Tricks studios use to make more money - a workshop

Jules · 10th July 2005

OK

This one was invented by my current in house engineer and he puts it to good use.

Senario - Rock band wants to greedily go for too many tracks in too short a space of time (a common situation for us)

Solution - Rather than be driven into the ground and forced to work 18 hour days.. Suggest that you put down 4 basic live tracks tracks but only take 2 or 3 of them on to the 'overdub & mix' stage.

Result - studio timetable isn't ruined by engineer needing a weeks sleep to recover from a two day session, clients not leaving with poor mixes with stupid late night mistakes like tambourines WAY too loud.. Clients leave with good sounding work and come back when they can afford it to complete the overdubs & mix on the other songs.

Jules · 10th July 2005

I understand that studios with LARGE musical instrument / backline inventory do well as bands can run up a bill by 'experimenting'

"Yuk yuk.. lets see what this (new metal) tune sounds like with harpsichord dudes!"

recorderman · 10th July 2005

they need Producer's..left alone of course they'll make poor choices

themaidsroom · 10th July 2005

time agreements, when handled poorly, can make some
tricky vibes - someday someone will write "passive-aggressive behaviour
in the recording studio"

the session is supposed to end at 2:00 a.m.

at 2:15
you get the look.....as if you, the studio owner, are, father time

the groovy ones either leave 10 minutes early
or find some charming way
to bend the clock........

- jack

Mr. Victory · 11th July 2005

Funny,
I just worked an 18 hour day and I am not happy...

with the results or the lack of sleep. And it will take me a day too recuperate.

And it's all because they slave drove me into mixing too many songs in to short a time...

I don't mind working a little extra hard for a first time client, but otoh, I also don't want to set the wrong professional "tone" (read- I will work like a dog for you just because that's the kinda sucker I am)

I'm in the process of restructuring my rates as I rejuvenate!

opentune · 11th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jules

OK

This one was invented by my current in house engineer and he puts it to good use.

Senario - Rock band wants to greedily go for too many tracks in too short a space of time (a common situation for us)

Solution - Rather than be driven into the ground and forced to work 18 hour days.. Suggest that you put down 4 basic live tracks tracks but only take 2 or 3 of them on to the 'overdub & mix' stage.

I wouldn´t call this "a trick". I would call this "very responsible".

Most of the bands are very happy after finding out that their engineer (me)
acted the way you described above.

Got me?

Jules · 11th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr. Victory

Funny,
I just worked an 18 hour day and I am not happy...

with the results or the lack of sleep. And it will take me a day too recuperate.

And it's all because they slave drove me into mixing too many songs in to short a time...

I don't mind working a little extra hard for a first time client, but otoh, I also don't want to set the wrong professional "tone" (read- I will work like a dog for you just because that's the kinda sucker I am)

I'm in the process of restructuring my rates as I rejuvenate!

Yep this can be a REAL problem... problem with long hours can be..

Band sleeping on back couch - zero inspiration for the engineer tutt
Band meembers - "my ears have gone, I cant tell anymore' - awesome help...NOT

band members - session vibe all 'grumpy' as they wait for their CDR's - can be a shitty end to an epic session...

Jack Ruston · 11th July 2005

What IS it with young bands....?

1. Why cant they understand that recording and mixing a song doesn't simply take the time it takes to play the song once?

2. Why must they always lie and say 'yes' when you ask if they've rehearsed properly before the session?

3. Why must they insist that their drummer is 'amazing' and is 'obsessed' with drum tuning only then to have him turn up a battered Pearl Export featuring the same skins it was supplied with in 1832?

4. Why, oh why must they all be in the control room at the same time, all the time, especially when they're not needed for tracking that day?

5. And why, please god why, must they, while undergoing these marathon waiting sessions, when all I need is for them to keep cool and quiet, eat shed loads of evil looking and smelling 'food' containing previously unimaginable quantities of sugar and additives, that then makes them totally unable to sit still and shut up.

6. I love em all really.

Sorry, no trick here, just venting.

J

Jules · 11th July 2005

Death to celophane wrapped 'snacks'

About one out of 5 of the bands we get in have some suburban wanker kid in it who's total daily food ration is celophane wrapped and stored in a plastic bag - their mom bought them 'cheeezy dippers' / 'monster munchies' a pastie, cookies - EVERYTHING the moron eats invoves first wrestling off a celophane wrapper - making a insanely distracting noise behind my position in the control room - he then 'crunches' as he eats through his collection of radioactive E numbered nightmares (all for children with cartoon images on the packets) and rustles FURTHER each time the twit reaches into the packet to get another CRUNCHY F**KING SNACK to put in his idiot mouth.

