, and he's working on a stereo one, which would be a monster bus/mix compressor. He also has a new LA-2A design that has the option for two different opto cells, one of which has far faster attack so that it can be used both for the traditional LA-2A stuff but also for more limiting type applications.

[rajprods]

In the past few months, I've tried out the Chameleon Labs 7720, TK Audio BC1, and the Smart C2. Out of these three, I liked the Smart C2 the best. I've never heard a SSL in person, so I can't say how it compares. The TK Audio BC1 was really smooth sounding, but I would say the Smart C2 has a bit more character to it. The Chameleon Labs 7720 for cool for the money, but the unit I had was noisy and I didn't want to pay another $125.00 for the external power supply which is supposed to eliminate the noise.

I bought the Smart C2 last year for upcoming projects, but they have been delayed. I currently have it up for sale:

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/gears...-like-new.html

Originally Posted by redvelvetstudios

been checkin' in on this thread over in the High End Section - but given the TK BC 1 is only $1,250 I though I might solicit some feedback from a broader audience:

TK AUDIO BC1 Stereo Buss compressor?

I'm so close to pulling the trigger on this...
thanks for the great feedback so far, tell me more!

$1,250 for an SSL Clone master buss hardware compressor puts it just outside the cost of a year or two ownership of the Wave SSL bundle (of which I only use the compressor).

I'm just so sick of getting stuck in upgrade paths... so where I can, I'm trying to go hardware - reserving plugins only for things that are best suited for ITB - specialty plugins, unique stuff.

Anyway... yeah, if I had the $3,500 I'd get the SSL, but for the price the TK BC-1 seems like it could do a really nice job on the master buss - I also like that it has the wet/dry blend.

[Dean Roddey]

Originally Posted by rajprods

The Chameleon Labs 7720 for cool for the money, but the unit I had was noisy and I didn't want to pay another $125.00 for the external power supply which is supposed to eliminate the noise.

Mine is dead quiet. I actually used it on my last song as the 'maximizer', i.e. while doing the final mixdown glue compression I rode the output level to bring the loudest peaks up to CD levels, so I was pushing up the output a fair amount, and I heard really no extra noise.

[@¶,*ƒƒƒ&™]

Originally Posted by larry b

I'm so dang close to buying a BC-1 as well! The word is that they are great, im not sure how close it comes to the SSL G-series, but im not sure i care either. If i wanted an SSL i'd buy the SSL.

Nowhere near the same thing.

[Dean Roddey]

Looks like the Drip guy has a Pultec clone project about ready. That should be pretty cool. Looks like he moved that ahead of the stereo 175. Probably makes sense. He has pre-amps and comps but no EQs. But I wish he'd do a more full featured EQ that could be used for more surgical work. To really get rid of in the box EQ, it seems to me you'd need something more along the lines of the Lil'Freq, that has the kind of flexibility a plugin EQ does.

He's rearranging the web site and so some of the demo videos aren't up there right now. But the 175 demo was pretty cool. If I was going to do another DIY comp project, that would be the one.