Guitar cab miking

[geektanic08]

amidoinitrite??

[j2dafo]

if the amp was cranked i bet the 57 would still be usable

[syntax]

Before you even think about mike position, try moving the amp away from the wall and changing the angle relative to the wall/door.

[Blewgrass]

Please post a correction when you get it right. This is a timely subject for me. I am trying to get the best sound from a smaller combo amp with a single 12 speaker.

I tried a few things.. like pointing the amp AT the wall and positioning the mic to receive the bounced signal from the wall. All the while with the amp tilted as well. Didn't sound much better than the straight micing. An empty studio room with treatments would be cool. Unfortunately I only have a living room to work with...

[Fletcher]

I wouldn't say "FAIL" so quickly... depends on the sound of the amp, the arrangement of the song, and the sense of aesthetic of the production team.

There is a "FAIL" floating around where a 421 is pointed at the wood of a Marshall head... that is indeed a "FAIL"... that picture isn't necessarily a "FAIL" until you've heard the sound coming from the control room.

Peace.

[norman_nomad]

They were going for more toob sound. Would have sounded better with a 121.

[dodgeaspen]

Keep trying. It can take years to learn some of this stuff.

[Jonboy79]

Originally Posted by norman_nomad

They were going for more toob sound. Would have sounded better with a 121.

Some people may laugh but I once had a guitar player stare at my Valve Jr. head for a good 5 minutes before asking me "how does the sound get through that leather stuff". I just about laughed my balls off.

[ryanojohn]

Hell if it sounds good it is good...
but that's a Marshall MG... So I can't imagine it sounds good period

[The Magic Hoof]

Maybe the guy is trying to use that extra 57 as a room mic, or something?

[Cameron Johnson]

Originally Posted by Fletcher

I wouldn't say "FAIL" so quickly... depends on the sound of the amp, the arrangement of the song, and the sense of aesthetic of the production team.

There is a "FAIL" floating around where a 421 is pointed at the wood of a Marshall head... that is indeed a "FAIL"... that picture isn't necessarily a "FAIL" until you've heard the sound coming from the control room.

Peace.

As usual, well said Fletcher!

[John Eppstein]

But seriously - You know I don't understand it, but over the last 20 years it seems that nobody knows how to properly mic a speaker anymore. The correct way, so as to get the full sound of the speaker, is to position the mic on the grill at the edge of the speaker but pointing toward the dome - in other words angled relative to the grille. That way the mic looks along the entire cone and gets a balanced tone off the entire speaker. (This is the typical '70s/early '80s British hard rock micing technique. These days it seems everybody positions the mic at right angles to the grille so you only get a "spot" tone off a small portion of the speaker - not balanced at all. Why? I dunno - I guess nobody bothers to think about how a speaker actually reproduces sound (Lows at the edge, Highs off the dome.....)

Take a flashlight and shine it alone the cone - that'll give you the correct angle. It's simple as hell if you actually think about it.

[Cameron Johnson]

Originally Posted by John Eppstein

But seriously - You know I don't understand it, but over the last 20 years it seems that nobody knows how to properly mic a speaker anymore. The correct way, so as to get the full sound of the speaker, is to position the mic on the grill at the edge of the speaker but pointing toward the dome - in other words angled relative to the grille. That way the mic looks along the entire cone and gets a balanced tone off the entire speaker. (This is the typical '70s/early '80s British hard rock micing technique. These days it seems everybody positions the mic at right angles to the grille so you only get a "spot" tone off a small portion of the speaker - not balanced at all. Why? I dunno - I guess nobody bothers to think about how a speaker actually reproduces sound (Lows at the edge, Highs off the dome.....)

Take a flashlight and shine it alone the cone - that'll give you the correct angle. It's simple as hell if you actually think about it.

Sometimes, getting that "full tone" isn't what's right for the song. It an definitely provide you with a more useable foundation, but it isn't always correct. I would much rather get a wonky tone via wonky micing to get "that sound" that's perfect for the song, rather than getting a "full tone" via the "correct way" and then trying to fix it with EQ later.

...PS - what does "correct way" even mean? This is audio, we're talking about here - rule number one is there are no rules!

[larry b]

Originally Posted by John Eppstein

The correct way, so as to get the full sound of the speaker, is to position the mic on the grill at the edge of the speaker but pointing toward the dome - in other words angled relative to the grille...

Oh, so there ARE rules to recording then?

Originally Posted by Cameron Johnson

Sometimes, getting that "full tone" isn't what's right for the song. It an definitely provide you with a more useable foundation, but it isn't always correct. I would much rather get a wonky tone via wonky micing to get "that sound" that's perfect for the song, rather than getting a "full tone" via the "correct way" and then trying to fix it with EQ later.