What happens is, the bewildered musician experiences me snatching his snack packet from his hands, having his 'meal' dumped on a plate, handed back to him and the packet tossed to the trash so I can get on & mix their song in peace...

I have that down in one smooth Ninja movement, I can do it 'mid blink' so they never know what happened, or why their food is now on a plate they are holding

Er... whoops! Sorry... forgot my medication this morning...

Carry on!

Mr. Victory · 11th July 2005

Woah Jules, sounds like you've done what I did on Saturday more times than I'd like to know.

Mr Edit · 11th July 2005

I guess we've all had the lead singers girlfriend in the control room???

I need say no more....

thethrillfactor · 11th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Edit

I guess we've all had the lead singers girlfriend in the control room???

I need say no more....

If the girlfriend is hot never bothered me.

Especially when she brings her hot girlfriends along.

audioez · 11th July 2005

by reading all these posts I was inspired to add this:

I remember when I used to ride the bus to grammer school, how "in control" the good bus drivers were, and how they demanded respect, cause if you were some pecker head on the bus, the bus would come to a screaching halt and then usually some yelling followed or some sort of discipline.

Now I don't own a facility so when I'm working in a room, it's cause the client wants me to drive the buss per say. Any monkey business is not tolerated--Especially when were dealing with such "tight" budgets these days...

Drumsound · 11th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jules

Death to celophane wrapped 'snacks'

About one out of 5 of the bands we get in have some suburban wanker kid in it who's total daily food ration is celophane wrapped and stored in a plastic bag - their mom bought them 'cheeezy dippers' / 'monster munchies' a pastie, cookies - EVERYTHING the moron eats invoves first wrestling off a celophane wrapper - making a insanely distracting noise behind my position in the control room - he then 'crunches' as he eats through his collection of radioactive E numbered nightmares (all for children with cartoon images on the packets) and rustles FURTHER each time the twit reaches into the packet to get another CRUNCHY F**KING SNACK to put in his idiot mouth.

What happens is, the bewildered musician experiences me snatching his snack packet from his hands, having his 'meal' dumped on a plate, handed back to him and the packet tossed to the trash so I can get on & mix their song in peace...

I have that down in one smooth Ninja movement, I can do it 'mid blink' so they never know what happened, or why their food is now on a plate they are holding

Er... whoops! Sorry... forgot my medication this morning...

Carry on!

Best post ever!

Note to self, go buy paper plates.

11th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly

What IS it with young bands....?

1. Why cant they understand that recording and mixing a song doesn't simply take the time it takes to play the song once?

2. Why must they always lie and say 'yes' when you ask if they've rehearsed properly before the session?

3. Why must they insist that their drummer is 'amazing' and is 'obsessed' with drum tuning only then to have him turn up a battered Pearl Export featuring the same skins it was supplied with in 1832?

4. Why, oh why must they all be in the control room at the same time, all the time, especially when they're not needed for tracking that day?

5. And why, please god why, must they, while undergoing these marathon waiting sessions, when all I need is for them to keep cool and quiet, eat shed loads of evil looking and smelling 'food' containing previously unimaginable quantities of sugar and additives, that then makes them totally unable to sit still and shut up.

6. I love em all really.

Sorry, no trick here, just venting.

J

I think that they should be educated thusly: For every minute you play, it's going to take me 60 to fix and mix. So, if you want it quick, don't suck!

Fibes · 12th July 2005

I have a rule that i never mix after tracking, unless it's just a quick vocal overdub. Loud drums and loud guitars are draining just like the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders in a hot tub. Once the band hears the analogy, the lil Debbies are on them.

TML · 12th July 2005

Yes..."Best Post Ever"
I AGREE WITH JULES...BEEN THERE.....
Track drums to 4 tunes and start dubbing them one at a time...when thet run out of money...they'll have a couple tunes for showcases...or an ep for touring...majors want sales of 50,000 cd's...indies...far less.....you'll look like a boob if you kill yourself for these people and put out mediocre products....less is more.....the 16-22 yr old bands don't have a clue..sugar on top of A.D.D. not good...... Don't get me wrong..there are bands that are organized solid working units...but for every 1 there are 10 that aren't. Peace out.
Tim

gear is cool · 12th July 2005

I'm always upfront with my bands. I let them know how long it'll take to do what they want to do. Some ask how many songs can we record in a day, and I'll ask them "how tight are you guys". I always let them know the average about a day a song, some more some less. I don't allow food of any kind in the control room,
if I see them rolling in with a sandwich I ask them if they can to go to the lounge
and eat. When mixing I'm clear that I would like the time to get the mix to a place where I'm comfy, and then they can come in, and most if not all of the time I like to only have 1 band member , because it gets silly to have each guy or gal go to the next band mate and ask "what do you think" on and on. It only takes a few minutes to explain why things are the way they are, efficiency and their money/mix is at stake. What really bugs me is when the band member starts reminding me of things I'm going to get to such as "dont forget to spin a delay off off this part/solo/ tom rides etc" it's so distracting from what I'm already in the middle of , if they insist on being in the control room during the set up of a mix , I give them a pad of paper and ask them to write down everything they want to have happen and hand it to me when we are ready. Also I let them know that my ears stop working after 10-11 hrs. and so does the session. For the most part people are cool if you are cool to them, but then again every once in a while...

