Analog Guy Needs Advice on Converters (huh?)

[mikecorwin]

I'm an all analog guy, I record to tape and mix through my console and various outboard compressors. I love recording and mixing this way, however whenever I'm done with a mix I do a transfer to Pro Tools so I can easily hand off the files to folks wanting .wav files. Here's the problem...the transfer sucks! I've got an 002 (yes, I know the converters are shit) and whenever I do the A>D transfer I instantly lose most of the low end, and everything starts sounding really peaky in the presence region. I'm finding I'm having to overcompensate in the 100-300hz region in the analog stage just to get the transfer to sound moderately better. I'm willing to get a 2 channel AD (I guess), but wanted to know which box does a great job retaining all the low-end information I'm getting from the tape machine/console/outboard. Sorry for the long winded rant, just finished a session today and everything seemed completely futile working in digital...

[mikecorwin]

And yes, I totally understand the importance of good converters, I've just been reluctant to spend 3k on converters since I'm all analog...what a fu#$ng conundrum!

[backindauk]

How much do you want to spend? $3000?

You could spend $1000 and get something very good like a Lavry Black or a Benchmark AD1

[Jay Kahrs]

This is a multitrack dump you're talking about? Dump from 2" 16 or whatever over to Toolz so the clients can walk away with multitracks?

My advice would be to bite the bullet and NOT get a 2-channel converter. The headaches involved with lining up the tracks will far exceed any sort of sonic shortcomings. Short of an Apogee or Lynx box, maybe ditch the 002 & get something entirely different. The presonus stuff isn't too bad... MOTU 24I/O is solid... RME... Or just get an 8 channel box, hang it off the Digi & send the money tracks through the good converters.

[glissando]

A good 2 ch converter is the UA 2192. That'll help your mixes retain a lot of tapy goodness...or Apogee rosetta...

[mikecorwin]

Thanks very much for the input, guys. Moose (to clarify), I'm basically just doing the final 2-track dump from my console into Pro Tools, so I can't really justify buying a Lynx or other 8-16 channel box (since I want to do everything analog anyway.) I pretty much know I have to get a good 2 ch set of AD/DA, I guess I'm just wanting to know what converters retain all the sonic qualities I'm getting in analog so it's not a night and day thing once I move everything in Pro Tools.

[mobius.media]

ya man try a ua2192. wish i had one.

[bcgood]

I would highly suggest you check out the Korg MR 2000S. Capture at 1 bit 5.6 MHz and then you can convert down to anything you want from there. It will retain a lot of the original tape goodness.

Korg - Product Details

[NYMo]

Hi there,

Yup....doing exactly the same thing but using a Korg MR 1000.

A/d isn't too bad...saw one on classifieds for $650

cheers

John NYMO Nyman

[deuc647]

Since you have a 002 already, why not just send it to BLA for their best mod job, i think it runs like 1200

[Jimbo]

Originally Posted by deuc647

Since you have a 002 already, why not just send it to BLA for their best mod job, i think it runs like 1200

But that mods the preamps as well, and it doesn't sound like he needs all that.

The BLA Sparrow goes for $650.
Black Lion Audio | Black Lion Audio Sparrow ADC

...might be worth checking out. They have a 15 day return policy, so you can see if it works for you.

(disclaimer: I'm not associated with BLA.)

[nas]

Mytek Stereo96 DAC. A superb converter for about $900

MYTEK DIGITAL USA

[kats]

I mix down from tape through a UA2192 and am very pleased with the results.

[Bassmankr]

All he needs is a really good 2 channel AD converter with ADAT lightpipe output from what he has said above. The lightpipe will feed into his Digi 002 and bypass the crap converters in it. So give him some suggestions that fits that requirement. I can't remember if the 002 has spdif in/optical spdif in also as that too would be a digital input option bypassing the Digi converters. There were some threads about a two channel Texas Instruments evalution AD converter board here that had the latest/greatest converter chips and Jim Williams was recomending it, do a search about it. It cost something like $150 but you had to add a power supply and box to it. That might be a cheap way to have a top quality 2 channel AD converter. I thought it had spdif out on it.

[The Byre]

How about a good, used Radar 24 or Classic?

If you get it with a session controller, you might end up not bothering to use the tape machine any more!

[Teddy Ray]

Originally Posted by nas

Mytek Stereo96 DAC. A superb converter for about $900

MYTEK DIGITAL USA

the Mytek Conversion has a really, really smooth, euphonic sound.

it will stand with anything out there. Id stake my life on it. (although hed need the stereo 192 ADC , not the DA..or the 8 x 192 ad/da

MYTEK DIGITAL USA

[mikecorwin]

Originally Posted by The Byre

How about a good, used Radar 24 or Classic?