...PS - what does "correct way" even mean? This is audio, we're talking about here - rule number one is there are no rules!

Rules? We dont neeeeeed no steeenkin' rules!

I kid, i kid.

On a more serious note, i think its more on a cab-by-cab, or even speaker-by-speaker basis. This is what assistants are for. Give em some earplugs and tell em to get out there and move the mic around. I like to sit back and eat popcorn while i listen. I could care less what angle the mic is at or what distance it is from the cab. When i say stop, thats it. Mic stops and i have my sound.

[NS Stickman]

Beauty is in the ears of the beholder, not a predetermined mic angle!

[dr_love6977]

Originally Posted by ryanojohn

Hell if it sounds good it is good...
but that's a Marshall MG... So I can't imagine it sounds good period

Are you referring to the "FAIL" pic? Definitely not an MG. If you're referring to the OP's pic, I can't see it. Filter at work has blocked.

[Jack Ruston]

That 57 might sound amazing. There's often a point a few feet back where the ambience seems to dry up. It can have all the 'development' that the distance brings, while sounding like it's jammed up against the grille.

J

[mike kable]

On a slight tangent, Id love to know how people miked cabs back in the early seventies on classic albums from bands like Purple, Free, Lynard Skynard ect, these are great tones.

Mike

[Slikjmuzik]

I have no luck, almost ever, placing my ribbon any other way other than dead on, just inside the cone edge. If I turn toward the middle as suggested, the brighter back end of my R92 sometimes picks up from the rear, which I don't like. Now, my i5 or 421, angled, yes, almost always.

[cavern]

Originally Posted by mike kable

On a slight tangent, Id love to know how people miked cabs back in the early seventies on classic albums from bands like Purple, Free, Lynard Skynard ect, these are great tones.

Mike

those were also great amps and most importantly great players.
there is a ongoing sentiment on the fender forum "the tone is in the fingers"

[CapnMarvel]

Originally Posted by ryanojohn

Hell if it sounds good it is good...
but that's a Marshall MG... So I can't imagine it sounds good period

Guh. Yeah. Sometimes a Marshall is not a Marshall. tutt

[TheArchitect]

Originally Posted by cavern

those were also great amps and most importantly great players.
there is a ongoing sentiment on the fender forum "the tone is in the fingers"

That's a lovely sentiment they have but, until they come out with a USB finger interface we will still need mics and amps.. LOL

[That One Guy]

Hey geektanic089, here's my $0.02 (trying to keep it as focused/constructive as possible...)
First of all, as many have mentioned, the key is finding the right sound for the song. That said, there are a couple fo things (I'm not going to say "rules"...) to bare in mind.
First up, the room mic looks pretty close to the door/wall behind - this could lead to some serious colouration. Fine if you want it, but if not, definately consider moving the mic (and cab) away from there. Room sound is good, but I've found it to be more "aesthetically pleasing" when there is a significant delay between the source sound and the first reflection (that way the room reverb sounds more like reverb, not coloration).
Regarding the close mic, did you test all your speakers to see which sounds best? Sounds wierd but in most 4x12's there'll be inconsistencies in speaker quality. Just stick you head in really close and have a listen while someone plays (don't worry about hurting your ears; they're mostly for decoration )
Last point is, where are you aiming the close mic? (I can't see in the picture). Three (argh, i'm going to say it...) "Rules of Thumb"; mic at right angle to speaker, pointed at center=more agressive, brighter sound, mic at right angle, pointed at edge=more mellow sound, mic paralell to speaker cone=fuller, more honest tone. (caveate: I know; these are just generalizations!!!)
Hope these help! (Alright fellow GS's; go ahead and rip apart everything I just said!)

[andychamp]

Originally Posted by mike kable

On a slight tangent, Id love to know how people miked cabs back in the early seventies on classic albums from bands like Purple, Free, Lynard Skynard ect, these are great tones.

Mike

My guess is, they would use the best mic available.
So that would probably have been a Neumann LDC, or a Sennheiser 421 for dynamics, at least in european studios.
Americans would maybe gravitate towards the big RCAs or Altecs.

[CapnMarvel]

Originally Posted by andychamp

My guess is, they would use the best mic available.
So that would probably have been a Neumann LDC, or a Sennheiser 421 for dynamics, at least in european studios.
Americans would maybe gravitate towards the big RCAs or Altecs.

The Stones famously used RE-20s on their cabs during their golden hard rock years (Sticky Fingers, etc.). They also typically used Ampeg V-4 and SVT heads and cabs rather than Marshalls, Fenders, etc.