davemc · 12th July 2005

I do a lot of young bands.
Over the years I have been straight with them.
It will take this long to do what you want.
Unless you really are tight.
To many bands think beat detective and auto tune or some mystery one push button plugin will counter all there faults in seconds.

Problem is there is always a studio around who will cater and to them as the clock keeps running. So when I say you will only get this done in a day and the other studios say more. They go elsewhere.
Then spend and pay 4 times the amount.

Now I will mix with the band there.. I know I shouldn't a lot of time but i'll mix it as badly as they want it to be

All guitar all drums fine.. its your mix.
Although I try to enforce a two simple rules.
1) If you want to talk crap go into the lounge.
Normally have to repeat this 2-3 times..
2) Turn your mobile off. No SMSing all the time.
I mean I have had bands sms each other on the couch.. why..

Yeah food crunching gets annoying.
Chatter gets worse

Shan · 12th July 2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sly

5. And why, please god why, must they, while undergoing these marathon waiting sessions, when all I need is for them to keep cool and quiet, eat shed loads of evil looking and smelling 'food' containing previously unimaginable quantities of sugar and additives, that then makes them totally unable to sit still and shut up.

We have a 'No food allowed in the control room' policy. And we mean it! Use the kitchen and the lounge.

It ends up stinking for days

Shane

10th July 2005	#1
Jules Gearslutz.com admin Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: A Yank in London, UK Posts: 17,356 Thread Starter 1 Review written	Tricks studios use to make more money - a workshop OK This one was invented by my current in house engineer and he puts it to good use. Senario - Rock band wants to greedily go for too many tracks in too short a space of time (a common situation for us) Solution - Rather than be driven into the ground and forced to work 18 hour days.. Suggest that you put down 4 basic live tracks tracks but only take 2 or 3 of them on to the 'overdub & mix' stage. Result - studio timetable isn't ruined by engineer needing a weeks sleep to recover from a two day session, clients not leaving with poor mixes with stupid late night mistakes like tambourines WAY too loud.. Clients leave with good sounding work and come back when they can afford it to complete the overdubs & mix on the other songs. __________________ Jules Add your reviews to the new reviews area! Gearslutz on Facebook Follow my GS picks on Twitter

11th July 2005	#13
audioez Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: New York City Posts: 627	by reading all these posts I was inspired to add this: I remember when I used to ride the bus to grammer school, how "in control" the good bus drivers were, and how they demanded respect, cause if you were some pecker head on the bus, the bus would come to a screaching halt and then usually some yelling followed or some sort of discipline. Now I don't own a facility so when I'm working in a room, it's cause the client wants me to drive the buss per say. Any monkey business is not tolerated--Especially when were dealing with such "tight" budgets these days... __________________

12th July 2005	#16
Fibes Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Hell Posts: 545	I have a rule that i never mix after tracking, unless it's just a quick vocal overdub. Loud drums and loud guitars are draining just like the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders in a hot tub. Once the band hears the analogy, the lil Debbies are on them. __________________ Fibes "you can like it, or not like it."

12th July 2005	#19
davemc Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Melb, Australia Posts: 1,021	I do a lot of young bands. Over the years I have been straight with them. It will take this long to do what you want. Unless you really are tight. To many bands think beat detective and auto tune or some mystery one push button plugin will counter all there faults in seconds. Problem is there is always a studio around who will cater and to them as the clock keeps running. So when I say you will only get this done in a day and the other studios say more. They go elsewhere. Then spend and pay 4 times the amount. Now I will mix with the band there.. I know I shouldn't a lot of time but i'll mix it as badly as they want it to be All guitar all drums fine.. its your mix. Although I try to enforce a two simple rules. 1) If you want to talk crap go into the lounge. Normally have to repeat this 2-3 times.. 2) Turn your mobile off. No SMSing all the time. I mean I have had bands sms each other on the couch.. why.. Yeah food crunching gets annoying. Chatter gets worse __________________ Bye Ya Dave INDENT

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

10th July 2005	#3
recorderman Gear maniac Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: LA Posts: 259	they need Producer's..left alone of course they'll make poor choices