If you get it with a session controller, you might end up not bothering to use the tape machine any more!

Ha, I was just researching Radars in case I ever really want to get into digital. Thanks everyone for the input, lots of good advice. I was mainly trying to figure out what analog guys in my situation were doing, and lots of folks have mentioned the 2192 as being solid and retaining a lot of the tape sound, so I'll definitely check that out.

[themaidsroom]

i would investigate the new iz radar converters
i am an all tape person and these are the only converters
that have really sounded great.



be well


- jack

[Jay Kahrs]

Originally Posted by mikecorwin

Thanks very much for the input, guys. Moose (to clarify), I'm basically just doing the final 2-track dump from my console into Pro Tools, so

I'm using an old Mytek stereo converter when I can... 44.1 & 48kHz only.

In terms of pure sonics, I haven't really found anything I like better that's not ludicrously expensive. Not even the Lavry stuff which is deadly accurate. I just love the tone of that thing. Apogee has a sound to it... you may or may not like it. The Black Lion mods are a waste of money. Better to get a new car, not just an overhaul...

You'll want to get an AD and DA though... monitor through the roundtrip, not unlike listening through the 2-track tape machine to hear what the transformers & saturation is doing.

[Teddy Ray]

oh yeah..

I want to say that I work on a Radar twice a week...Do not like the conversion on it..we much prefer the Mytek. Has a open but very pleasing "smooth" character.

[Duardo]

And yes, I totally understand the importance of good converters, I've just been reluctant to spend 3k on converters since I'm all analog...what a fu#$ng conundrum!

If you're a commercial studio, and you put the effort into maintaing an all-analog studio for sonic reasons, then I'm not sure why you'd want to compromise on this final step. I'd assume that your most common final delivery format is digital, and if that's the case this isn't a place to skimp...

If you normally deliver on two-track reel-to-reel tape and only use the digital system for rough references, though, I suppose it's not worth sinking much into.

[Doc Mixwell]

Originally Posted by mikecorwin

Ha, I was just researching Radars in case I ever really want to get into digital. Thanks everyone for the input, lots of good advice. I was mainly trying to figure out what analog guys in my situation were doing, and lots of folks have mentioned the 2192 as being solid and retaining a lot of the tape sound, so I'll definitely check that out.

If you need only higher quality 2-track Capture from your beloved analog deck/console, I would recommend that you demo the Burl B2 Bomber, as I think you will like the results with your PT rig for stereo masters. However, the Burl is ADC only, and I think having better DA for monitoring is also pretty important here, so checking out the 2192 seems fitting as well.

[Empire Prod]

The Lavry Gold sounds good.

[mikecorwin]

Sorry I didn't clarify...I'm not a commercial facility, I have an all analog home studio that I set up for my own purposes (I'm a working musician). I enjoy recording my other musician friends when I can, and that's primarily when I need to do the old transfer to PT so I can give them digital files. That's why it's hard for me to justify the expense, I guess. Adam, thanks for the advice on the Burl - I'll check it out. I dug the videos of your mixes on Mercenary's site, what is the name of your band that you were mixing?

[Doc Mixwell]

Originally Posted by mikecorwin

Sorry I didn't clarify...I'm not a commercial facility, I have an all analog home studio that I set up for my own purposes (I'm a working musician). I enjoy recording my other musician friends when I can, and that's primarily when I need to do the old transfer to PT so I can give them digital files. That's why it's hard for me to justify the expense, I guess. Adam, thanks for the advice on the Burl - I'll check it out. I dug the videos of your mixes on Mercenary's site, what is the name of your band that you were mixing?

Hey Mike,

That's actually a guy who sits next to me, Seaneldon, who no longer hangs out @ GS.

He's mixing, well.......Himself playing all the instruments.

[mikecorwin]

Ha! Sorry Adam, I was just there checking out the videos and must have made a mistake. Oh well, I thoroughly enjoy your reading your insights and opinions on gear nonetheless!

[Doc Mixwell]

Originally Posted by mikecorwin

Ha! Sorry Adam, I was just there checking out the videos and must have made a mistake. Oh well, I thoroughly enjoy your reading your insights and opinions on gear nonetheless!

No Harm No Foul, but I must suggest, that I am a lot more handsome than Seanyboy. Thanks for the kind words, they are very well received!