Irresponsible Producer.... How much is too much?

[Herman Munster]

I've got a 5 song demo project I've been trying to get started on for a local artist. The artist is young and has a friend of mine that has agreed to produce these tracks for him. It's a good call on the artist's part, BUT the producer has been slow to get started and I finally had to tell he and the artist that my price would go up if we didn't get started within a certain time period. Well, we started last night and the guy producing showed up almost 2 hours late.

My question is - have you as an engineer/studio owner, ever encouraged an artist to fire a producer? This kid seems determined to use this guy to produce, but I'm ready for him to go....

[narcoman]

he's not a producer. He's a "wannabe" producer....

If he WAS - the budget would be in his hands..... thankfully it's not.

Get him to book the hours, for that is his responsibility. Get him to sign off the invoices, for that is his responsibility too. When he turns up 2 hours late - he's paying for it. THAT is a producer. I know - it's what I do. Performance and sounds are but half the job.

I'm there first.

To add - it's kind of not your call... I understand you wanna look out for his kid - but if you're not producing, it's not your call.

The chain of responsibility is : client hires producer to record artist. Producer puts together price up and plan for recording, puts in a budget. Client pays producer or agrees fee.....Producer books studio and pays invoices. Producer hires engineer. Once client has hired producer - producer is boss. Client can fire producer nd if client happens to be artist - await ensuing argument.... cuz that's what ALWAYS happens. Any other arrangement - including a bloke coming in directing sonics - isn't a producer. Charge for your hours without regard to "producer" turning up.

[drBill]

Originally Posted by Herman Munster

I've got a 5 song demo project I've been trying to get started on for a local artist. The artist is young and has a friend of mine that has agreed to produce these tracks for him. It's a good call on the artist's part, BUT the producer has been slow to get started and I finally had to tell he and the artist that my price would go up if we didn't get started within a certain time period. Well, we started last night and the guy producing showed up almost 2 hours late.

My question is - have you as an engineer/studio owner, ever encouraged an artist to fire a producer? This kid seems determined to use this guy to produce, but I'm ready for him to go....

One word......


HOURLY!!!

[C.Judd Karn]

Charge Hourly, it will save your @#S period.

Also, get the client to arrange a FIRM time to start and let them know that you charge from that time, even if they are late.

And if you can, get a deposit. You can usually tell (of the idie/local folks) who you have to ask a deposit from.

I know this sounds harsh, but people will only get away with what you let them get away with.

Good luck, you'll be fine.
Chris

[voicegenius]

Originally Posted by C.Judd Karn

Charge Hourly, it will save your @#S period.

Also, get the client to arrange a FIRM time to start and let them know that you charge from that time, even if they are late.

And if you can, get a deposit. You can usually tell (of the idie/local folks) who you have to ask a deposit from.

I know this sounds harsh, but people will only get away with what you let them get away with.

Good luck, you'll be fine.
Chris

+1 I bet if you do that, his ass won't be late anymore...

[Darth Preamp]

Unfortunately, the market for studios is TOTALLY staurated, i.e. there is tons of competition. This means that you might have to put up with someone like the producer you described. I've learned to handle all sorts of TOTALLY bizarre behavior since getting into this business, I suppose it makes me a better person ?! But probably not. It definitely raises my blood pressure.

D

[bgrotto]

Ugh. It's those kinds of "producers" that give us professionals a bad name, and encourage potential clients to work by themselves in their home's basements with their Mboxes...

Is the "kid" artist really a "kid"? Are you a relative "grown up"? If so, it's likely at some point the kid's insecurities will get the better of him and he'll tap you for some of your experience on the situation. At that point, assuming the producer has continued to do a half-assed job, I'd say go ahead and spill the beans! In fact, PLEASE go ahead and spill the beans.

Every year, I do a small handful of records for artists, usually not in bands, who have had a recent terrible experience in the studio. It's always the last recording they did, and the producer stiffed em, the engineer sucked, and they were pushed to do things they hated. Then, the mixes were crappy and the mastering was half-assed. These poor souls start to assume that's what recording really is like, and they start to think they need mega-budgets to produce something that sounds half-decent. It's a total drag! I like to make it a point to show them just how much fun (or, at the very least, how painless) the studio can be, and help them understand that their previous experience was NOT the way the industry typically works; they just got stuck with a couple of hacks.

To that end, I think if you're given the opportunity to let the kid know the ropes -without jeopardizing your own professional reputation or ethics - you should absolutely do so, before that half-assed wannabe producer ruins the recording process for yet another young artist.

[TheRealRoach]

You said in your original post that the producer is a friend of yours. At that point I would just get rid of the dude as it's not a purely professional relationship anyway.

You have every right to advise the artist if you feel strongly about it, after all, your name is going to be on that record as well. Nothing should stand in the way of high/professional standards.

[thenoiseflower]

You gotta do the project. SO, help this guy understand what he's suppose to be doing to ensure the project goes well.
If he is a friend you can just talk to him right. Hopefuly he will understand and realize whether or not he wants to be a part of the creative process, as the "producer". or what not.
People gotta want to be a part of it to not take away from it, y'know what i mean.