10th July 2005	#4
themaidsroom Lives for gear Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: nyc / london Posts: 3,510	time agreements, when handled poorly, can make some tricky vibes - someday someone will write "passive-aggressive behaviour in the recording studio" the session is supposed to end at 2:00 a.m. at 2:15 you get the look.....as if you, the studio owner, are, father time the groovy ones either leave 10 minutes early or find some charming way to bend the clock........ - jack

11th July 2005	#5
Mr. Victory Gear nut Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: LIC, NY Posts: 141	Funny, I just worked an 18 hour day and I am not happy... with the results or the lack of sleep. And it will take me a day too recuperate. And it's all because they slave drove me into mixing too many songs in to short a time... I don't mind working a little extra hard for a first time client, but otoh, I also don't want to set the wrong professional "tone" (read- I will work like a dog for you just because that's the kinda sucker I am) I'm in the process of restructuring my rates as I rejuvenate!

11th July 2005	#8
Jack Ruston Lives for gear Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Brighton UK Posts: 1,084	What IS it with young bands....? 1. Why cant they understand that recording and mixing a song doesn't simply take the time it takes to play the song once? 2. Why must they always lie and say 'yes' when you ask if they've rehearsed properly before the session? 3. Why must they insist that their drummer is 'amazing' and is 'obsessed' with drum tuning only then to have him turn up a battered Pearl Export featuring the same skins it was supplied with in 1832? 4. Why, oh why must they all be in the control room at the same time, all the time, especially when they're not needed for tracking that day? 5. And why, please god why, must they, while undergoing these marathon waiting sessions, when all I need is for them to keep cool and quiet, eat shed loads of evil looking and smelling 'food' containing previously unimaginable quantities of sugar and additives, that then makes them totally unable to sit still and shut up. 6. I love em all really. Sorry, no trick here, just venting. J

11th July 2005	#11
Mr Edit Gear nut Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: London Posts: 123	I guess we've all had the lead singers girlfriend in the control room??? I need say no more....

12th July 2005	#17
TML Lives for gear Join Date: Nov 2002 Posts: 1,026	Yes..."Best Post Ever" I AGREE WITH JULES...BEEN THERE..... Track drums to 4 tunes and start dubbing them one at a time...when thet run out of money...they'll have a couple tunes for showcases...or an ep for touring...majors want sales of 50,000 cd's...indies...far less.....you'll look like a boob if you kill yourself for these people and put out mediocre products....less is more.....the 16-22 yr old bands don't have a clue..sugar on top of A.D.D. not good...... Don't get me wrong..there are bands that are organized solid working units...but for every 1 there are 10 that aren't. Peace out. Tim

12th July 2005	#18
gear is cool Gear addict Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: seattle Posts: 339	I'm always upfront with my bands. I let them know how long it'll take to do what they want to do. Some ask how many songs can we record in a day, and I'll ask them "how tight are you guys". I always let them know the average about a day a song, some more some less. I don't allow food of any kind in the control room, if I see them rolling in with a sandwich I ask them if they can to go to the lounge and eat. When mixing I'm clear that I would like the time to get the mix to a place where I'm comfy, and then they can come in, and most if not all of the time I like to only have 1 band member , because it gets silly to have each guy or gal go to the next band mate and ask "what do you think" on and on. It only takes a few minutes to explain why things are the way they are, efficiency and their money/mix is at stake. What really bugs me is when the band member starts reminding me of things I'm going to get to such as "dont forget to spin a delay off off this part/solo/ tom rides etc" it's so distracting from what I'm already in the middle of , if they insist on being in the control room during the set up of a mix , I give them a pad of paper and ask them to write down everything they want to have happen and hand it to me when we are ready. Also I let them know that my ears stop working after 10-11 hrs. and so does the session. For the most part people are cool if you are cool to them, but then again every once in a while...

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
How to make money, or how to make MORE money - with a small / pro home studio	Jules	Expert Question & Answer Archives (read only archive, not open for new posts)	17	26th January 2005 11:45 AM
How to make money, or how to make MORE money - as a music publisher / studio owner	Jules	Expert Question & Answer Archives (read only archive, not open for new posts)	9	21st January 2005 01:38 PM
How to make money, or how to make MORE money - recording computer game music	Jules	Expert Question & Answer Archives (read only archive, not open for new posts)	3	17th January 2005 08:29 AM
How to make money, or how to make MORE money - doing ads & jingles	Jules	Expert Question & Answer Archives (read only archive, not open for new posts)	19	11th January 2005 04:05 AM
How to make money or make MORE money doing Sound Design / Foley	Jules	Expert Question & Answer Archives (read only archive, not open for new posts)	0	5th January 2005 01:19 PM